So, our QB position....

Just my opinion.

Cousins has proven he is more than capable, Personally, I believe in him, but let him off the leash for crying out loud......but a few things need to happen, is he willing to take a "team friendly" deal?  Yes? Awesome.  No?  Buh Bye.

The rest goes from there.

If No....looks like we are going to roll the dice in the draft.  Here we go again swing and miss or connect?

If he DOES restructure a team friendly deal....

Scherff - go get him.  (given he checks out medically)
Draft - Best DB's available / 3T (our secondary getting older / slower)

What are the alternatives? In the Draft I see Joe B clearly going #1 overall. Tua Top 5, and potentially made of glass. Herbert Top 10 and was better 2 years ago. Eason and Love are maddeningly inconsistent, and probably don't make it to 25 in a year with so many QB needy teams.

The next tier is Fromm and that arm that makes Keenum's look like a cannon. Hurts couldn't take his eyes off of the LSU pass rush long enough to see open Receivers and his deep ball accuracy is awful. Gordon was a 1 year wonder who's a statue on the pocket and his grade under pressure is horrific.

Yes, all QBs have warts coming out. But this is a weaker class overall. Mahomes destroyed a Power 5 Conference and has Pro Genes. Jackson was a Heisman Trophy winner! There was far more on their resumes than any of these kids minus Joe and Tua.

Nobody wants to hear this but Kirk Cousins was an All In move. If he doesn't pan out and is gone after next year Rick and Mike go with him and the team is in rebuilding mode. If there's any percentage of a chance that improving the roster via this Draft can help Kirk take it to the next level why hurt that by burning an early round pick on a kid with a thin resume?

And why would you trust Rick to be the magician that mystically figures out which of these kids is the next Franchise QB? Odds are one of the group after the top 2 pans out. But I don't trust Spielman at all to be the guy that figures out which one it is. Best to give him one more year to bolster the Offensive Roster and then let his successor find the QB of the Future.

I am not a fan of wasting draft capital on a QB that "dropped to you". You have to be more adamant about your intentions at that position. 

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I am not a fan of wasting draft capital on a QB that "dropped to you". You have to be more adamant about your intentions at that position. 

Some interesting facts on Kubiak and QB's:

In Kubiak’s 18 years without Elway, his teams finished in the top 10 in NY/A nine times and 11 times in the top 15. Some of the highlights of those years:

— In 2000, the Broncos ranked fourth in NY/A with Brian Griese and Gus Frerotte under center. They were top 10 in third down percentage and red zone percentage. Griese averaged 7.22 NY/A with the great Ed McCaffrey and Rod Smith as his top receivers.

— At one time people figured Jake Plummer to be a bust, but in Denver he led the Broncos to the third ranked offense in NY/A with 7.46 yards per attempt despite the weapons in the Rocky Mountains fading from the Elway/Griese days. Ashly Lelie was the No. 2 receiver that year.

— In 2009, Matt Schaub was the surprising leader of the No. 1 passing team in yards and No. 3 in NY/A at an outstanding 7.60. The Texans had a supremely underwhelming run offense (30th in yards, 31st in Y/A) but still finished fourth in the NFL in total offensive yards and 10th in points.

— From 2007-2011, the Texans finished in the top 10 in NY/A every year.

— The 2014 Baltimore Ravens, who reached the AFC title game and lost to the Patriots 35-31, saw Joe Flacco put up his highest NY/A of his career at 6.66. The Ravens ranked 12th.

— In 2016 with Denver, Trevor Siemian had a nearly identical NY/A (6.22) to Kirk Cousins in 2018.

How do Kubiak’s offenses achieve this type of efficiency?

@"FSUVike" said: And why would you trust Rick to be the magician that mystically figures out which of these kids is the next Franchise QB? Odds are one of the group after the top 2 pans out. But I don't trust Spielman at all to be the guy that figures out which one it is. Best to give him one more year to bolster the Offensive Roster and then let his successor find the QB of the Future.

I agree with the gist of your post though. Personally, I don't get this idea that all we have to do is draft Cousins' replacement and we're good to let the contract expire. The question should only be "can you win a Super Bowl with Cousins?" The answer to that is yes. He might need a few things around him, like every QB in the NFL not named Mahomes or Jackson, but there's little doubt he's a top 5-10 QB in the NFL (PFF ranks him 6th).

I think we extend him. I just don't think we have much choice, given the odds: I think it's naive to think you can possibly draft your "mahomes" somewhere between the 25th pick and wherever. I hate to be pessimistic, but the odds are much, much higher that you'll be giving up on QB6 and drafting a QB that can't play in the NFL. 

Cousins has been unable to beat teams with winning records throughout his career and I do not see anything from him that says that is going to change.  We can extend him and continue to follow the painful trend of lighting it up against Detroit and losing to every good team or we can make a move.  

The Chiefs were in the exact same situation with Alex Smith a few years ago, made a gutsy move to trade up and select Mahomes instead of staying with Smith.  I think that worked out pretty well for them.  I don't know if the answer is in the draft, trade or FA, but I am pretty sure it is not in house.  

@"supafreak84" said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I am not a fan of wasting draft capital on a QB that "dropped to you". You have to be more adamant about your intentions at that position. 

Well that's unfortunately the position the Vikings notoriously find themselves in, just good enough to miss out on elite QB prospects. We rarely are ever drafting in the top 10, which makes it even more difficult to identify an elite prospect at the position.  They have had to sort through QB's that have dropped (Ponder/Bridgewater), but at some point you have to take a swing and trust in your staffs ability to develop those prospects. That philosophy certainly paid off in Baltimore this year. I like Kubiak as a guy I would trust to develop a young QB and I would like to see the Vikings take a swing at things especially with the uncertainty surrounding Cousins after the season and the fact that we have no backups at the position

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@"supafreak84" said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I am not a fan of wasting draft capital on a QB that "dropped to you". You have to be more adamant about your intentions at that position. 

Well that's unfortunately the position the Vikings notoriously find themselves in, just good enough to miss out on elite QB prospects. We rarely are ever drafting in the top 10, which makes it even more difficult to identify an elite prospect at the position.  They have had to sort through QB's that have dropped (Ponder/Bridgewater), but at some point you have to take a swing and trust in your staffs ability to develop those prospects. That philosophy certainly paid off in Baltimore this year. I like Kubiak as a guy I would trust to develop a young QB and I would like to see the Vikings take a swing at things especially with the uncertainty surrounding Cousins after the season and the fact that we have no backups at the position

Agreed. But you can definitely be aggressive and jockey for position to some extent. It isn't an impossibility. The Rams, Eagles, Chiefs, and Texans all showed that a franchise QB is far superior than the draft capital it takes to acquire them. You just need to really have to hone in on your guy and get the evaluation right. 

They will probably extend Cousins. But they won't be able to put the team around him he needs to win the NFCN, much less the superbowl. I don't mind if they give Cousins next year to prove himself, but extending him based on what he has done, will result in the same frustrations; good but not great for an additional year or two.

I would spend the draft capital to move up as much as it takes to get the QB of the future. And I don't mean moving back up in the end of the first round to take whoever is left over. I would let him learn behind Cousins this year. If Cousins balls out, the young guy can sit again or be trade bait. That would allow another 30 million plus to rebuild the team around the young guy if Cousins doesn't work out. And that financial advantage would continue for several years while the new QB is on his rookie contract.

But that's not what Spielman will do. And even if he did, he doesn't have a very good track record evaluating QB's.

So right now the Vikings have a suspect O-line and offense, defense, and average special teams. I don't think you can fix that with a few new pieces. Might be time to do something different for a change. May be time to swing for the fences and forget about 7th round gems.

I like Jordan Love.  He would benefit from sitting a year too.  He just turned 21 in November.  Graduated from college too.
Has a huge arm and can move around.
He had a new offensive coordinator, offensive line, and lost his top two receivers, top tight end (Dax Raymond), and top running back (Darwin Thompson) last year.
He admitted he was forcing throws and learned from it.

This is the kind of QB you move up for IMHO.

I would also try to sign Brock Osweiler in free agency to be the veteran backup.
Kubiak loved him in Denver and wanted him to come back before he signed the ridiculous offer from the Texans. 
Denver offered a 3 year 39 mil deal.

Be glad I am not the GM.  :)

@"MarkSP18" said: I like Jordan Love.  He would benefit from sitting a year too.  He just turned 21 in November.  Graduated from college too. Has a huge arm and can move around. He had a new offensive coordinator, offensive line, and lost his top two receivers, top tight end (Dax Raymond), and top running back (Darwin Thompson) last year. He admitted he was forcing throws and learned from it.

This is the kind of QB you move up for IMHO.

I would also try to sign Brock Osweiler in free agency to be the veteran backup.
Kubiak loved him in Denver and wanted him to come back before he signed the ridiculous offer from the Texans. 
Denver offered a 3 year 39 mil deal.

Be glad I am not the GM.  :)

Our HC and GM aren't under contract beyond this year. They will be drafting for players who can help them win in 2020. Cousins was their all in move. All 3 are tied together. At minimum they need a Super Bowl appearance or they are all gone.

I'm with Barr on this one. I really cant see the Vikes taking a QB in the first 3 rounds and i would be rather annoyed if they did. For the most part everyone knows what our current needs are and i would imagine they are addressed with the first 3-4 picks of the draft (OL, CB, DL, maybe WR).

@"BarrNone55" said: Our HC and GM aren't under contract beyond this year. They will be drafting for players who can help them win in 2020. Cousins was their all in move. All 3 are tied together. At minimum they need a Super Bowl appearance or they are all gone.

@"Hawkvike25" said: I'm with Barr on this one. I really cant see the Vikes taking a QB in the first 3 rounds and i would be rather annoyed if they did. For the most part everyone knows what our current needs are and i would imagine they are addressed with the first 3-4 picks of the draft (OL, CB, DL, maybe WR).

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@"BarrNone55" said: Our HC and GM aren't under contract beyond this year. They will be drafting for players who can help them win in 2020. Cousins was their all in move. All 3 are tied together. At minimum they need a Super Bowl appearance or they are all gone.

This is why I've been confused as to how the Vikings are handling Zimmer & Spielman's contracts. The best course of action would be for the Wilfs to extend both and help them make an objective decision on Kirk. They're all tied together but if the Wilfs truly believe in the current staff they should allow them a shot to add another QB, as bitter as many fans would be about that. But you can't help but think they'll want to extend Kirk for the near-term benefits of added cap space in 2020 if pressing to keep their jobs. The reality is a new FO likely will want a their own QB (which could be Kirk) so you've effectively tied them to Cousins as well.

^^This^^

Every day we don't hear even the vaguest whisper about extensions for either, plus the promotions from within, it becomes clearer to me that the Wilfs are at the end of the line with the GM and HC. 

If it were closer to the draft i'd be more upset about not hearing anything for contracts or free agents. I'm sure the front office is really working with agents and players on contract situations and strategy. Frankly, there are a lot of different moves they can make but that doesnt mean the player/agent will agree. It is going to be a wild offseason for the Vikes and more news will come.

honestly the only talks I have heard so far make the least amount of sense and that was the talk of extending Cook.  other than that its been pretty silent.