Kirk in Minnesota long term?
I hope so. I'm not yet convinced but I do now think a long-term contract is more likely than a trade. But what happens if some team offers the moon? "A man is as faithful as his options" is a great line. And so, so true.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nflvideos/garafolo-theres-a-real-long-term-possibility-for-kirk-cousins-in-minnesota/vi-AAUjelq
“A gentleman is someone who can play the accordion, but doesn't." - Tom Waits
@"purplefaithful" said:@"pattersaur" said:@"Havoc1649" said: With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams. We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.I dont get the point; Brady and The Bucs lost ZERO to 9 to the Saints at home in 12/21 too...
Vikings get an even average D? I think they're absolutely a contender for a dance spot in post season NFC.
If my uncle had tits he’d be my aunt.It’s the NFL. Every fanbase can rationalize how close they are. The Vikings are very far away.
@"pattersaur" said:Cincinati went from worst to first in the AFC in two years. We’re always in play.@"Havoc1649" said: With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams. We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.
@"AGRforever" said:2 key differences.They have a stud QB and they aren't paying him 35 million a year.@"pattersaur" said:Cincinati went from worst to first in the AFC in two years. We’re always in play.@"Havoc1649" said: With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams. We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.
@"JimmyinSD" said:^@"AGRforever" said:2 key differences.They have a stud QB and they aren't paying him 35 million a year.@"pattersaur" said:Cincinati went from worst to first in the AFC in two years. We’re always in play.@"Havoc1649" said: With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams. We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.
@"JimmyinSD" said:In the last 20 some years, there have 2 QBs who've won a Super Bowl on their 1st contract. Russell Wilson in his 2nd season and Patrick Mahomes in his 3rd. From Stafford to Brady to Manning to Brees, every other championship has been won by a team with a veteran QB getting paid among the top QBs in the NFL.@"AGRforever" said:2 key differences.They have a stud QB and they aren't paying him 35 million a year.@"pattersaur" said:Cincinati went from worst to first in the AFC in two years. We’re always in play.@"Havoc1649" said: With a good defense and our current offense with Cousins can absolutely win a Super Bowl. Cousins is freaking unflappable. That is really hard to find. He’s also one of the toughest QB’s in the league. The guy still gets hurt, he just plays through it. He had a stretch towards the end of this year where he played with a bad shoulder for 3 games or so. The guy just keeps grinding.I don’t know who else watched the SuperBowl, but in my opinion, if we had the defense, we could have beat either of those teams. We have a great opportunity to strengthen our defense with good corners and awesome edge defenders available this year. I’m all about winning this coming year. If some cap space can get cleared, this team can see good improvement all around through development and bringing in a couple of guys.Our offense is so good that we scored 7 points at home against the CLEVELAND BROWNS. Dude. I’m not trying to be negative I swear but we are a long ways away from a Super Bowl.
@"JustinTime18™" said: https://twitter.com/i/status/1498085319396134913Exactly like this. Sports fans in a nutshell.
@"purplefaithful" said:Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.
When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
Quit making sense will yah?
@"purplefaithful" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
Quit making sense will yah?
More time with Kirk is more wasted time for the franchise, fool's gold for the new HC/GM, and a potential job killer for both. Don't extend him, don't do it fellers, trade him now while you've got offers and options! There are some potential franchise qb's in the 2023 draft, start positioning for it now. The time to get away with sucking is when you're brand new and the honeymoon is on. You waste another few years with Kirk, there won't likely be more years to waste after that for the HC/GM.
@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
But if the plan is to draft the QBOTF in the 23 draft, doesn't it make sense to trade KC for picks which will allow you the ammo to move into the top 10 to draft that QB?
@"Knucklehead" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
But if the plan is to draft the QBOTF in the 23 draft, doesn't it make sense to trade KC for picks which will allow you the ammo to move into the top 10 to draft that QB?
I'd also be really curious to hear the new regime's thoughts on Mond. That might have some bearing on the direction they take this offseason as well. It's really too bad that Zimmer wouldn't play him at the end of the season, either in GB or at home against Chicago. It's not like that last game really had any bearing on his job status after they were destroyed in GB with Mannion.
@"MarkSP18" said: Teams that Cousins has been the starter for have made the playoffs 2 times in 7 years and never consecutively. But there are always excuses.The offensive line, the defense, the coaching, the scheme, etc.
At the end of the day, the playoff appearances is on his resume forever.
It would be asinine for the current regime to invest multiple additional years in this dude that for one reason or another, doesn't get his team to the playoffs.
Matthew Stafford made the playoffs three times in his first12 years. The Stafford "excuses" as you put it were coaching, defense, oline, and scheme. Amazing what happened when he went to a team that paid attention to the OL, put him in a position scheme wise to win and had a good defense.
@"bigbone62" said: Matthew Stafford made the playoffs three times in his first12 years. The Stafford "excuses" as you put it were coaching, defense, oline, and scheme. Amazing what happened when he went to a team that paid attention to the OL, put him in a position scheme wise to win and had a good defense.Not sure why everyone keeps comparing the two, they are nothing alike at all, Cousins does not have the leadership, passion for the game and moxie that Stafford has, they are two totally different sets of intangibles.
@"SFVikingFan" said:@"Knucklehead" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
But if the plan is to draft the QBOTF in the 23 draft, doesn't it make sense to trade KC for picks which will allow you the ammo to move into the top 10 to draft that QB?
I'd also be really curious to hear the new regime's thoughts on Mond. That might have some bearing on the direction they take this offseason as well. It's really too bad that Zimmer wouldn't play him at the end of the season, either in GB or at home against Chicago. It's not like that last game really had any bearing on his job status after they were destroyed in GB with Mannion.
which is exactly why Zimmer should have been fired long before he was, did anybody think Zimmer was going to do anything positive for the teams future down the stretch, especially if it might end up helping his replacement? no, so as soon as the season's direction was decided he should have been shown the door. ( and I would say the direction was decided long before it was over mathematically.) it was the zimmer until the end IMO is what sealed Spielmans fate as well, the GM should have been pushing Zim out the door in November so that some of those draft picks could have been better evaluated.
@"JR44" said:Because the things that get these guys paid they are incredibly similar. Statistically and the W-L record people like you love to live and die by. But those things are tangible, not these rah rah 1970's old ball coach categories you just crapped out. If they are intangibles how do you know Cousins doesn't have those things? Wait, wait, dont tell me. The ole eye test, LOL! Next thing I know you'll be talking intestinal fortitude. Moxie? For the love of God are we talking NFL in 2022 or am I trapped in an inspirational story about a poverty stricken school district in the south beating the rich school district in the 1960's?@"bigbone62" said: Matthew Stafford made the playoffs three times in his first12 years. The Stafford "excuses" as you put it were coaching, defense, oline, and scheme. Amazing what happened when he went to a team that paid attention to the OL, put him in a position scheme wise to win and had a good defense. Not sure why everyone keeps comparing the two, they are nothing alike at all, Cousins does not have the leadership, passion for the game and moxie that Stafford has, they are two totally different sets of intangibles.
@"JR44" said:Ring a bell? Now, let me stress this, Matthew Stafford is not a bad quarterback by any means. In fact he is a good quarterback, teammate and leader for the Lions. Yet, that only gets you so far in the NFL. Just ask Randall Cunningham, Jim Kelly and Dan Marino. All great quarterbacks who never could win a Super Bowl.@"bigbone62" said: Matthew Stafford made the playoffs three times in his first12 years. The Stafford "excuses" as you put it were coaching, defense, oline, and scheme. Amazing what happened when he went to a team that paid attention to the OL, put him in a position scheme wise to win and had a good defense. Not sure why everyone keeps comparing the two, they are nothing alike at all, Cousins does not have the leadership, passion for the game and moxie that Stafford has, they are two totally different sets of intangibles.This isn’t an attack on Stafford either. He is statically at times a great quarterback, yet the other times when he is bad he is well, bad. Midway through November the Detroit Lions saw this “at times bad” Stafford.https://detroitjockcity.com/2015/01/07/detroit-lions-wont-win-super-bowl-matthew-stafford/
I was going to go looking for my post that had a last 120 games started by both Stafford and Cousins comparisons. And then I remembered presenting facts had little impact on fact resistant humanoids.
So, here's this instead.
@"Knucklehead" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"purplefaithful" said:Signing on with Cousins for five more campaigns is bold, rest assured. He’s a divisive player, so about 20% of the Vikings fanbase would sour on Adofo-Mensah and O’Connell – like instantly – if Cousins was inked for five more hurrahs. Yet, these are fresh eyes and minds on the scene. The Wilfs hired who they considered the best and brightest. If the twosome wants to extend Cousins for a long time – or trade him elsewhere – one should probably afford the benefit of the doubt.Yeah, let's take a FAN poll before making a decision. LOL.When it comes right down to it, and you weigh the ups and downs of all the options, a long-term extension with void years is probably the best. It allows us to add a few pieces to the defense and compete for a title in '22 and '23. Trade a player for a '23 pick, trade down in '22 for a '23 pick. Do whatever you have to do to maneuver into a high pick in '23. Draft the QB then. If you miss, you still have Cousins. If you hit, Cousins can be traded or voided.
But if the plan is to draft the QBOTF in the 23 draft, doesn't it make sense to trade KC for picks which will allow you the ammo to move into the top 10 to draft that QB?
Yes, if you don't want or plan to be competitive in '22. It sounds like the team, from ownership to the coaching staff, thinks they can be. I agree. But we'll find out soon enough what they REALLY think. Personally, I think our best chance to win a championship in the next five years is with Kirk Cousins at the helm.But to hedge that bet, it would be a good idea to target '23 as the year to draft the QBOTF. But it doesn't necessarily require a Cousins trade to do that. They can trade Hunter or Harry or Kendricks or Bradbury or Thielen or Dalvin. Some are worth a lot; some are worth a little, but any of them would bring additional ammo. You can also trade #12 down for a '23 pick. You can also trade the '22 2nd rounder for a '23 1st. You can also trade future picks once we get to '23. All of these would be preferable to trading the starting QB, leaving Cook, JJ and company to slag through a couple seasons with a bridge QB and/or a rookie.
Because the truth remains that you don't know what you're going to get when you take a QB in the draft, even in the 1st round. Great if he's Herbert or Allen, but the odds say it's far more likely he's Tua, Love, Jones, Haskins, Mayfield, Darnold, Rosen, Wentz, Goff, Mariota, Winston, etc....
I'm convinced the Vikings would never trade their top 10 QB who's never hurt for what's behind door number 3. That's a good way to get yourself fired. But what they MIGHT do is keep Cousins, extend him, add void years, THEN draft what's behind the door. That way, if you hit, you trade Cousins for picks then. If you don't, you still have a top 10 QB who's never hurt.
I think the biggest difference between the opinions on the board about what to do divide among those who think this is a talented roster and let's find out what a new coach, new schemes and a couple of new starters can do...and those who think we're "far away" and should rebuild. I don't understand the 2nd group, but I know there are those who think that.
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