Free Agency
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2024-free-agent-rankings-free-agency
Here is PFF's list of the top 150 available free agents this offseason. The Vikings definitely should be more active and if I was Kwesi, I'd always be looking at high upside guys coming off their rookie contracts (Winfield, Javon Kinlaw, etc).
I will mention one name being rumored the Vikings might take a run at (no pun intended) is Derrick Henry. Might be an interesting fit at this point in his career.
@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
Well as you've pointed out, we are stuck with the Wilfs competitive rebuild mandate, which to me looks like a recipe for slowly sinking to the bottom of the NFCN.The other issue is KOC's in-game shortcomings. He needs to be a CEO/motivator hc and let specialists do their thing in-game. Since his 8-1 start which was entirely based on motivating guys and being the antithesis of Miserable Mike Zimmer, he's treading water and failing to improve.
That's a really bad sign for a green hc imo. Guys who go to the podium every week and tell us how they are responsible and have to fix things and do better are guys who are out of a job sooner or later.
@"comet52" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
Well as you've pointed out, we are stuck with the Wilfs competitive rebuild mandate, which to me looks like a recipe for slowly sinking to the bottom of the NFCN.The other issue is KOC's in-game shortcomings. He needs to be a CEO/motivator hc and let specialists do their thing in-game. Since his 8-1 start which was entirely based on motivating guys and being the antithesis of Miserable Mike Zimmer, he's treading water and failing to improve.
That's a really bad sign for a green hc imo. Guys who go to the podium every week and tell us how they are responsible and have to fix things and do better are guys who are out of a job sooner or later.
I think KOC knows more than anyone that he needs a good QB to run his offense. The offense destroyed GB when Kirk went down. They were really starting to click and looked like they were going to go on a nice win streak.The QB play was so poor after KC got hurt, I'm thinking it was the execution of KOC's plays that hurt the team every bit as much (if not more) as the play calling.
@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
It's great to have cap space. But it's not like there is even a slight correlation between NFL cap space ranking and NFL power rankings. Browns and Jets have been top five in cap space for like the last 5 years in a row. It's all about the QB. It's ALL about the QB.
The Bears draft a good QB they could be really good in '24. They don't, no amount of cap space is going to make a difference.
@"comet52" said:Lets parse this out some:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
Well as you've pointed out, we are stuck with the Wilfs competitive rebuild mandate, which to me looks like a recipe for slowly sinking to the bottom of the NFCN.The other issue is KOC's in-game shortcomings. He needs to be a CEO/motivator hc and let specialists do their thing in-game. Since his 8-1 start which was entirely based on motivating guys and being the antithesis of Miserable Mike Zimmer, he's treading water and failing to improve.
That's a really bad sign for a green hc imo. Guys who go to the podium every week and tell us how they are responsible and have to fix things and do better are guys who are out of a job sooner or later.
In 2022 they had the 8-1 start, they went 13/4. That's hardly fall on your face and in spite of a bottom feeder D.
They started off cold in 23, but were clearly on the upswing by the time they won in Lamblow and lost Cousins. I believe they just rattled off 4 or 5 W's in a row.
No doubt he's got his opportunity areas as does any lesser experienced HC in the NFL.
KOC gets a pass for me from last year, for the reasons you chose to ignore. It would have been very easy for him to hide behind 4 different QB's, No JJ etc...
The fact that he put a lot of the blame on himself and didn't use the injury excuses speaks to his character.
Choosing to paint that as a weakness (or a character flaw) is a bit of a head-scratcher.
@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
And with a great trade they will be taking one of the best QBs to come out in some time with the #1 pick, Poles has taken a lot grief, but the Bears are in really great shape to put together a really exciting young team.
@"purplefaithful" said:@"comet52" said:Lets parse this out some:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
Well as you've pointed out, we are stuck with the Wilfs competitive rebuild mandate, which to me looks like a recipe for slowly sinking to the bottom of the NFCN.The other issue is KOC's in-game shortcomings. He needs to be a CEO/motivator hc and let specialists do their thing in-game. Since his 8-1 start which was entirely based on motivating guys and being the antithesis of Miserable Mike Zimmer, he's treading water and failing to improve.
That's a really bad sign for a green hc imo. Guys who go to the podium every week and tell us how they are responsible and have to fix things and do better are guys who are out of a job sooner or later.
In 2022 they had the 8-1 start, they went 13/4. That's hardly fall on your face and in spite of a bottom feeder D.
They started off cold in 23, but were clearly on the upswing by the time they won in Lamblow and lost Cousins. I believe they just rattled off 4 or 5 W's in a row.
No doubt he's got his opportunity areas as does any lesser experienced HC in the NFL.
KOC gets a pass for me from last year, for the reasons you chose to ignore. It would have been very easy for him to hide behind 4 different QB's, No JJ etc...
The fact that he put a lot of the blame on himself and didn't use the injury excuses speaks to his character.
Choosing to paint that as a weakness (or a character flaw) is a bit of a head-scratcher.
He doesn't have the strategic skills to be his own OC or in-game manager and it shows in the 12-14 record since that hot start, which happened imo for the reasons I stated. After the initial bump from motivation and fresh air, you have to impact the game and the team in the x's and o's department or else hire guys who can. At least he moved off Donatell (though unfortunately too late to maybe beat a lousy Giants team in the playoffs) and onto Flores.I don't paint anything as a character flaw, I simply state a fact. Coaches who constantly have to apologize post-game for bad performances (not to mention some of his head-scratcher in-game moves) are the coaches who end up fired sooner or later. And he did a lot of that this year.
@"JR44" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
And with a great trade they will be taking one of the best QBs to come out in some time with the #1 pick, Poles has taken a lot grief, but the Bears are in really great shape to put together a really exciting young team.
That's the big difference is there was a clear direction and a clear plan to rebuild that roster in Chicago. They took their lumps the last couple years to be in the position they are now, and that's an ascending team with a shit ton of options. They have a football man in place making the decisions and overseeing this rebuild. I would bet anybody that he took the Bears job over ours for these very reasons and not having to deal with the competitive mandates of ownership and we ended up with a analytics stooge with almost zero real football experience. Is what it is...
@"purplefaithful" said:@"comet52" said:Lets parse this out some:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"HappyViking" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
Just curious, what's your view of the draft two years ago when the Vikes traded back with both the Lions and Packers? How about the draft picks of Cine and Booth, and your overall feelings of Kwesi? I'm not sure anyone has heard your view points on these topics yet. B)
It's just pointing out the contrast between the two philosophies and we have two organizations within the same division who hit the reset buttons on new front offices at the same time, so you can make a valid comparison. If you are asking me today, which organization did things the wisest and which situation and resources I'd rather have...it would be the Bears all day long. I say this knowing Kwesi has all but been saddled with the competitive mandates of the Wilfs, so you can't blame him completely
You also have to consider the loss of Cousins when comparing. The entire upside of the "competitive" rebuild was gone when KC's season ended. I think the Vikes would've been a playoff team if they didn't lose their starting QB. I suppose they could've started the "fire sale" immediately after KC got hurt by trading off players, but they wanted to still try to make the playoffs.
I think it's unknown if we would have made the playoffs if Cousins wasn't injured. First reaction would be yes, but then again we were only 3-4 with him including that abysmal home loss to the Chargers where they tried to gift wrap us the game and we wouldn't let them.But again, my comment was more directed at the the contrast in the different rebuild philosophies between the two franchises. Going into year 3 under the new regimes, which team is better positioned at becoming long term contenders? Any non biased fan would say it's the Bears.
Well as you've pointed out, we are stuck with the Wilfs competitive rebuild mandate, which to me looks like a recipe for slowly sinking to the bottom of the NFCN.The other issue is KOC's in-game shortcomings. He needs to be a CEO/motivator hc and let specialists do their thing in-game. Since his 8-1 start which was entirely based on motivating guys and being the antithesis of Miserable Mike Zimmer, he's treading water and failing to improve.
That's a really bad sign for a green hc imo. Guys who go to the podium every week and tell us how they are responsible and have to fix things and do better are guys who are out of a job sooner or later.
In 2022 they had the 8-1 start, they went 13/4. That's hardly fall on your face and in spite of a bottom feeder D.
They started off cold in 23, but were clearly on the upswing by the time they won in Lamblow and lost Cousins. I believe they just rattled off 4 or 5 W's in a row.
No doubt he's got his opportunity areas as does any lesser experienced HC in the NFL.
KOC gets a pass for me from last year, for the reasons you chose to ignore. It would have been very easy for him to hide behind 4 different QB's, No JJ etc...
The fact that he put a lot of the blame on himself and didn't use the injury excuses speaks to his character.
Choosing to paint that as a weakness (or a character flaw) is a bit of a head-scratcher.
How does KOC get a pass for 2023? Starting 1-4 losing the home opener to Baker and the Bucs, and barely winning vs the lowly Panthers. All 4 losses (Bucs, Chargers, Eagles, Chiefs,) were easily winnable.
Through the 2023 season KOC has shown everyone that he does not have the killer instinct and he goes ultra conservative with the game on the line like, for one, the end of the Bengals game.
KOC gets an "F" for 2023.
@"supafreak84" said:@"JR44" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
And with a great trade they will be taking one of the best QBs to come out in some time with the #1 pick, Poles has taken a lot grief, but the Bears are in really great shape to put together a really exciting young team.
That's the big difference is there was a clear direction and a clear plan to rebuild that roster in Chicago. They took their lumps the last couple years to be in the position they are now, and that's an ascending team with a shit ton of options. They have a football man in place making the decisions and overseeing this rebuild. I would bet anybody that he took the Bears job over ours for these very reasons and not having to deal with the competitive mandates of ownership and we ended up with a analytics stooge with almost zero real football experience. Is what it is...
The Vikings also have a clear plan. It's just the bears were shitty during the rebuild and the vikings were mediocre. If their plan works, great. If it doesn't, it just means they were shitty for a while. I don't think there's any real evidence that would suggest that the Bears plan is really a good one, given they still haven't "ascended" to above .500. The best we can really say about the Bears is that they lucked into the Panthers being so bad that they got the #1 pick, but that hardly feels like a plan going as expected.
@"medaille" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"JR44" said:@"supafreak84" said: Bears cut Whitehair and Eddie Jackson today. Now sit at 70 million in available space to spend.But oooohhhhh, that "competitive rebuild"...
And with a great trade they will be taking one of the best QBs to come out in some time with the #1 pick, Poles has taken a lot grief, but the Bears are in really great shape to put together a really exciting young team.
That's the big difference is there was a clear direction and a clear plan to rebuild that roster in Chicago. They took their lumps the last couple years to be in the position they are now, and that's an ascending team with a shit ton of options. They have a football man in place making the decisions and overseeing this rebuild. I would bet anybody that he took the Bears job over ours for these very reasons and not having to deal with the competitive mandates of ownership and we ended up with a analytics stooge with almost zero real football experience. Is what it is...
The Vikings also have a clear plan. It's just the bears were shitty during the rebuild and the vikings were mediocre. If their plan works, great. If it doesn't, it just means they were shitty for a while. I don't think there's any real evidence that would suggest that the Bears plan is really a good one, given they still haven't "ascended" to above .500. The best we can really say about the Bears is that they lucked into the Panthers being so bad that they got the #1 pick, but that hardly feels like a plan going as expected.
I give them credit for selling off assets they didnt want to pay for draft capital, making smart draft day trades, and maximizing their rebuild into the options they have this offseason. Oh and they also beat us once, and won 8 games (same as us) with some guy named Bagent starting five games. Most of us would shit ourselves if the Vikings had the options the Bears had this offseason, so, no...it's not great for us if things continue to fall into place for them while we dick around with competitive rebuilds
Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B)
@"Kentis" said: Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B)When I'm proven wrong and they stop doing the same things that have gotten us nothing but medioctlrity...I'll shut up about it. Until then I'll beat that horse into oblivion
@"Kentis" said: Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B)Has to be a horse, our days of beating bears and lions appears to be coming to an end for a while. :p
@"supafreak84" said:@"Kentis" said: Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B) When I'm proven wrong and they stop doing the same things that have gotten us nothing but medioctlrity...I'll shut up about it. Until then I'll beat that horse into oblivionI’m pretty sure everyone here now knows your thoughts on this. I just don’t feel the need when I arise every morning, to in affect, relearn the alphabet is all…
@"Kentis" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"Kentis" said: Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B) When I'm proven wrong and they stop doing the same things that have gotten us nothing but medioctlrity...I'll shut up about it. Until then I'll beat that horse into oblivionI’m pretty sure everyone here now knows your thoughts on this. I just don’t feel the need when I arise every morning, to in affect, relearn the alphabet is all…
Yeah, that's how I feel. I stopped posting about my thoughts on this because.....I'm pretty sure everyone on the board knows my thoughts by now. Interjecting the same narrative like beating a damn drum to death into every thread just gets old. And lame.
@"Kentis" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"Kentis" said: Speaking of free agents, I hear that dead horse that Supa has been unmercifully beating is availabe for a song… ;) B) When I'm proven wrong and they stop doing the same things that have gotten us nothing but medioctlrity...I'll shut up about it. Until then I'll beat that horse into oblivionI’m pretty sure everyone here now knows your thoughts on this. I just don’t feel the need when I arise every morning, to in affect, relearn the alphabet is all…
Ok, nobody on the board ever discuss the "competitive rebuild" model or question the direction of the franchise on a fucking fan message board so Kentis and Sticky don't get their panties in a bunch. Got it. Unbelievable :pGonna be a long offseason for you fellas
- referring to something that has been done or repeated so often that it has become annoying or tiresome.
@"Kentis" said:But then you have to add this so Supa understands:DictionaryDefinitions from Oxford Languages · Learn moread nau·se·amadverb
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