72+ Hours Out

• 

  KELLEN MONDQB, TEXAS A&M AGGIES

  ESPN's Todd McShay reports that Texas A&M QB Kellen Mond and Florida QB Kyle Trask are "very likely" to be selected before the end of Round 2.Throw in Stanford's Davis Mills, who has received a little Day 1 buzz, and at least by the rumor mill's estimation, we could see eight quarterbacks off the board midway through the second day of the draft. To which we would just say, easy now. Over-projecting the position is a tale as old as time. Trask doesn't profile as much more than a backup in the pros while Mond will take time to develop. With five quarterbacks expected to be drafted in Round 1, it could be difficult to find slots for three additional signal-callers in Round 2.

  SOURCE: ESPN PlusApr 26, 2021, 1:51 PM ET
• 

  DAVIS MILLSQB, STANFORD CARDINAL

  Pro Football Network's Tony Pauline reports that league "chatter" is swirling around Stanford QB Davis Mills as a potential first-round selection.Mills (6'4/212) has been "massively rising up boards" according to Pauline, who hears that the New England Patriots could be the team to watch for a relatively early selection of the Stanford signal-caller. Just not at the No. 15 pick. Two scenarios to watch for with this one -- either New England could trade down in the first round and take Mills (trading down is very much motus operandi for the outfit) late on Day 1, or they could trade up from the second round with the same result. Chicago and Washington have also been linked to Mills, though Pauline does not believe either club would pony up a first-round selection for the quarterback.

  SOURCE: Pro Football Network

@"AGRforever" said:

@"Purpleblooded" said: Sewell and Slater are a tier above Darrishaw, but it will very likely take a trade up to get Slater and Sewell will be long gone by #14.  AVT is devalued because he shows as a guard in the NFL, albeit a damn good one -- question is whether #14 is too high for a guard.

I could certainly see Sewell gone and the price to trade up for Slater too steep.  Trader Rick slides down the board in the hopes of getting AVT and recouping a 2nd or more capital with which to trade back into the second.  It's just the way he rolls.

So if its going to take an extremely high pick from next years picks to get Sewell or Slater, AVT isnt a consolation prize. You would need to feel confident in Clevlands abilities to hold down one of the OT spots or be willing to sign a T with your remaining FA money. 

Would you rather have Sewell and no first next year or AVT and get to keep next years first?

I lean option #2

Just so the draft goes well, needs are addressed, and the fuggin' draft will be OVER so I'll quit getting a dozen mocks in my sports feed every damned hour....

Left Guard has been a dumpster fire for this team since Hutchinson. I agree with Cronin that Darrisaw will be gone by 14. I have no problem taking AVT there and would be concerned about trading back and still having a chance to get him. If the projections on him being a perennial All Pro Guard are accurate, how is that not worth #14? How many games are we going to watch our garbage 4th and 5th round picks or low level free agents fail at the guard position to finally invest in a top prospect in the draft? Especially for a team that relies heavily on running the ball and play action passing? He would immediately make the left side of the line better and would help Bradbury and whoever we start at Left Tackle become better players. I'm all in on AVT. 

I also like the idea of AVT at LG, inserting Udoh in at RT and moving O'Neill to LT where most scouts thought he would eventually land with some experience. I think he is ready. 

We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

I think Sewell and Slater are gone well before 14.  If either AVT or Darrisaw is there, jump on it.  If they're both gone, I may have to grind my teeth and hope that Jaycee Horn or Waddle is still available or hope for a trade down.  I don't trust Paye, Rousseau or Phillips as much as you should to take them at 14.

@"minny65" said: We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

OK, so now you have a guard who's 6-5, 302, runs a 4.89 forty and has some of the best pass blocking numbers in football: Lowest QB pressure % allowed by an OT since 2014:

Brady Christensen, 2020 - 0.8%.

Biggest problem with Christensen is his age. He'll be 25 in September. Vikings like young players. 

Getting close now. Now is when the rumors that come in usually have more legs. 

"Kate Upton has affair with Charlotte man"

@"BarrNone55" said: "Kate Upton has affair with Charlotte man"

"Alex, I'll take NFW this happens for $1000"

@"minny65" said: We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

I am in no way setting the bar at picking up a starting LT and OG in one draft. Lightening doesn't strike Vikings OL choices in that way. 

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"minny65" said: We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

Totally agree about Christensen. I keep thinking what am I missing here? I can't figure out why everyone keeps listing him as tackle. 32 inch arms don't play tackle in the NFL. He'll be a guard. 

OK, so now you have a guard who's 6-5, 302, runs a 4.89 forty and has some of the best pass blocking numbers in football: Lowest QB pressure % allowed by an OT since 2014:

Brady Christensen, 2020 - 0.8%.

Biggest problem with Christensen is his age. He'll be 25 in September. Vikings like young players. 

I see through this entire thread the O-line is the biggest point of emphasis, which is no surprise. But I think everyone needs to look at things objectively vs. emotionally. Yes the offensive line is important but there is a lot more to unpack here. 

1. Lets take a look at the starting depth chart last season and how it compared to others and how the Vikings offense faired with that line compared to their peers. 

LT - Riley Reiff (71.4 PFF) 
LG - Dakota Dozier (44.6 PFF) 
C - Garrett Bradbury (61.4 PFF) 
RG - Ezra Cleveland (66.2 PFF) 
RT - Brian O'Neil (78.0 PFF) 

Although PFF grades are inexact and I am not separating run vs. pass the Vikings line consisted of 3 average starters, 1 above average starter, and 1 bottom 1/3 guard. Since the line is always a sum of its parts the average PFF grade for a Vikings O-lineman was 64.32. Could it be better, yes. But that is surprisingly the 13th best line in the NFL by average PFF scoring. 

2. Progressing forward the Vikings have lost Riley Reiff this off-season but where do they stand with their replacements? 

LT - Rashod Hill (63.0 PFF)
LG - Mason Cole (54.4 PFF) 
C - Garrett Bradbury (61.4 PFF) 
RG - Ezra Cleveland (66.2 PFF) 
RT - Brian O'Neil (78.0 PFF) 

I averaged out Rashod Hill's grade since he hasn't been a consistent starter and took Cole's overall grade vs. his splits between center/guard (where he was better). Average those out and not surprisingly with Dozier not sinking their average score the average of the PFF scores in 64.6. So yes in this vacuum I've created the Vikings line is not substantially worse than last season and there are inklings to suggest it could be improved. The issue with this look is that it doesn't address depth and or player contracts. E.G. Hill isn't a long-term replacement at LT. 

Ultimately what I am trying to dispel is this image of a burning dumpster fire. The Vikings offensive line even as it stands today is not in the bottom 1/3 of the NFL which is probably shocking to some. The media and perspective that the Vikings did nothing along the line drive that opinion. Remember that a team short on cap space did not trade a pick for Mason Cole and his salary with the expectation he'd be a depth piece. Rashod Hill is also not a slouch and could start at either tackle spot and be effective. Remember he played well during the 2017 playoff run. 

What all this ultimately brings me back to is the idea that they don't HAVE to go O-line in round 1. Sure being able to grab an OT makes plenty of sense if it works out but there isn't a gun being held to their head. They can improve the line and it deserves further investment but its not nearly as bad as people are making it out to be. 

More on some potential surprise first-round NFL Draft picks on @gmfb @nflnetwork pic.twitter.com/HN6kfzb9R5

— Tom Pelissero (@TomPelissero) April 27, 2021

@"minny65" said: We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

@"TBro" said:

@"minny65" said: We need a new LT and a Guard from this draft.  I don't want to move O'Neil or Cleveland and I have no idea how our brass feels about moving anyone around.  It has not worked out to well in our past but nothing has in terms of OL.  

MY take: Sewell with a decent gap, then Slater and not much of a gap with Darrisaw.  Slater has the edge over Darrisaw getting to the second level run blocking but Darrisaw has the arm length advantage in pass protection. But Slater is no slouch in pass pro, he has great hands and positioning.  Darrisaw also played all 3 years and improved each year.  There are some questions about Slater being a LT or a Guard where that is not a question with Darrisaw.  

My nightmare scenario for round 1 is that all 3 of these guys are gone before our pick and we settle on AVT who is a Guard.  I want a LT in round 1.  I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds.  I have an interest in the Christensen (BYU).  Played LT but doesn't have the length to play T in the NFL.  A lot of his workout numbers are very similar to Ezra from last year, not Better then Ezra, but similar.  I had to get that in there:)  Would really like one of the Big 3 at #14 and the BYU kid with one of our 4th rounders.  

"I think we can find a Guard in the later rounds" Did Rick pay you to write this? Go back and look at the starting offensive lines since Hutchinson in 2011 and see how well that strategy has worked out for us. I disagree with you that we would be "settling" if we picked AVT at 14. He is consistently ranked inside the Top 15 overall prospects in this draft. Your nightmare scenario will very likely become reality on draft day as Darrisaw seems to be gaining momentum and moving up draft boards with his measurables. I'd much rather have a Pro Bowl Guard in AVT than taking my chances with the second tier tackles in this draft thinking they will be effective day 1 starters. None of them are worth the #14 pick so unless you can execute a trade down what is your contingency plan to draft a starting Left Tackle? I don't disagree that moving OLineman around has not worked out well, but when we took O'Neill, he was supposed to be our LT project that needed time to build up his body and add bulk/strength. He got to play much earlier than expected and really excelled at RT his rookie year. He has the physical traits and athleticism to be an excellent LT in the NFL. He has had time to work on his body, and is a proven commodity unlike the prospects in this draft. My bet is that he also wants the money that goes along with being a LT and will lobby to make the change on his own as he will be a free agent after this season. Two Rookie Oline starters when we don't have a second round pick is a lot to expect out of this draft which is why I'm open to moving the assets we have to other positions to fill our needs.  

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I see through this entire thread the O-line is the biggest point of emphasis, which is no surprise. But I think everyone needs to look at things objectively vs. emotionally. Yes the offensive line is important but there is a lot more to unpack here. 

1. Lets take a look at the starting depth chart last season and how it compared to others and how the Vikings offense faired with that line compared to their peers. 

LT - Riley Reiff (71.4 PFF) 
LG - Dakota Dozier (44.6 PFF) 
C - Garrett Bradbury (61.4 PFF) 
RG - Ezra Cleveland (66.2 PFF) 
RT - Brian O'Neil (78.0 PFF) 

Although PFF grades are inexact and I am not separating run vs. pass the Vikings line consisted of 3 average starters, 1 above average starter, and 1 bottom 1/3 guard. Since the line is always a sum of its parts the average PFF grade for a Vikings O-lineman was 64.32. Could it be better, yes. But that is surprisingly the 13th best line in the NFL by average PFF scoring. 

2. Progressing forward the Vikings have lost Riley Reiff this off-season but where do they stand with their replacements? 

LT - Rashod Hill (63.0 PFF)
LG - Mason Cole (54.4 PFF) 
C - Garrett Bradbury (61.4 PFF) 
RG - Ezra Cleveland (66.2 PFF) 
RT - Brian O'Neil (78.0 PFF) 

I averaged out Rashod Hill's grade since he hasn't been a consistent starter and took Cole's overall grade vs. his splits between center/guard (where he was better). Average those out and not surprisingly with Dozier not sinking their average score the average of the PFF scores in 64.6. So yes in this vacuum I've created the Vikings line is not substantially worse than last season and there are inklings to suggest it could be improved. The issue with this look is that it doesn't address depth and or player contracts. E.G. Hill isn't a long-term replacement at LT. 

Ultimately what I am trying to dispel is this image of a burning dumpster fire. The Vikings offensive line even as it stands today is not in the bottom 1/3 of the NFL which is probably shocking to some. The media and perspective that the Vikings did nothing along the line drive that opinion. Remember that a team short on cap space did not trade a pick for Mason Cole and his salary with the expectation he'd be a depth piece. Rashod Hill is also not a slouch and could start at either tackle spot and be effective. Remember he played well during the 2017 playoff run. 

What all this ultimately brings me back to is the idea that they don't HAVE to go O-line in round 1. Sure being able to grab an OT makes plenty of sense if it works out but there isn't a gun being held to their head. They can improve the line and it deserves further investment but its not nearly as bad as people are making it out to be. 

I was reminded of this when I looked at the PFF grades of several of the OLs we were considering in free agency (Blythe, Fisher, Taylor, Lamp, etc). There was a huge difference between their first couple seasons and their 3rd and 4th. If we add a starter and see that kind of improvement from those three we could really have something.