8/3 was an awful day in this country....

[Guest]

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:
"Thoughts and prayers" needs to go away. It solves nothing. 

Here's one of the major problems:

"We cannot allow all of these people to invade our Country [sic - because he's an idiot]. When somebody comes in, we must immediately, with no Judge [sic] or Court Cases [sic], bring them back from where they came. Our system is a mockery to good immigration policy and Law and Order[sic - this isn't the TV show, no need to capitalize, dummy]. Most children come without parents..." - President Baby

THIS guy is a major part of the problem. We have a gun control problem, a mental health problem, but the latest catalyst is a mentally ill narcissistic dick head riling up easily-influenced stupid people. Impeach this fucking guy now. It's only going to get worse. 

There will ALWAYS be stupid people, but we need to collectively work together to stop emboldening them. He's doing it for his ego (and votes). 

good thing once hes out of office it will go back to the way it was before him when there were no gun problems,  no racial issues, no immigration problems,  mental health was dealt with... 

oh wait.  we had all those things before he was elected.

We did, thanks to Republican agendas. And he's made them way worse.

You're not gonna win this one. I'm right and you know it.

I think you should seek help.  I really believe you might have narcissistic personality disorder. 

Here's a google search for a internet test but I really think you might need a professional:  https://www.psycom.net/narcissistic-pers...order-test

[Guest]

@pumpf said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:

@pumpf said:
Typical.  

The El Paso shooter may have been a Trump supporter.  But you know what else he was?  The product of a broken family.  Like the vast majority (26/27 in 2018) of mass shooters, his parents got divorced when he was young.  Over 90% of inmates come from broken homes... as well as 75% of rapists.  There are other stats I could post, but I'm too lazy to do it now.  

Divorce is the one, single thing that the vast majority of shooters have in common.  The Ohio shooter was a staunch Democrat... and an atheist / Satan worshiper.  But- strangely- that didn't get mentioned.  (By the way, his parents were still married, making him the exception to the rule).  But he did commit various "crimes" while in HS that should've not only warned his parents to do something... but also precluded him from being able to buy a gun.

As usual, it APPEARS that the only reason some people care about shooting victims... is to further their political ideology (i.e. "win" a fight).  That is REALLY sad.

Suncoast is correct: it is a mental health issue.  Obviously divorce has a terribly profound- and negative- impact on children.  Not every child who comes out of a divorced family is going to go on a shooting rampage... just as not every Sunday School student (from an intact family) grows up to be a saint.  But clearly there is a correlation here... one that no one wants to confront, because it would mean that our choices- as adults- matter... and can negatively impact our future children.  Acknowledging that would mean that we have- perhaps unintentionally- contributed to these terrible events.  And since no one wants that on their conscience, it is much easier to blame the big, bad orange man.  

You're such a fake Christian. You'll support separating children from their parents at the border because, as you said, laws are laws. But when a right-wing fuck shoots up a public place, you find out he's a Trump supporter and go on the defensive.

Fuck you, man.

once again with the lack of civility.   i thought you were done with this place?  apparently your self imposed time off wasnt effective.   keep it civil or you will be gone.

You've got me there, it's tough to stay logged out when you're proven right time and again. Unfortunately, I have to remind simple people like yourself how correct I am and have been over a mass shooting.

Lack of civility? Certainly. It's come to that. Time to call out this phony Christian conservative nonsense for what it is. 

so you are saying you cant be adult and civil?   thats what I am getting here,  you are not willing to follow the rules of the board?

I'm talking to other adults. If bad language upsets another adult, that's on them.

If you're so "adult" then how about you actually debate the facts that I presented?  You claim to be "right", but all you've offered is the opinion: that anyone who disagrees with you is wrong.  But FACTS are what win arguments, not opinions.  And the fact is that the ONE THING that the vast majority of shooters- 97% (and inmates-90%... and rapists-73%... and drug abusers-71%... and people living below the poverty line... and lower academic scores... and suicide rates...) have in common: is that they come out of "broken" homes.  Those are DOJ stats, not opinions.

Not every shooter is a conservative.  Not every shooter is a liberal.  Not every shooter is a Christian.  Not every shooter is an atheist.  But 97% of them are men who grew up in homes that didn't have a father present.  That couldn't possibly have anything to do with it, could it?  I GUARANTEE you that- if 97% of the shooters were conservatives... or called themselves "Christians"- you would ABSOLUTELY blame that for the shootings.  You know you would.  So why do you have such a hard time recognizing that these "homes" have something to do with the mental problems that these shooters have?    

 

Okay what's your solution? Do you have a plan in place to stop people from coming from broken homes?

And, cue Christian dogma in 3, 2, 1...

[Guest]

@AGRforever said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:
"Thoughts and prayers" needs to go away. It solves nothing. 

Here's one of the major problems:

"We cannot allow all of these people to invade our Country [sic - because he's an idiot]. When somebody comes in, we must immediately, with no Judge [sic] or Court Cases [sic], bring them back from where they came. Our system is a mockery to good immigration policy and Law and Order[sic - this isn't the TV show, no need to capitalize, dummy]. Most children come without parents..." - President Baby

THIS guy is a major part of the problem. We have a gun control problem, a mental health problem, but the latest catalyst is a mentally ill narcissistic dick head riling up easily-influenced stupid people. Impeach this fucking guy now. It's only going to get worse. 

There will ALWAYS be stupid people, but we need to collectively work together to stop emboldening them. He's doing it for his ego (and votes). 

good thing once hes out of office it will go back to the way it was before him when there were no gun problems,  no racial issues, no immigration problems,  mental health was dealt with... 

oh wait.  we had all those things before he was elected.

We did, thanks to Republican agendas. And he's made them way worse.

You're not gonna win this one. I'm right and you know it.

I think you should seek help.  I really believe you might have narcissistic personality disorder. 

Here's a google search for a internet test but I really think you might need a professional:  https://www.psycom.net/narcissistic-pers...order-test

Trump has that, I don't.

[Guest]

@pumpf said:

@MaroonBells said:

@pumpf said:
Typical.  

The El Paso shooter may have been a Trump supporter.  But you know what else he was?  The product of a broken family.  Like the vast majority (26/27 in 2018) of mass shooters, his parents got divorced when he was young.  Over 90% of inmates come from broken homes... as well as 75% of rapists.  There are other stats I could post, but I'm too lazy to do it now.  

Divorce is the one, single thing that the vast majority of shooters have in common.  The Ohio shooter was a staunch Democrat... and an atheist / Satan worshiper.  But- strangely- that didn't get mentioned.  (By the way, his parents were still married, making him the exception to the rule).  But he did commit various "crimes" while in HS that should've not only warned his parents to do something... but also precluded him from being able to buy a gun.

As usual, it APPEARS that the only reason some people care about shooting victims... is to further their political ideology (i.e. "win" a fight).  That is REALLY sad.

Suncoast is correct: it is a mental health issue.  Obviously divorce has a terribly profound- and negative- impact on children.  Not every child who comes out of a divorced family is going to go on a shooting rampage... just as not every Sunday School student (from an intact family) grows up to be a saint.  But clearly there is a correlation here... one that no one wants to confront, because it would mean that our choices- as adults- matter... and can negatively impact our future children.  Acknowledging that would mean that we have- perhaps unintentionally- contributed to these terrible events.  And since no one wants that on their conscience, it is much easier to blame the big, bad orange man.  

Unbelievable. So you just LEAVE OUT the part where he talks about the hispanic invasion of Texas, building the wall, defending Trump...and blame it on...divorce? Man, you are a piece of work. 

I'm a piece of work?  You blame Trump for the El Paso shooter... and COMPLETELY IGNORE the Ohio shooter.  Why is that?  
As for the El Paso shooter being a Trump supporter (and racist): so what?  If you think that his allegiance to Trump was the reason for his rampage... then you ought to be saying the same things about other shooters (identifying their political allegiances).  But I have NEVER seen you- or any of the other liberals here- comment on the political leanings of any other evil-doer... EXCEPT those who were Trump supporters.  That tells me that you don't give a rip about the victims.  You only care about attacking Trump (which, I think, has been proven time and time again).  

Yeah, I am a piece of work.  Instead of trying to score political points, I'm actually trying to identify the REAL causes of these things, so that- maybe- they can be prevented in the future.

Now, would you care to argue the facts... or just attack the messenger?

Are you 11 years old? As far as I know, the Dayton shooting was not politically motivated. The dude shot his own sister for Christ's sake. The El Paso shooting clearly was. Angry about immigrants and "the Hispanic invasion of Texas," dude drives to a border town and shoots 22 innocent men, women and children...and YOU want to talk about the "REAL" cause of this thing: DIVORCE. Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds? I'm really curious to know why you are so afraid to condemn racism. 

[Guest]

@KingBash said:

@pumpf said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:

@pumpf said:
Typical.  

The El Paso shooter may have been a Trump supporter.  But you know what else he was?  The product of a broken family.  Like the vast majority (26/27 in 2018) of mass shooters, his parents got divorced when he was young.  Over 90% of inmates come from broken homes... as well as 75% of rapists.  There are other stats I could post, but I'm too lazy to do it now.  

Divorce is the one, single thing that the vast majority of shooters have in common.  The Ohio shooter was a staunch Democrat... and an atheist / Satan worshiper.  But- strangely- that didn't get mentioned.  (By the way, his parents were still married, making him the exception to the rule).  But he did commit various "crimes" while in HS that should've not only warned his parents to do something... but also precluded him from being able to buy a gun.

As usual, it APPEARS that the only reason some people care about shooting victims... is to further their political ideology (i.e. "win" a fight).  That is REALLY sad.

Suncoast is correct: it is a mental health issue.  Obviously divorce has a terribly profound- and negative- impact on children.  Not every child who comes out of a divorced family is going to go on a shooting rampage... just as not every Sunday School student (from an intact family) grows up to be a saint.  But clearly there is a correlation here... one that no one wants to confront, because it would mean that our choices- as adults- matter... and can negatively impact our future children.  Acknowledging that would mean that we have- perhaps unintentionally- contributed to these terrible events.  And since no one wants that on their conscience, it is much easier to blame the big, bad orange man.  

You're such a fake Christian. You'll support separating children from their parents at the border because, as you said, laws are laws. But when a right-wing fuck shoots up a public place, you find out he's a Trump supporter and go on the defensive.

Fuck you, man.

once again with the lack of civility.   i thought you were done with this place?  apparently your self imposed time off wasnt effective.   keep it civil or you will be gone.

You've got me there, it's tough to stay logged out when you're proven right time and again. Unfortunately, I have to remind simple people like yourself how correct I am and have been over a mass shooting.

Lack of civility? Certainly. It's come to that. Time to call out this phony Christian conservative nonsense for what it is. 

so you are saying you cant be adult and civil?   thats what I am getting here,  you are not willing to follow the rules of the board?

I'm talking to other adults. If bad language upsets another adult, that's on them.

If you're so "adult" then how about you actually debate the facts that I presented?  You claim to be "right", but all you've offered is the opinion: that anyone who disagrees with you is wrong.  But FACTS are what win arguments, not opinions.  And the fact is that the ONE THING that the vast majority of shooters- 97% (and inmates-90%... and rapists-73%... and drug abusers-71%... and people living below the poverty line... and lower academic scores... and suicide rates...) have in common: is that they come out of "broken" homes.  Those are DOJ stats, not opinions.

Not every shooter is a conservative.  Not every shooter is a liberal.  Not every shooter is a Christian.  Not every shooter is an atheist.  But 97% of them are men who grew up in homes that didn't have a father present.  That couldn't possibly have anything to do with it, could it?  I GUARANTEE you that- if 97% of the shooters were conservatives... or called themselves "Christians"- you would ABSOLUTELY blame that for the shootings.  You know you would.  So why do you have such a hard time recognizing that these "homes" have something to do with the mental problems that these shooters have?    

 

Okay what's your solution? Do you have a plan in place to stop people from coming from broken homes?

And, cue Christian dogma in 3, 2, 1...

Make better choices leading up to marriage (things that are proven to make divorce MUCH less likely... while, at the same time, making it much MORE likely that the couple will have a much higher level of marital satisfaction)... and then stay married.  People make it seem like there are only 2 choices when troubles come in a marriage: be unhappy for the rest of your life... or get a divorce.  There are other options.

There a proven things that people can do to make their marriages healthy.  But most people don't want to do those things, choosing immediate gratification over long-term happiness.  But immediate gratification has it's consequences, which no one (it seems) ever wants to talk about.  So then the cycle continues... and nobody understands why these things keep happening.

[Guest]

@MaroonBells said:

@pumpf said:

@MaroonBells said:

@pumpf said:
Typical.  

The El Paso shooter may have been a Trump supporter.  But you know what else he was?  The product of a broken family.  Like the vast majority (26/27 in 2018) of mass shooters, his parents got divorced when he was young.  Over 90% of inmates come from broken homes... as well as 75% of rapists.  There are other stats I could post, but I'm too lazy to do it now.  

Divorce is the one, single thing that the vast majority of shooters have in common.  The Ohio shooter was a staunch Democrat... and an atheist / Satan worshiper.  But- strangely- that didn't get mentioned.  (By the way, his parents were still married, making him the exception to the rule).  But he did commit various "crimes" while in HS that should've not only warned his parents to do something... but also precluded him from being able to buy a gun.

As usual, it APPEARS that the only reason some people care about shooting victims... is to further their political ideology (i.e. "win" a fight).  That is REALLY sad.

Suncoast is correct: it is a mental health issue.  Obviously divorce has a terribly profound- and negative- impact on children.  Not every child who comes out of a divorced family is going to go on a shooting rampage... just as not every Sunday School student (from an intact family) grows up to be a saint.  But clearly there is a correlation here... one that no one wants to confront, because it would mean that our choices- as adults- matter... and can negatively impact our future children.  Acknowledging that would mean that we have- perhaps unintentionally- contributed to these terrible events.  And since no one wants that on their conscience, it is much easier to blame the big, bad orange man.  

Unbelievable. So you just LEAVE OUT the part where he talks about the hispanic invasion of Texas, building the wall, defending Trump...and blame it on...divorce? Man, you are a piece of work. 

I'm a piece of work?  You blame Trump for the El Paso shooter... and COMPLETELY IGNORE the Ohio shooter.  Why is that?  
As for the El Paso shooter being a Trump supporter (and racist): so what?  If you think that his allegiance to Trump was the reason for his rampage... then you ought to be saying the same things about other shooters (identifying their political allegiances).  But I have NEVER seen you- or any of the other liberals here- comment on the political leanings of any other evil-doer... EXCEPT those who were Trump supporters.  That tells me that you don't give a rip about the victims.  You only care about attacking Trump (which, I think, has been proven time and time again).  

Yeah, I am a piece of work.  Instead of trying to score political points, I'm actually trying to identify the REAL causes of these things, so that- maybe- they can be prevented in the future.

Now, would you care to argue the facts... or just attack the messenger?

Are you 11 years old? As far as I know, the Dayton shooting was not politically motivated. The dude shot his own sister for Christ's sake. The El Paso shooting clearly was. Angry about immigrants and "the Hispanic invasion of Texas," dude drives to a border town and shoots 22 innocent men, women and children...and YOU want to talk about the "REAL" cause of this thing: DIVORCE. Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds? I'm really curious to know why you are so afraid to condemn racism. 

Love the "Jerk" reference!  But I'm confused why you think I'm "afraid" to condemn racism?  I said that the guy was (from all reports) a racist.  And I think that it goes without saying that- when that is actually true about a person- it is a terrible thing.  But just because the guy was a racist, that doesn't mean that that was his motivation- does it?  I haven't read his manifesto, so maybe he was intending to kill a bunch of Hispanic people.  But, near as I can tell, he was just another evil guy... who did an evil thing.  In fact, if you wanted to say that his act was racially motivated... go ahead.  But that doesn't explain the dozens of OTHER shootings.  They aren't all done by racists.  So what do all these shooters have in common?

If you want to blame Trump... go ahead.  But these things happened before Trump was in office, too.  It seems like you want to score political points; I'm trying to find the "root" cause of these things.  I don't know how else a problem can be solved- unless you know the cause.  Who knows?  Maybe the divorce was what led the El Paso shooter to become a racist?

Now, as much as I enjoy our banter, are you going to address the stats that I posted?  It's almost like the facts were cans...

[Guest]

@pumpf said:

@MaroonBells said:

@pumpf said:

@MaroonBells said:

@pumpf said:
Typical.  

The El Paso shooter may have been a Trump supporter.  But you know what else he was?  The product of a broken family.  Like the vast majority (26/27 in 2018) of mass shooters, his parents got divorced when he was young.  Over 90% of inmates come from broken homes... as well as 75% of rapists.  There are other stats I could post, but I'm too lazy to do it now.  

Divorce is the one, single thing that the vast majority of shooters have in common.  The Ohio shooter was a staunch Democrat... and an atheist / Satan worshiper.  But- strangely- that didn't get mentioned.  (By the way, his parents were still married, making him the exception to the rule).  But he did commit various "crimes" while in HS that should've not only warned his parents to do something... but also precluded him from being able to buy a gun.

As usual, it APPEARS that the only reason some people care about shooting victims... is to further their political ideology (i.e. "win" a fight).  That is REALLY sad.

Suncoast is correct: it is a mental health issue.  Obviously divorce has a terribly profound- and negative- impact on children.  Not every child who comes out of a divorced family is going to go on a shooting rampage... just as not every Sunday School student (from an intact family) grows up to be a saint.  But clearly there is a correlation here... one that no one wants to confront, because it would mean that our choices- as adults- matter... and can negatively impact our future children.  Acknowledging that would mean that we have- perhaps unintentionally- contributed to these terrible events.  And since no one wants that on their conscience, it is much easier to blame the big, bad orange man.  

Unbelievable. So you just LEAVE OUT the part where he talks about the hispanic invasion of Texas, building the wall, defending Trump...and blame it on...divorce? Man, you are a piece of work. 

I'm a piece of work?  You blame Trump for the El Paso shooter... and COMPLETELY IGNORE the Ohio shooter.  Why is that?  
As for the El Paso shooter being a Trump supporter (and racist): so what?  If you think that his allegiance to Trump was the reason for his rampage... then you ought to be saying the same things about other shooters (identifying their political allegiances).  But I have NEVER seen you- or any of the other liberals here- comment on the political leanings of any other evil-doer... EXCEPT those who were Trump supporters.  That tells me that you don't give a rip about the victims.  You only care about attacking Trump (which, I think, has been proven time and time again).  

Yeah, I am a piece of work.  Instead of trying to score political points, I'm actually trying to identify the REAL causes of these things, so that- maybe- they can be prevented in the future.

Now, would you care to argue the facts... or just attack the messenger?

Are you 11 years old? As far as I know, the Dayton shooting was not politically motivated. The dude shot his own sister for Christ's sake. The El Paso shooting clearly was. Angry about immigrants and "the Hispanic invasion of Texas," dude drives to a border town and shoots 22 innocent men, women and children...and YOU want to talk about the "REAL" cause of this thing: DIVORCE. Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds? I'm really curious to know why you are so afraid to condemn racism. 

Love the "Jerk" reference!  But I'm confused why you think I'm "afraid" to condemn racism?  I said that the guy was (from all reports) a racist.  And I think that it goes without saying that- when that is actually true about a person- it is a terrible thing.  But just because the guy was a racist, that doesn't mean that that was his motivation- does it?  I haven't read his manifesto, so maybe he was intending to kill a bunch of Hispanic people.  But, near as I can tell, he was just another evil guy... who did an evil thing.  In fact, if you wanted to say that his act was racially motivated... go ahead.  But that doesn't explain the dozens of OTHER shootings.  They aren't all done by racists.  So what do all these shooters have in common?

If you want to blame Trump... go ahead.  But these things happened before Trump was in office, too.  It seems like you want to score political points; I'm trying to find the "root" cause of these things.  I don't know how else a problem can be solved- unless you know the cause.  Who knows?  Maybe the divorce was what led the El Paso shooter to become a racist?

Now, as much as I enjoy our banter, are you going to address the stats that I posted?  It's almost like the facts were cans...

I have not said one word about Trump, except to quote the manifesto (interesting that you haven't read it, but somehow know the non-politically motivated Dayton shooter was a Democrat). No, I'm talking about the thing that you have so much trouble admitting is a big problem in America. RACISM. And I have no idea what stats you're referring to. You do this a lot. You refer to something you said somewhere and accuse someone else of not addressing that, as if you made some kind of great point that everyone should have read. 

[Guest]

@KingBash said:

@AGRforever said:

@KingBash said:

@JimmyinSD said:

@KingBash said:
"Thoughts and prayers" needs to go away. It solves nothing. 

Here's one of the major problems:

"We cannot allow all of these people to invade our Country [sic - because he's an idiot]. When somebody comes in, we must immediately, with no Judge [sic] or Court Cases [sic], bring them back from where they came. Our system is a mockery to good immigration policy and Law and Order[sic - this isn't the TV show, no need to capitalize, dummy]. Most children come without parents..." - President Baby

THIS guy is a major part of the problem. We have a gun control problem, a mental health problem, but the latest catalyst is a mentally ill narcissistic dick head riling up easily-influenced stupid people. Impeach this fucking guy now. It's only going to get worse. 

There will ALWAYS be stupid people, but we need to collectively work together to stop emboldening them. He's doing it for his ego (and votes). 

good thing once hes out of office it will go back to the way it was before him when there were no gun problems,  no racial issues, no immigration problems,  mental health was dealt with... 

oh wait.  we had all those things before he was elected.

We did, thanks to Republican agendas. And he's made them way worse.

You're not gonna win this one. I'm right and you know it.

I think you should seek help.  I really believe you might have narcissistic personality disorder. 

Here's a google search for a internet test but I really think you might need a professional:  https://www.psycom.net/narcissistic-pers...order-test

Trump has that, I don't.

exactly what a narcissist would say. you both likelyhave it. he just has smaller fingers. 

[Guest]

@MaroonBells said:

@"

I have not said one word about Trump, except to quote the manifesto (interesting that you haven't read it, but somehow know the non-politically motivated Dayton shooter was a Democrat). No, I'm talking about the thing that you have so much trouble admitting is a big problem in America. RACISM. And I have no idea what stats you're referring to. You do this a lot. You refer to something you said somewhere and accuse someone else of not addressing that, as if you made some kind of great point that everyone should have read. 

Here's one "snippet" of the research that's been done... as presented by NPR (which, I assume, you won't have an issue with):https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2017/06/18/533062607/poverty-dropouts-pregnancy-suicide-what-the-numbers-say-about-fatherless-kids

Here's a more comprehensive one, based on stats from various gov't sources.  But since it didn't come from a left-wing site, I'm doubtful that you'll believe it: www.thefatherlessgeneration.wordpress.com/statistics/

EDIT: Racism IS a problem; but I don't know that it is high on the list of "biggest" issues that our country is wrestling with.  I would counter by saying that our disposable view of life (that it's OK to destroy it if it becomes inconvenient to have around) is a much bigger issue.  The view of life- from the unborn to the elderly- has dramatically changed.  At one end of the spectrum, not only has abortion become a "cool" thing that is openly trumpeted (as opposed to the Clinton years when it was supposed to be rare but legal)... but a law that would prevent a child-born-alive from being killed was shot down as "controversial".  On the other end of the spectrum, you have more and more people being seduced by the "right to die" culture, which wants euthanasia legalized (even though we KNOW that it will be abused and used to put people to death against their will).  

Simply put: life is not considered precious anymore (at least not by large segments of our country, including the MSM).  What did you think would happen when "life" was reduced to nothing more than a commodity- which can be discarded (destroyed) when it fails to bring us the happiness that we crave. 

[Guest]

@purplefaithful said:
Prayers go out to the survivors in Tx and Ohio.

How in the world do we better control people who shouldn't have guns from having guns? I'm not smart enough to answer that one.

Maybe the health care system is letting us down too? There's a # of mentally ill people probably not getting anywhere near the treatment they should be getting. 

Mentally ill people are in every country of this planet.

The difference is the easy access to guns, and the absolute sick fascination of them in our culture.