Yikes

[MaroonBells]

Your options are to draft a QB to compete with him before you need to ... or ... you don't and you pay the price.

So spend a draft pick on another QB so you don't have to pay the guy you took with the 1st overall pick three years ago? Despite the fact that he's thrown for 4,000 yards both of his last two seasons and went to the Pro Bowl? Look, he's not perfect, but this isn't Kenny Picket or Justin Fields here. You just pay the guy.

[StickierBuns]

So spend a draft pick on another QB so you don't have to pay the guy you took with the 1st overall pick three years ago? Despite the fact that he's thrown for 4,000 yards both of his last two seasons and went to the Pro Bowl? Look, he's not perfect, but this isn't Kenny Picket or Justin Fields here. You just pay the guy.

I don't understand how some fans have such an issue with paying players. You'd think it was coming out of their own pockets. Has he really earned that contract? Hard to say he has. But its what you do today, bet on the come.

[medaille]

Even Lawrence isn't particularly special.  He's been basically average, though he did just get paid like a guy who puts a team on his back and carries it to a title.  Nice gig if you can get it.

What were their options?

Your options are to draft a QB to compete with him before you need to ... or ... you don't and you pay the price.

So spend a draft pick on another QB so you don't have to pay the guy you took with the 1st overall pick three years ago? Despite the fact that he's thrown for 4,000 yards both of his last two seasons and went to the Pro Bowl? Look, he's not perfect, but this isn't Kenny Picket or Justin Fields here. You just pay the guy.

I'm not understanding the bipolar switch you just had.

This is the message chain.  Comet52 said Trevor is average and is getting overpaid.  You replied to him carrying on the theme of him being average, and overpaid, but adding on "What were their options?"

I told you what the options are for not overpaying your average QB.  You can either plan ahead and try to find a rookie QB who's better than average, you can pay a lot for your average QB, or you can jump from average but expensive into the unknown and hope you land ok.

I'm not arguing that Trevor is good, average, or bad.  I don't think I've watched a single of his games since he was drafted, I just know that average QBs don't get you anything.  They just waste time.  Overpaying an average QB and not bringing in competition is how you waste a decade of your teams time.  At some point you need to bring in a guy that is top tier. I would argue that it's much better to draft 5 QBs a decade in the first round trying to find the guy than it is to spend 10 years trying to win a SB with an average or slightly above average QB.

[comet52]

I don't understand how some fans have such an issue with paying players. You'd think it was coming out of their own pockets. Has he really earned that contract? Hard to say he has. But its what you do today, bet on the come.

Why does having an opinion that Lawrence isn't worth the money constitute "having an issue"? It's just an opinion, Sticky.

The overpaid, average/good qb with a great team around him model is extremely hard. Who's pulled it off recently? The 49ers and they lost both times to ... the great qb. That's the model that wins most of the time. The other one is the years of frustration and heartbreak and believing in some guy who isn't ever going to get you there while the fan base argues about it.

Teams are going to overpay because let's face it, there isn't a supply of Goat qb's out there waiting to be drafted, so they go with what they know. But those overpays put a definite cap on their likelihood of ever winning it all. They hamstring the ability to build that great team around the average/good guy, and that in itself is really hard, most teams cannot pull it off, ever. I don't pretend to have an easy answer to the problem, like "just draft a qb every year". That process involves developing guys, getting them playing time, it's imo not realistic or teams would do it. You have to commit to some path, even if it's a bad one.

[MaroonBells]

I'm not understanding the bipolar switch you just had.

This is the message chain.  Comet52 said Trevor is average and is getting overpaid.  You replied to him carrying on the theme of him being average, and overpaid, but adding on "What were their options?"

I told you what the options are for not overpaying your average QB.  You can either plan ahead and try to find a rookie QB who's better than average, you can pay a lot for your average QB, or you can jump from average but expensive into the unknown and hope you land ok.

I'm not arguing that Trevor is good, average, or bad.  I don't think I've watched a single of his games since he was drafted, I just know that average QBs don't get you anything.  They just waste time.  Overpaying an average QB and not bringing in competition is how you waste a decade of your teams time.  At some point you need to bring in a guy that is top tier.  I would argue that it's much better to draft 5 QBs a decade in the first round trying to find the guy than it is to spend 10 years trying to win a SB with an average or slightly above average QB.

Your comments are not based in reality. They either pay their starting QB market value, or they don't and they start over. Those are the options. In other words, there are no real options. Of course they're going to pay the guy. 

Also, contracts aren't based on what a player has done as much as they are based on what they expect a player to do in the future. Trevor Lawrence is 24 years old. Same age as Michael Penix and Bo Nix. Heck, Khyree Jackson is 24. 

I said back during the season that he would get the biggest contract in history. I was wrong. He tied it.

[purplefaithful]

Ive never been wowed by Lawrence since he got to the NFL. He's also a poster child for how fans need to be patient with these young guys, it takes time.

I think @MB hit it - you are not paying a guy based on what he's done. It's about upside.

[StickierBuns]

Ive never been wowed by Lawrence since he got to the NFL. He's also a poster child for how fans need to be patient with these young guys, it takes time.

I think @MB hit it - you are not paying a guy based on what he's done. It's about upside.

Bet on the come if they show upside. Its always the way. What's the alternative?

---

Why does having an opinion that Lawrence isn't worth the money constitute "having an issue"?  It's just an opinion, Sticky.

The overpaid, average/good qb with a great team around him model is extremely hard.  Who's pulled it off recently?  The 49ers and they lost both times to ... the great qb.  That's the model that wins most of the time.  The other one is the years of frustration and heartbreak and believing in some guy who isn't ever going to get you there while the fan base argues about it. 

Teams are going to overpay because let's face it, there isn't a supply of Goat qb's out there waiting to be drafted, so they go with what they know.  But those overpays put a definite cap on their likelihood of ever winning it all.  They hamstring the ability to build that great team around the average/good guy, and that in itself is really hard, most teams cannot pull it off, ever.  I don't pretend to have an easy answer to the problem, like "just draft a qb every year".  That process involves developing guys, getting them playing time, it's imo not realistic or teams would do it.  You have to commit to some path, even if it's a bad one.

But why is the path 'a bad one'? You commit to what you think may happen because nothing is a guarantee. Its all hype until you strike gold. NFL GMs are just a bunch of gold miners.

[comet52]

Bet on the come if they show upside. Its always the way. What's the alternative?

---

But why is the path 'a bad one'? You commit to what you think may happen because nothing is a guarantee. Its all hype until you strike gold. NFL GMs are just a bunch of gold miners.

It's bad relative to having that generational qb talent and always being in the mix for a title. But there aren't enough goats to go around so teams have to settle for sheep.

[StickierBuns]

It's bad relative to having that generational qb talent and always being in the mix for a title.  But there aren't enough goats to go around so teams have to settle for sheep.

So what team other than KC has been in the 'mix for a title' every year? Other than Patrick Mahomes, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning? Kansas City, Tampa Bay (with Brady) and New England have won 5 of the last 6 Superbowls. Guys like Nick Foles and Matthew Stafford over the last 10 years are flukes. Russ Wilson wins one by throwing for a whopping 206 yards, it was the Legion of Boom. 

Generational QB talent is beyond scarce. The hope is a guy with talent, like Lawrence, will have a breakthrough year. Joe Flacco and Colin K. played in a Super Bowl. Trevor Lawrence sure as hell can get there with the right team around him. So on the list of top paid QBs, who's a generational talent other than Patrick Mahomes under your guidelines? This is the kind of fan think that is so goofy. They all get paid coin to become something the odds say they'll never become. Burrow, Jackson, Herbert, Hurts....why are they getting paid? None of them are in the mix every year, but can win it all under the right circumstances. Just like Trevor Lawrence. If you think this is bad, wait until you see the contract for Dak Prescott....it will eclipse them all. Jared Goff? Being paid big time. He's a generational talent? Nope, but he's been to a Superbowl and almost got there again with Detroit.

BET ON THE COME.

[comet52]

So what team other than KC has been in the 'mix for a title' every year? Other than Patrick Mahomes, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning? Kansas City, Tampa Bay (with Brady) and New England have won 5 of the last 6 Superbowls. Guys like Nick Foles and Matthew Stafford over the last 10 years are flukes. Russ Wilson wins one by throwing for a whopping 206 yards, it was the Legion of Boom. 

Generational QB talent is beyond scarce. The hope is a guy with talent, like Lawrence, will have a breakthrough year. Joe Flacco and Colin K. played in a Super Bowl. Trevor Lawrence sure as hell can get there with the right team around him. So on the list of top paid QBs, who's a generational talent other than Patrick Mahomes under your guidelines? This is the kind of fan think that is so goofy. They all get paid coin to become something the odds say they'll never become. Burrow, Jackson, Herbert, Hurts....why are they getting paid? None of them are in the mix every year, but can win it all under the right circumstances. Just like Trevor Lawrence. If you think this is bad, wait until you see the contract for Dak Prescott....it will eclipse them all. Jared Goff? Being paid big time. He's a generational talent? Nope, but he's been to a Superbowl and almost got there again with Detroit.

BET ON THE COME.

Listing average guys and saying they could get lucky...ok.

Mahomes, Burrow, Jackson, Allen. Maybe Herbert now that he isn't being coached by an utter moron. These are guys who could have you in the mix every year.

Used to be Brady, Rodgers, Wilson, Big Ben, etc. At any given time there are maybe 5 guys who fit the bill and are active/ in their prime. You want one of those guys WAY more than 'oh if we just make everything else perfect and get really lucky we might get to the SB where we'll probably lose if we happen to be facing one of the five top guys which is likely'.