Quote: @MaroonBells said:
Kurt Warner nails it...
I know many of you LOVE college football, but as I start to dive into these college QBs, it’s hard for me to even watch: very few play on schedule, the pass concepts are a mess most of the time, they run the same play over & over, a million bubble screens, can’t find many concepts that translate to next level… and then ppl are asked to figure out how good they will be at next level!? (Nearly impossible in my mind)
For me CJ Stroud is a great example - obviously really good in college & OSU runs more pro-style concepts than most but they didn’t ask him to process & get ball out as quickly as he did last year in HOU - so I had no idea he would be so good at processing so fast! He’s better in NFL than what we got to see in college, but many times you just don’t know until you know!
Every position is difficult to predict success from college to Pro's despite all the scouting. Of course, QB, being the most complicated position in all of sports, has a higher rate of bust. But if you hit you can be set for a decade plus. If you are constantly afraid to swing, you will never hit. This is why the GM's and staff are paid the big bucks to make tough decisions.
Quote: @minny65 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Kurt Warner nails it...
I know many of you LOVE college football, but as I start to dive into these college QBs, it’s hard for me to even watch: very few play on schedule, the pass concepts are a mess most of the time, they run the same play over & over, a million bubble screens, can’t find many concepts that translate to next level… and then ppl are asked to figure out how good they will be at next level!? (Nearly impossible in my mind)
For me CJ Stroud is a great example - obviously really good in college & OSU runs more pro-style concepts than most but they didn’t ask him to process & get ball out as quickly as he did last year in HOU - so I had no idea he would be so good at processing so fast! He’s better in NFL than what we got to see in college, but many times you just don’t know until you know!
Every position is difficult to predict success from college to Pro's despite all the scouting. Of course, QB, being the most complicated position in all of sports, has a higher rate of bust. But if you hit you can be set for a decade plus. If you are constantly afraid to swing, you will never hit. This is why the GM's and staff are paid the big bucks to make tough decisions.
Its easy....and less stressful and just as predictable a model:
![[Image: dart-darts.gif]](https://media1.tenor.com/m/uL94Q1zlRlsAAAAC/dart-darts.gif)
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Kurt Warner nails it...
I know many of you LOVE college football, but as I start to dive into these college QBs, it’s hard for me to even watch: very few play on schedule, the pass concepts are a mess most of the time, they run the same play over & over, a million bubble screens, can’t find many concepts that translate to next level… and then ppl are asked to figure out how good they will be at next level!? (Nearly impossible in my mind)
For me CJ Stroud is a great example - obviously really good in college & OSU runs more pro-style concepts than most but they didn’t ask him to process & get ball out as quickly as he did last year in HOU - so I had no idea he would be so good at processing so fast! He’s better in NFL than what we got to see in college, but many times you just don’t know until you know!
He sure does....
How any scout/coach can watch these guys playing college ball and extrapolate it out to the pro's is beyond comprehension.
All I can hope for as a fan is that they due their dilligence + get lucky. Luck is not something I associate with the Vikings.
Maybe the football gods will smile on em this time.
I don't know how anyone can watch a college football game on a Saturday afternoon and tell the difference between a 1st round QB and a 4th round QB. And even when you start breaking down the clips, you see so many of these guys with five minutes to throw and receivers with 10 yards of separation. NONE of that translates to the NFL. And if there's a guy who's used to that, he's probably going to struggle in the NFL.
It's why I am convinced they will resign Cousins. It will be expensive, but they can't afford not to.
If they don't, I predict we will see a new GM and HC after next season!
______________________
If Cousins signs with the Falcons, who have an offense that appears to be a QB away, and he takes that team deep into the playoffs, while the Vikings draft the next Bryce Young, Zach Wilson, Trubisky, Rosen or Lance, there is going to be a lot of egg on the face of this organization.
Why would there be egg? Atlanta is supposedly where we were when we signed Cousins, ( look how that turned out with him) our team needs large talent infusions at many positions before being a true contender, which can take several offseasons.
Sure some will say it could have been us, but they are likely wrong if the stared scenario were to play out. Kirk didn't make the difference for the Vikings, and he likely wouldn't be the deciding factor for the Falcons. Not to mention, what about the excuse of him not getting ot done due to having to learn a new system with a new OC?
If they want to over pay, that's the game, and maybe they have a great season, but it would be naive to say it could have been the Viikings if they had only paid more when there is so much more to fix here.
Quote:
If Cousins signs with the Falcons, who have an offense that appears to be a QB away, and he takes that team deep into the playoffs, while the Vikings draft the next Bryce Young, Zach Wilson, Trubisky, Rosen or Lance, there is going to be a lot of egg on the face of this organization.
Why would there be egg? Atlanta is supposedly where we were when we signed Cousins, ( look how that turned out with him) our team needs large talent infusions at many positions before being a true contender, which can take several offseasons.
Sure some will say it could have been us, but they are likely wrong if the stared scenario were to play out. Kirk didn't make the difference for the Vikings, and he likely wouldn't be the deciding factor for the Falcons. Not to mention, what about the excuse of him not getting ot done due to having to learn a new system with a new OC?
If they want to over pay, that's the game, and maybe they have a great season, but it would be naive to say it could have been the Viikings if they had only paid more when there is so much more to fix here.
_______________________________
The Vikings offensive line when Kirk was signed was atrocious. It went: Reiff, Compton, Elflein, Remmers and Rashod Hill. From the fairly average 2017 line, we'd lost our best offensive lineman (Joe Berger) to retirement, Nick Easton to a season ending injury and Remmers to an ill-advised move to RG. We started to rebuild our line that year, but then the defense started to falter, finishing 27th, 30th and 31st over the next three seasons. The line is now complete and BFlo improved the defense from 31st to 12th. Suffice to say, both of these teams are contenders with Cousins at QB. Neither is without him.
But if you think everything's going to be hunky dory in Minnyland if Cousins turns the Falcons into a contender (he will) while the Vikings slag through the next Trey Lance or a Zach Wilson, you're being naive. There will be Wilves at the door.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
If Cousins signs with the Falcons, who have an offense that appears to be a QB away, and he takes that team deep into the playoffs, while the Vikings draft the next Bryce Young, Zach Wilson, Trubisky, Rosen or Lance, there is going to be a lot of egg on the face of this organization.
Why would there be egg? Atlanta is supposedly where we were when we signed Cousins, ( look how that turned out with him) our team needs large talent infusions at many positions before being a true contender, which can take several offseasons.
Sure some will say it could have been us, but they are likely wrong if the stared scenario were to play out. Kirk didn't make the difference for the Vikings, and he likely wouldn't be the deciding factor for the Falcons. Not to mention, what about the excuse of him not getting ot done due to having to learn a new system with a new OC?
If they want to over pay, that's the game, and maybe they have a great season, but it would be naive to say it could have been the Viikings if they had only paid more when there is so much more to fix here.
_______________________________
The Vikings offensive line when Kirk was signed was atrocious. It went: Reiff, Compton, Elflein, Remmers and Rashod Hill. From the fairly average 2017 line, we'd lost our best offensive lineman (Joe Berger) to retirement, Nick Easton to a season ending injury and Remmers to an ill-advised move to RG. We started to rebuild our line that year, but then the defense started to falter, finishing 27th, 30th and 31st over the next three seasons. The line is now complete and BFlo improved the defense from 31st to 12th. Suffice to say, both of these teams are contenders with Cousins at QB. Neither is without him.
But if you think everything's going to be hunky dory in Minnyland if Cousins turns the Falcons into a contender (he will) while the Vikings slag through the next Trey Lance or a Zach Wilson, you're being naive. There will be Wilves at the door.
the general notion when we signed Kirk was that Keenum was the problem ( (I argued against signing Kirk then for the same reasons I do now, we dont have the OL for an immobile QB like Cousins ) I know the OL was an issue back then, just like I know it is now, and my arguments havent changed because we now have a 2nd GM and Coach that fail to see that the game is won from the trenches and paying big money to a statue pocket passer with a shit IOL is just pissing money down their legs.
as far as wolves at the door, they should be in the fucking house since kirks been here 6 years, we still have IOL issues, except now the rest of the roster ( minus WR ) has gone to shit, and we are much further from competing for a Lombardi than we were when we signed him. Adding Kirk fixed nothing and changed nothing except his bank account. we still need to fix the OL and we still need to be shopping for a QB.
"the line is now complete" are you fucking kidding me? Are you still of the notion that Bradbury is a competent NFL center? We need a new center and likely at least 1 new OG, the line is far from complete, especially when they will need continuity time to really see if they are worth a shit as a unity.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
Kurt Warner nails it...
I know many of you LOVE college football, but as I start to dive into these college QBs, it’s hard for me to even watch: very few play on schedule, the pass concepts are a mess most of the time, they run the same play over & over, a million bubble screens, can’t find many concepts that translate to next level… and then ppl are asked to figure out how good they will be at next level!? (Nearly impossible in my mind)
For me CJ Stroud is a great example - obviously really good in college & OSU runs more pro-style concepts than most but they didn’t ask him to process & get ball out as quickly as he did last year in HOU - so I had no idea he would be so good at processing so fast! He’s better in NFL than what we got to see in college, but many times you just don’t know until you know!
That's a strange take. I didn't have any trouble identifying Stroud as the best in last year's draft and Young as a very likely bust. Kurt was a good qb but plenty of ex-qb's aren't necessarily great at college scouting. Kurt should probably start watching JT O'Sullivan's Youtube channel and pick up some scouting pointers. :p Teams spend a lot of money on it and still struggle to get it right. Maybe I should apply for a scout job... =)
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MaroonBells said:
If Cousins signs with the Falcons, who have an offense that appears to be a QB away, and he takes that team deep into the playoffs, while the Vikings draft the next Bryce Young, Zach Wilson, Trubisky, Rosen or Lance, there is going to be a lot of egg on the face of this organization.
Why would there be egg? Atlanta is supposedly where we were when we signed Cousins, ( look how that turned out with him) our team needs large talent infusions at many positions before being a true contender, which can take several offseasons.
Sure some will say it could have been us, but they are likely wrong if the stared scenario were to play out. Kirk didn't make the difference for the Vikings, and he likely wouldn't be the deciding factor for the Falcons. Not to mention, what about the excuse of him not getting ot done due to having to learn a new system with a new OC?
If they want to over pay, that's the game, and maybe they have a great season, but it would be naive to say it could have been the Viikings if they had only paid more when there is so much more to fix here.
_______________________________
The Vikings offensive line when Kirk was signed was atrocious. It went: Reiff, Compton, Elflein, Remmers and Rashod Hill. From the fairly average 2017 line, we'd lost our best offensive lineman (Joe Berger) to retirement, Nick Easton to a season ending injury and Remmers to an ill-advised move to RG. We started to rebuild our line that year, but then the defense started to falter, finishing 27th, 30th and 31st over the next three seasons. The line is now complete and BFlo improved the defense from 31st to 12th. Suffice to say, both of these teams are contenders with Cousins at QB. Neither is without him.
But if you think everything's going to be hunky dory in Minnyland if Cousins turns the Falcons into a contender (he will) while the Vikings slag through the next Trey Lance or a Zach Wilson, you're being naive. There will be Wilves at the door.
the general notion when we signed Kirk was that Keenum was the problem ( (I argued against signing Kirk then for the same reasons I do now, we dont have the OL for an immobile QB like Cousins ) I know the OL was an issue back then, just like I know it is now, and my arguments havent changed because we now have a 2nd GM and Coach that fail to see that the game is won from the trenches and paying big money to a statue pocket passer with a shit IOL is just pissing money down their legs.
as far as wolves at the door, they should be in the fucking house since kirks been here 6 years, we still have IOL issues, except now the rest of the roster ( minus WR ) has gone to shit, and we are much further from competing for a Lombardi than we were when we signed him. Adding Kirk fixed nothing and changed nothing except his bank account. we still need to fix the OL and we still need to be shopping for a QB.
"the line is now complete" are you fucking kidding me? Are you still of the notion that Bradbury is a competent NFL center? We need a new center and likely at least 1 new OG, the line is far from complete, especially when they will need continuity time to really see if they are worth a shit as a unity.
The line was complete two years ago, when every player on it was under 26 and taken in the 1st or 2nd round. Good, bad or otherwise, that’s a rebuild. Now, obviously, not every draft pick in a rebuild is going to be 100% successful. But it’s also obvious that our line is quite a bit better than you think it is. I know you don’t trust PFF but they also ranked top 10 by ESPN, SIS, PFN and Player Profiler, among others.
Either way, the line improved a lot over the last two years, and it’s a helluva lot better than it was in 2018. But as I’ve said before, I think there’s an even chance we release Bradbury and try to upgrade the center position. For whatever reason—maybe the QB rotation, maybe his back—he was a top 10 center the first half of the season and a bottom 10 center the second half of the season.
But even you can’t possibly believe the Vikings would’ve missed the playoffs with a healthy Kirk Cousins, considering he was the NFL’s leading passer at the time and they had just beaten the 49ers and Packers without Justin Jefferson.
Jets have given Zach Wilson permission to seek a trade. Might be worth taking a swing at if we can't land what we want in the draft. We'll need a reclamation project of some type to back up Cousins
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
Jets have given Zach Wilson permission to seek a trade. Might be worth taking a swing at if we can't land what we want in the draft. We'll need a reclamation project of some type to back up Cousins
I dont know about that...
You ever see pix of KOC's wife?
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