Quote: @medaille said:
How about we put every political candidate to a similar
level of scrutiny (not quite the right word?)
If you can’t pass a super deep dive into your background, where all your
dirty deeds are put on public display, you don’t get on the ballot in the first
place. We need to get to a point where
we aren’t choosing between Corrupt Team Red Candidate and Corrupt Team Blue
Candidate. Maybe we need a preprimary,
where we all get to vote on every candidate about whether they are too
corrupt/dirty to even make it on the ballot, so that we’re ensured that
regardless of who wins, we’re not ashamed of them.
Congress would be 90% empty.
Yeah, what a scam! I mean, who the hell HASN'T sexually assaulted a girl?
Look, I get the uncertainty involved here, and the time element, and the fact that there is no evidence (like there would be) or corroboration.... but let's not start to equate what the judge is accused of doing with all the other little indiscretions we all make when we're young.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
Yeah, what a scam! I mean, who the hell HASN'T sexually assaulted a girl?
Look, I get the uncertainty involved here, and the time element, and the fact that there is no evidence (like there would be) or corroboration.... but let's not start to equate what the judge is accused of doing with all the other little indiscretions we all make when we're young.
the key is what he is accused of doing... so anybody at anytime could come forth and make unsubstantiated accusations and ruin a persons life/career... sounds fair. maybe she is fucked in the head and her version isnt how it went down? pretty tough position to take without supporting testimony.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Yeah, what a scam! I mean, who the hell HASN'T sexually assaulted a girl?
Look, I get the uncertainty involved here, and the time element, and the fact that there is no evidence (like there would be) or corroboration.... but let's not start to equate what the judge is accused of doing with all the other little indiscretions we all make when we're young.
the key is what he is accused of doing... so anybody at anytime could come forth and make unsubstantiated accusations and ruin a persons life/career... sounds fair. maybe she is fucked in the head and her version isnt how it went down? pretty tough position to take without supporting testimony.
...and maybe she's telling the truth. None of us know for sure. The only people who know for sure are the judge, his friend (who ain't talking), and the girl. I just don't like this "none of us would hold up to scrutiny" bullshit, as if what he's accused of doing is something we've all done. No, we all haven't.
If he actually did this, then he should not be making value decisions on the Supreme Court. But my biggest problem with him is that he's proven himself to be a right wing nut. If the bad guys win the election, they get to nominate bad guys. I get it. It is what it is. I may not agree with them, but it's the system we have. I've even harbored some admiration for intellectual conservatives like Antonin Scalia and John Roberts. But THIS guy, this guys seems to be a product of Trumpism, of Fox News and Alex Jones, the kind of dingbat who actually believes all the Clinton conspiracy stuff.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Yeah, what a scam! I mean, who the hell HASN'T sexually assaulted a girl?
Look, I get the uncertainty involved here, and the time element, and the fact that there is no evidence (like there would be) or corroboration.... but let's not start to equate what the judge is accused of doing with all the other little indiscretions we all make when we're young.
the key is what he is accused of doing... so anybody at anytime could come forth and make unsubstantiated accusations and ruin a persons life/career... sounds fair. maybe she is fucked in the head and her version isnt how it went down? pretty tough position to take without supporting testimony.
...and maybe she's telling the truth. None of us know for sure. The only people who know for sure are the judge, his friend (who ain't talking), and the girl. I just don't like this "none of us would hold up to scrutiny" bullshit, as if what he's accused of doing is something we've all done. No, we all haven't.
If he actually did this, then he should not be making value decisions on the Supreme Court. But my biggest problem with him is that he's proven himself to be a right wing nut. If the bad guys win the election, they get to nominate bad guys. I get it. It is what it is. I may not agree with them, but it's the system we have. I've even harbored some admiration for intellectual conservatives like Antonin Scalia and John Roberts. But THIS guy, this guys seems to be a product of Trumpism, of Fox News and Alex Jones, the kind of dingbat who actually believes all the Clinton conspiracy stuff.
Speaking of Clinton...
I'd like to say a few things on this since this is some very complicated stuff. First, thanks to jimmy for allowing me to post this. (A certain naughty boy had been banned from the Sensitive Topics area.)
As liberal as some would paint me on this board, this entire issue had me going in many directions. I'm not even sure where to start, but: I think Kavanaugh did what Dr. Ford claims. I'd bet some of the other accusations leveled against him hold some merit as well. Some might not.
Now, here's where it gets really, really tricky. And there are a few thoughts:
First - again my thoughts - assuming Kavanaugh did this to this woman, it's reprehensible. It's messed up we have a framework in place that shuts her down simply because of his nomination. If you could see through a window 36 years ago and witness this, would you do nothing simply because you want him nominated? Who shoves a woman into a room and pounces on her? I don't mean to sound like I'm leading anybody, but I can all but guarantee none of my friend group acted like this. If they did, we'd kick the shit out of them.
Now this leads into my second point: this WAS a political move NOT on Dr. Ford's part. From what I saw, this was a woman who went through some trauma and wanted to make things right. Whether or not that was for the country or for herself isn't for us to judge. What the Democrats did was strategic. It's absolutely obvious and anybody who argues we're just following due process as needed is lying. The timing of this was intentional, but I have zero blame for Ford. I don't know what it's like to be in a woman's position, but I'll take it from 100% of women I know: they're generally scared of men and we act like scumbags a lot... and it's "our world." And let's be honest, mother nature made it our world. So the onus falls on men to act better and kick the shit out of men like this, whether it's a teenager or an adult.
However... (and this is my clear bias speaking) GOOD FOR THE DEMOCRATS. Remember when Obama was set to nominate a SC Judge? This doesn't get nearly enough attention. What's happening here is politics, plain and simple. We've all created this ugly mess where it's an eye for an eye, so we need to learn to deal with it. Republicans pitched a hissy fit when Obama chose somebody, it's about time Democrats fight back like this. And I can't stand establishment Democrats, but who I really, really can't stand are Trump supportive Republicans. We've moved the goal posts so far to each side, it's almost fun to watch both sides rip each other to pieces.
After all that, on a final note (and this is a biggie), Kavanaugh: part of me feels for the guy. Before I get killed for this, I think he's a liar, a boob, and stands for everything I stand against. But holy shit, if we're digging up people's pasts from 36 years ago at this point, can people who are rallying for his head - in the age of cell phones, Facebook, etc. - not see what's coming? Everybody on this board should think about themselves at their worst. Now think about that in a text convo that could be released.
If Kavanaugh did this, then fuck him. That's a 17 year old that deserves a good beating and maybe even a jail sentencing... but can we prove it? Can we prove any of this? What if - and again, I think he's a liar and was a piece of shit - this was fabricated or overblown?
I raise this question because of something in my past. I was accused of what would be considered on par with what Kavanaugh is being considered of back in college... At a party when I was 20 in college, a friend who I'd known since we were freshman approached me. I suggested we leave to hook up in a nearby bedroom. I said it in front of all my friends, just hoping for a laugh. I was ECSTATIC when she led me into a room. I got cheers, etc. Yada yada yada, very little happened except her friends must've arrived at the party just after her and knocked on the door and interrupted us. She hides, I put on my clothes and head back to the party, etc.
She had a "reputation" in college and was trying to act better, so she was embarrassed her friends caught her. I head back to the living room and hang with my friends and suddenly her friends come out of the room furious saying that she's too drunk to speak and that I threw her in the closet (where she hid).
I've never been more scared in my entire life, and I mean that sentence with the utmost sincerity. It was like Shawshank Redemption. I was completely innocent, everything had been 100% consensual, she WAS NOT drunk at all... but all I saw were prison bars.
We messaged on Facebook the next morning and she responded with a long paragraph apology for the whole thing and admitted she was embarrassed and that I'd done nothing wrong. I remember crying at my desk reading it because it completely exonerated me of any wrongdoing. I immediately printed out copies, which I still physically have (probably back in my house in MN).
I don't tell any of that to sound cool, nor to exonerate Kavanaugh, but I think we're entering a very scary place where an accusation can ruin a person's life. I was extremely fortunate the girl I was dealing with a) was moral and b) that we had access to something like Facebook.
End of the longest rant I think I've ever posted here: politics are getting to be the ugliest I've ever seen in my short 32 years here. And it seems like people are getting more mean-spirited too. I always considered myself an awful, angry person but watching how these politicians we've elected on BOTH sides (D and R) conducted themselves yesterday just left me shaking my head. I can't believe I'm saying this, but we should all try to be nicer to each other in general. This is getting out of control.
And Roger Gooddell is a dickhead.
I find his statements and his open demeanor to be sincerely honest. I find his calendar to be pretty convincing along with his recollection of the events on it. I find him to be completely candid. He's very smart, he's very prompt with his judicial memory and recollection of statues and meaning. He has stood front and center eager to take on any and all questions. Which #metoo assailant in recent memory has acted like this in regards to allegations? He is right there under oath. He's sitting in a setting that the penalty of lying is ultimately the same. It's on record, under oath. He demanded a hearing immediately - Feinstein had this information for a long time before it conveniently leaked to the press. Dr. Ford stated she was harassed by reporters over it.
It's waaaaay to politically convenient - a lot of the counter research into this is blending and disappearing in a sea of "far right nonsense." It doesn't help that most of our main media sources sound a lot like those Dem. senators in their writing, reporting and response. The media harassed her for the 'scoop' that could derail this nomination.
He has consistently acted like a person who is not guilty of this. I'm sure someone will tell me i'm not an expert on that - it my opinion from watching way too much of this process in an attempt to get away from media spin on both sides - we keep getting more real information from tiny sources that are then mixed in with bullshit sources. It's on both sides...
If he is not guilty of this, i'll say he is one of the most refreshing, straight forward people i've had the pleasure of watching on television in a long time. To hear him explain "the devils triangle" drinking game and frustratingly explain lining the cups up and further as a "quarters" game was funny; or having to explain "Fs" on his calendar as marking occasions when a mid-teen buddy would say "fuck."
Edit: Now he shouldn't even be allowed to coach girls basketball again until an investigation is completed.
It's hard not to feel outraged if what she testified to is not true. This guy's life and family has been flipped upside down. It's kinda crossed a point where they damn well better be true... politically speaking, of course. Her life has been flipped upside down. I think what she went through and has gone through is disgusting and hope no one is subjected to sexual assault or rape. I hope their are strict law abiding assholes as judges who get off simply thinking about putting the fuckers who commit that shit in jail...
We need more evidence and a stronger case - this has the potential to never be settled. From what we've seen from so many news stations just parroting the Dems. line of juggular reasoning, what's going to change if the FBI doesn't find anything in a week? It's still going to be a media circus. They'll demand a penis swab...
And Roger Gooddell definitely is a dickhead.
I read what happened to you there KB and you having messages to back you up. Do you think his hand written calendar and his recollection of the events he wrote to be false or fake? Do you believe they are just too convenient or it's not believable that he kept logs of his life like that?
I'm asking because he literally has a document that backs his claims up - the difference is simply digital. His calendar looks authentic without even reading it; it's is all old and crusty with an 80's looking binder and faded text written with multiple different utensils. It looks like something my mom might have laying around somewhere. To me, he has produced more evidence that he is not guilty than she has that he is; and most of the people who she named have disputed him being involved in these claims.
I feel like he has provided the kind of record to back himself up that you have. It's been twisted and distorted into something else in front of his face to the public and nothing he is showing or stating is going to stop this derailment from happening...
The FBI has a week to check it out - we'll see what they do or don't find I guess...
I've not followed it. I can't stand news anymore. I really don't know if these women are credible or not. I don't know if this guy is a good man. I don't know if he is now and wasn't then or neither then or now. I don't vote for him why would I learn about him. That's problem #1 I have with the Supreme Court.
Problem #2. This is what I do know. This is a lifetime position. L i f e time... That in itself I never liked about the supreme court. That and as I said we don't get to choose the people who are ultimately responsible for interpreting our rights. They don't give us rights they can take them. They interpret them only. The rights gets written elsewhere. They only do a half job of even interpreting lately. Back to my 2nd problem this is a lifetime position of a "Supreme" judge. The very name should mean he or she led a exemplary life to rate being called "Supreme" for the rest of their life. This is as I said a lifetime position. They can take time to look at how well he lived his life. Take all the time they need. He's got a lifetime to do the job.
Ps: I would NOT qualify for this scrutiny...lol. That's not the point now is it. I'm not asking anybody to call me supreme. Not now or the rest of my lifetime.
If he is a sexual preadator, guilty of attempted rape, indecent exposure and....I guess.....train/gang raping lol none of which can be substantiated. wouldnt this behavior have continued?
He had hundreds of female clerks over the years. All of them have said he would never had done this and never acted like that around them.
To me that is one of the most powerful things in his favor. He had all kinds of oppertunity to sexually harras these gals and he didnt.
Ive worked with class A douche bags who are creepy as F around all women. Its obvious and its a life long affliction.
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