Kirk in Minnesota long term?

He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Patience required.

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Next year is the draft pool to dip a toe into. There's 4-5 prospects worth a shot. Plus another handful of guys who could jump up a tier.

Patience required.

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

So many huge contracts have been given out to QBs who really haven't answered the biggest question: "can he play QB at a high level in the NFL?" So many were just projections. Goff, Wentz, Carr, Foles, Kaepernick, Darnold, Mayfield...

With Cousins, there's no projection. You know exactly what you're going to get. Top 10 QB play. And he's not going to get hurt. That kind of confidence is worth something. 

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Next year is the draft pool to dip a toe into. There's 4-5 prospects worth a shot. Plus another handful of guys who could jump up a tier.

Patience required.

I'm on the fence because I do like Kirk, but his record is his record and do we want to lock up our cap for the foreseeable future on a 34 year old QB who is not widely considered to be an elite player at his position? Kirk's made a lot of money in his career and we've paid him a lot of money in Minnesota. If he isn't willing to play ball on a reasonable contract restructure then I do believe the best thing to do is trade him and let Kwesi and O'Connell build this roster the way they want with the cap flexibility and draft picks to do so. Like I said in the other thread, if we have to take a step back this season to move forward beyond mediocrity long term, you do it because that's what this entire organizational reboot is about right... moving beyond mediocrity. 

To me 5 more years of Kirk is not much different than if we were getting 5 more years of Zim, or Rick. If you compare Kirk’s first 4 years in MIN with those 2 guys’ first 4 years in MIN, all 3 experienced some success and had obvious weak spots. Zim and Rick got more time and it didnt pan out. At all. Kirk could be different but I would rather not see this franchise hitch their wagon to that hope. But if they do I’ll root like heck they’re right. 

I don't see a guy who has coached Cousins for 3 years thinking he is the long term solution for this team.  I would be surprised if he is the starter this year, I think they either make a trade or draft someone in the first round.  

At 33 Kirk has been durable but with age he becomes more susceptible to injury and who knows, he could hit the wall at 35 or 36 and become a liability.  The guy that plays at a high level into their 40's are the exception and not the norm.  Kirk could also be one of those guys that just says enough is enough and hang it up in his mid 30's for all we know.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Dunno, but at 33 age shouldn't be a factor. Remember, the QBs who play a long time (Brady, Favre) tend to be the QBs who avoid injury. Cousins has never missed a game due to injury. He's 11 years younger than Tom Brady. 

So many huge contracts have been given out to QBs who really haven't answered the biggest question: "can he play QB at a high level in the NFL?" So many were just projections. Goff, Wentz, Carr, Foles, Kaepernick, Darnold, Mayfield...

With Cousins, there's no projection. You know exactly what you're going to get. Top 10 QB play. And he's not going to get hurt. That kind of confidence is worth something. 

kirk has had 4 years, and what difference has he made...None.
I’m hoping we can make a good trade for Cousins.
And see what our coaching staff comes up with for a bridge.

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Next year is the draft pool to dip a toe into. There's 4-5 prospects worth a shot. Plus another handful of guys who could jump up a tier.

Patience required.

@"JR44" said: I don't see a guy who has coached Cousins for 3 years thinking he is the long term solution for this team.  I would be surprised if he is the starter this year, I think they either make a trade or draft someone in the first round.  

Vikings will either keep Cousins or trade him for a bridge and some picks. Even that is becoming less and less likely IMO. 

@"Greylock" said: At 33 Kirk has been durable but with age he becomes more susceptible to injury and who knows, he could hit the wall at 35 or 36 and become a liability.  The guy that plays at a high level into their 40's are the exception and not the norm.  Kirk could also be one of those guys that just says enough is enough and hang it up in his mid 30's for all we know.

But in my experience, especially as a player in high school and college, players who are injury prone are prone to injury and players who never get hurt just never get hurt.  

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Next year is the draft pool to dip a toe into. There's 4-5 prospects worth a shot. Plus another handful of guys who could jump up a tier.

Patience required.

I'd feel much better drafting a guy in '23, knowing Cousins is our QB for a few more years, and knowing we can give the kid some time to develop. At least a year. If he turns out, you can always trade Cousins then.  

Yes, I'm defending the incumbent, again...but part of that will always come from memories of us being the aging QBs' "last chance team" at not-quite making it. The slew of not-quite-retired QBs was very hard on the Vikings fan wondering about the team's future.

The argument about "knowing what we have with Kirk" is kinda hollow, as he did have a revolving door of OCs, a line that never cracked the top 20, and a HC that honestly may have loved screens as much as Leslie Frazier did ("I'll check the tape"-LF).  As has been pointed out, Zimmer would stubbornly run Cook straight into the DTs for two straight downs and let KC sort out the resulting 3rd and 13 all too often...and/or pump the brakes on the offense once we got any sort of lead.

We haven't seen Cousins, Jefferson, Thielen, etc in an AMBITIOUS offense together, yet...which is an amazing thought, at least to me.  That's what I'm hoping to witness this season, among many other things.

@"Zanary" said: Yes, I'm defending the incumbent, again...but part of that will always come from memories of us being the aging QBs' "last chance team" at not-quite making it. The slew of not-quite-retired QBs was very hard on the Vikings fan wondering about the team's future.

The argument about "knowing what we have with Kirk" is kinda hollow, as he did have a revolving door of OCs, a line that never cracked the top 20, and a HC that honestly may have loved screens as much as Leslie Frazier did ("I'll check the tape"-LF).  As has been pointed out, Zimmer would stubbornly run Cook straight into the DTs for two straight downs and let KC sort out the resulting 3rd and 13 all too often...and/or pump the brakes on the offense once we got any sort of lead.

We haven't seen Cousins, Jefferson, Thielen, etc in an AMBITIOUS offense together, yet...which is an amazing thought, at least to me.  That's what I'm hoping to witness this season, among many other things.

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"JustinTime18™" said:

@"Vikergirl" said: He is 33, so what 3 or 4 more years? Are they going to a five year deal with voidable years and restructure money to bonuses to help? I don't know, we'll see I guess. But I still want them developing a qb of the future.

Next year is the draft pool to dip a toe into. There's 4-5 prospects worth a shot. Plus another handful of guys who could jump up a tier.

Patience required.

I'd feel much better drafting a guy in '23, knowing Cousins is our QB for a few more years, and knowing we can give the kid some time to develop. At least a year. If he turns out, you can always trade Cousins then.  

After the top two, I'm really starting to like Levis, Van Dyke, and Richardson on the next tier. Hopefully by the end on 2022, they are all on par. Levis is the most intriguing to me. Cannon arm, size, can run, prototypical size.  By next fall, he might be the #2 guy. 

I am hopeful that the new coaching staff will make the most of Cousins and elevate the OL and defense.

@"pattersaur" said:

@"Zanary" said: Yes, I'm defending the incumbent, again...but part of that will always come from memories of us being the aging QBs' "last chance team" at not-quite making it. The slew of not-quite-retired QBs was very hard on the Vikings fan wondering about the team's future.

The argument about "knowing what we have with Kirk" is kinda hollow, as he did have a revolving door of OCs, a line that never cracked the top 20, and a HC that honestly may have loved screens as much as Leslie Frazier did ("I'll check the tape"-LF).  As has been pointed out, Zimmer would stubbornly run Cook straight into the DTs for two straight downs and let KC sort out the resulting 3rd and 13 all too often...and/or pump the brakes on the offense once we got any sort of lead.

We haven't seen Cousins, Jefferson, Thielen, etc in an AMBITIOUS offense together, yet...which is an amazing thought, at least to me.  That's what I'm hoping to witness this season, among many other things.

I completely agree with your last paragraph and do admit that for a 10-years vet Kirk does have some upside. I’m just not willing to risk a 5 year top of the market deal to see if said upside materializes. It’s a huge risk.