Quote: @Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? To me, he is a game manager. A guy who was a high pick out of college, and has been a QB since age 9, should not need 5 years to learn how to throw an accurate deep ball.
Problem is, everyone keeps saying Case is not the guy....yet he produced 13 wins. Drew Brees sucked in San Diego for a few years, and then the lights came on. Maybe they did for Case. Yes, he takes unnecessary risks and had 10 INTs (3 in the playoffs), but few were his fault. To be fair, there were a few other dropped INTs that he very well could have made his stats look worse. But, he is the gunslinger we want. Teddy doesn't take those chances.
And, Sam. He is my pick, were it not for the injury concerns. By far the most accurate, but the least mobile.
I think Case deserves to start in this league. I think Sam deserves to start in this league. And I think Teddy was the best QB we had had in Minnesota since Favre was here, until Sam came and Case emerged.
Biggest fear is like StickyBun - just don't screw it up. If we pick Teddy, and he flames out, and the other 1 or 2 do well, it's starting from scratch again. I'm sick of retread QBs.
If it were me, I'd franchise Case, and sign Sam for $12M more. We have the money, and I don't see anyone paying Sam more than $12m a year to start due to the injury concerns.
I got back to you/we/all of us saw Teddy doing much better with deep touch before the injury, he was showing great poise and accuracy when the reigns were given to him, but that wasnt often under norv and his rigid system as well as being forced into playing in the most predictable offense we have ever seen with AD as the feature.
Honestly Teddy may be the guy you think he is, but I am fairly confident that he will be much better than many anticipate and with the offense that Case was working with I think Teddy would have been a QB for the Vikings (assuming that knee is allowing him to do what he did before in terms of moving around in the pocket and making people miss.)
Only the coaches really know whats best for the team and if that ends up being Case... I am fine with that as well.
Quote: @Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"?
What game in Josh Rosen's NFL career makes you say "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? There aren't any. And yet some team is likely to invest millions in him. How do ya figure?
Some things are about projection. I've seen enough of Teddy to project that given better protection, balance and the kind of weapons we now have, he will light it up o'plenty. My only concern about him is his durability. And you know as well as anyone, if there were no concerns about that, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"?
What game in Josh Rosen's NFL career makes you say "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? There aren't any. And yet some team is likely to invest millions in him. How do ya figure?
Some things are about projection. I've seen enough of Teddy to project that given better protection, balance and the kind of weapons we now have, he will light it up o'plenty. My only concern about him is his durability. And you know as well as anyone, if there were no concerns about that, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.
Someone would still find something to moan about. Its a fan message board 
Quote: @Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? To me, he is a game manager. A guy who was a high pick out of college, and has been a QB since age 9, should not need 5 years to learn how to throw an accurate deep ball.
Problem is, everyone keeps saying Case is not the guy....yet he produced 13 wins. Drew Brees sucked in San Diego for a few years, and then the lights came on. Maybe they did for Case. Yes, he takes unnecessary risks and had 10 INTs (3 in the playoffs), but few were his fault. To be fair, there were a few other dropped INTs that he very well could have made his stats look worse. But, he is the gunslinger we want. Teddy doesn't take those chances.
And, Sam. He is my pick, were it not for the injury concerns. By far the most accurate, but the least mobile.
I think Case deserves to start in this league. I think Sam deserves to start in this league. And I think Teddy was the best QB we had had in Minnesota since Favre was here, until Sam came and Case emerged.
Biggest fear is like StickyBun - just don't screw it up. If we pick Teddy, and he flames out, and the other 1 or 2 do well, it's starting from scratch again. I'm sick of retread QBs.
If it were me, I'd franchise Case, and sign Sam for $12M more. We have the money, and I don't see anyone paying Sam more than $12m a year to start due to the injury concerns.
I don't want a gunslinger or the roller coaster. I want a field general that dissects defenses. I think Teddy can be that guy that can carve up a defense because he is smart with the ball, anticipates and can read the defense. I think the "game manager" label is misapplied. He was a young QB playing for a conservative coach with a very good defense. He did what was asked, and that was to take care of the ball. When the team needed him, he stepped up in the 4th quarter and did quite well.
I am leary of Case. As Barr sez, he likely has peaked. Given a years worth of film, I think most decent defenses would start shutting him down. Bradford is a great QB, but that health issue makes him a stop gap. If even that.
Quote: @Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? To me, he is a game manager. A guy who was a high pick out of college, and has been a QB since age 9, should not need 5 years to learn how to throw an accurate deep ball.
Problem is, everyone keeps saying Case is not the guy....yet he produced 13 wins. Drew Brees sucked in San Diego for a few years, and then the lights came on. Maybe they did for Case. Yes, he takes unnecessary risks and had 10 INTs (3 in the playoffs), but few were his fault. To be fair, there were a few other dropped INTs that he very well could have made his stats look worse. But, he is the gunslinger we want. Teddy doesn't take those chances.
And, Sam. He is my pick, were it not for the injury concerns. By far the most accurate, but the least mobile.
I think Case deserves to start in this league. I think Sam deserves to start in this league. And I think Teddy was the best QB we had had in Minnesota since Favre was here, until Sam came and Case emerged.
Biggest fear is like StickyBun - just don't screw it up. If we pick Teddy, and he flames out, and the other 1 or 2 do well, it's starting from scratch again. I'm sick of retread QBs.
If it were me, I'd franchise Case, and sign Sam for $12M more. We have the money, and I don't see anyone paying Sam more than $12m a year to start due to the injury concerns.
The Bears game in 2015 was pretty good (highest passer rating, yards per attempt, TDs, etc. in years, including this year). Although Bridgewater didn't rack up the TDs himself, the Giants game was the most points the Vikings have scored on offense (43 + a pick six by the defense with a missed extra point) in a long time; I'm pretty sure the offense scored on every possession (9 times) excluding the kneel down. Didn't Bridgewater also have one of, if not the best game against the Broncos all year?
You give credit to the 11 wins under Keenum, why not the 11 wins under Bridgewater? You knock the deep ball of Bridgewater, why not Keenum (it's worse)?
You say it shouldn't take a QB years to figure out an aspect of the game, but Bradford only has 1 year of accurate passing (his 7th in the NFL) and has never had a winning season (excluding the 1.5 games this year). I don't understand the picking of different criteria to judge the three QBs.
I admittedly don't understand the love for Bradford. A good percentage of Bradford's stats last year were in garbage time. Those that favor Bradford seem to remember only two games: GB last year and NO this year. What about the Eagles, Bears, Colts and at GB (garbage time stat game)? I'll say the same thing I said last year, if a QB needs everything to be perfect around him in order to succeed, how is that a good QB? Garrapolo went to a terrible 49ers team that hadn't really won. They didn't lose another game with him as QB.
If the Vikings pick Keenum and he flames out, then what? If the Vikings pick Bradford and he flames out, then what?
You say you are sick of retreads, but you want both of the retreads over the QB the Vikings and this coaching staff drafted and developed? I forget where I saw this question, but it's a good one. Which QB would you feel worse about having success in the NFL not as a member of the Vikings?
I thought Teddy had the "it" factor ever since seeing him "live" in his first start against Atlanta. He threw for 317, but 0 TDs. That game he ran for a TD and Asiata ran in for 3 more. Teddy was electric that game, but still so raw. I think he could still be electric, but would love to see him playing again with the confidense of a cagey vetern QB.
Not sure if that's possible or not, but I do think the injury derailed career, not his talent. Can he play again? I have no clue.
I'd be more than Ok to see Teddy have another shot at leading this team again. I also would have no problems seeing Case again too. I just think Teddy is more of a playmaker and is more mobile (if healthy, of course).
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ Vikeking2 said:
Tom, over 30 million for two qbs that are still question marks, one with long history of injuries and the other a 30 year old possible one year wonder?
youd rather do that than get teddy on 2-3 year deal less than 10 mil a year with prob only one year guaranteed? that is crazy
look maybe teddys leg falls off, but signing him doesnt make us potetially lose Diggs, Kendrick, Barr, or Hunter. and frankly our team is good and has top weapons at all positions on offense, we can be playoff team will pretty much any qb. none of these 3 are locks to be SB Qb, so why hamstring our team with the two most expensive qbs when they all are about even with their flaws, strengths, and questions.
one is also only 24 the others are 30 or older
you arent getting Teddy for less than 12-15 million a year IMO, probably more with incentives based on him winning the #1 and playing a full season. If Teddy is as ready to go as we hear and hope, then he will get low end starter money from somebody for sure.
$15M per year for Bridgewater? That would surprise me a lot. Every other team is liable to doubt his health, especially if the Vikings let him explore free agency. He's in a situation where he cannot cash in until he gets back on the field and plays for an extended time and at a higher level than he did even in 2015. He threw 14 TDs while starting an entire season; that's not acceptable production for an NFL QB. No GM is going to place a sizable bet on Bridgewater yet.
I do think the likely lower cost favors the idea of the team going with Bridgewater. The Vikings have 4 players (Barr, Kendricks, Hunter, Diggs) who will be seeking contracts around $10M/year, and they need to pick up Waynes' 5th year option, committing them to +$12M for him in 2019. Zimmer may face a choice between keeping all his defensive players or signing a costly QB; which do you think he will pick??
Quote: @Jor-El said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ Vikeking2 said:
Tom, over 30 million for two qbs that are still question marks, one with long history of injuries and the other a 30 year old possible one year wonder?
youd rather do that than get teddy on 2-3 year deal less than 10 mil a year with prob only one year guaranteed? that is crazy
look maybe teddys leg falls off, but signing him doesnt make us potetially lose Diggs, Kendrick, Barr, or Hunter. and frankly our team is good and has top weapons at all positions on offense, we can be playoff team will pretty much any qb. none of these 3 are locks to be SB Qb, so why hamstring our team with the two most expensive qbs when they all are about even with their flaws, strengths, and questions.
one is also only 24 the others are 30 or older
you arent getting Teddy for less than 12-15 million a year IMO, probably more with incentives based on him winning the #1 and playing a full season. If Teddy is as ready to go as we hear and hope, then he will get low end starter money from somebody for sure.
$15M per year for Bridgewater? That would surprise me a lot. Every other team is liable to doubt his health, especially if the Vikings let him explore free agency. He's in a situation where he cannot cash in until he gets back on the field and plays for an extended time and at a higher level than he did even in 2015. He threw 14 TDs while starting an entire season; that's not acceptable production for an NFL QB. No GM is going to place a sizable bet on Bridgewater yet.
I do think the likely lower cost favors the idea of the team going with Bridgewater. The Vikings have 4 players (Barr, Kendricks, Hunter, Diggs) who will be seeking contracts around $10M/year, and they need to pick up Waynes' 5th year option, committing them to +$12M for him in 2019. Zimmer may face a choice between keeping all his defensive players or signing a costly QB; which do you think he will pick??
15 was on the high end, but I dont think he signs for less than 10 as the poster suggested. 15 million is the basement for starting QBs these days.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ Vikeking2 said:
Tom, over 30 million for two qbs that are still question marks, one with long history of injuries and the other a 30 year old possible one year wonder?
youd rather do that than get teddy on 2-3 year deal less than 10 mil a year with prob only one year guaranteed? that is crazy
look maybe teddys leg falls off, but signing him doesnt make us potetially lose Diggs, Kendrick, Barr, or Hunter. and frankly our team is good and has top weapons at all positions on offense, we can be playoff team will pretty much any qb. none of these 3 are locks to be SB Qb, so why hamstring our team with the two most expensive qbs when they all are about even with their flaws, strengths, and questions.
one is also only 24 the others are 30 or older
you arent getting Teddy for less than 12-15 million a year IMO, probably more with incentives based on him winning the #1 and playing a full season. If Teddy is as ready to go as we hear and hope, then he will get low end starter money from somebody for sure.
$15M per year for Bridgewater? That would surprise me a lot. Every other team is liable to doubt his health, especially if the Vikings let him explore free agency. He's in a situation where he cannot cash in until he gets back on the field and plays for an extended time and at a higher level than he did even in 2015. He threw 14 TDs while starting an entire season; that's not acceptable production for an NFL QB. No GM is going to place a sizable bet on Bridgewater yet.
I do think the likely lower cost favors the idea of the team going with Bridgewater. The Vikings have 4 players (Barr, Kendricks, Hunter, Diggs) who will be seeking contracts around $10M/year, and they need to pick up Waynes' 5th year option, committing them to +$12M for him in 2019. Zimmer may face a choice between keeping all his defensive players or signing a costly QB; which do you think he will pick??
15 was on the high end, but I dont think he signs for less than 10 as the poster suggested. 15 million is the basement for starting QBs these days.
That may not be true. Rick said today that it's a NFL decision as to tolling. If you look at the tolling language, it doesn't say the contract "can" toll, it says it "tolls". As in, it may not be a Viking decision, it may be automatic. But who knows. Rick-speak plus NFL jargon language equals confusion.
Quote: @Tom Moore said:
Teddy is a wonderful person. Now, with that said, what game do you point to in his career that makes you say, "man, that is a franchise QB and he really lit them up"? To me, he is a game manager. A guy who was a high pick out of college, and has been a QB since age 9, should not need 5 years to learn how to throw an accurate deep ball.
Problem is, everyone keeps saying Case is not the guy....yet he produced 13 wins. Drew Brees sucked in San Diego for a few years, and then the lights came on. Maybe they did for Case. Yes, he takes unnecessary risks and had 10 INTs (3 in the playoffs), but few were his fault. To be fair, there were a few other dropped INTs that he very well could have made his stats look worse. But, he is the gunslinger we want. Teddy doesn't take those chances.
And, Sam. He is my pick, were it not for the injury concerns. By far the most accurate, but the least mobile.
I think Case deserves to start in this league. I think Sam deserves to start in this league. And I think Teddy was the best QB we had had in Minnesota since Favre was here, until Sam came and Case emerged.
Biggest fear is like StickyBun - just don't screw it up. If we pick Teddy, and he flames out, and the other 1 or 2 do well, it's starting from scratch again. I'm sick of retread QBs.
If it were me, I'd franchise Case, and sign Sam for $12M more. We have the money, and I don't see anyone paying Sam more than $12m a year to start due to the injury concerns.
Few Ints were Case's fault? Seriously? I suppose the Pick 6 he threw into triple coverage wasn't his fault because his arm got tipped. Otherwise it would have magically passed through all the Defenders.
And how many times did he throw up a floater that Diggs or Thielen bailed him out on? How many times did he hit DBs right in the damn hands and they dropped it?
It's great that Minnesota has two WRs capable of being in the Top 10 in contested catches. It's not great that Keenum doesn't have the arm to hit them when they're open and has to rely on their ball skills to bail him out.
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