My accountant warned me this year was going to be difficult with all of the changing codes/laws/rules...Folks are now starting to see their own realities.
Many Americans will need to build in the process of checking in on fed/state withholdings a couple times a year for a while - until everything is recalibrated.
Unless of course you own your own jet, intercostal FL property or golf resort...
Quote: @"StickyBun" said:
@"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
Amazon paid zero Federal taxes this year!
Did anyone really expect the trickle-down to be anything other then a golden shower?
My Federal taxes are up about $3000 this year but as others stated, because State still allows itemized, I get $100 bucks back.
Try telling that to New York
Amazon backed out of NY for their HQ2.
I know. And now, instead of getting (up to) $30 Billion in new tax revenues, New York is getting nothing. $3 Billion in tax incentives vs. $30 Billion in tax income? Seems like the math favors giving the company the tax break now, for the extra "income" later. And don't forget the 25,000 jobs that were going to be added, at an average salary of $150,000 each (which may not be much in NYC, I don't know).
But, hooray! Thanks to AOC, the state/city successfully spurned Amazon. By sticking to their "principles", she managed to cost them money and jobs! Now some other state will have to "suffer" the effects of "trickle-down" economics. Frankly, I hope it's MN. We could use the extra $30 Billion.
Quote: @"pumpf" said:
@"StickyBun" said:
@"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
Amazon paid zero Federal taxes this year!
Did anyone really expect the trickle-down to be anything other then a golden shower?
My Federal taxes are up about $3000 this year but as others stated, because State still allows itemized, I get $100 bucks back.
Try telling that to New York
Amazon backed out of NY for their HQ2.
I know. And now, instead of getting (up to) $30 Billion in new tax revenues, New York is getting nothing. $3 Billion in tax incentives vs. $30 Billion in tax income? Seems like the math favors giving the company the tax break now, for the extra "income" later. And don't forget the 25,000 jobs that were going to be added, at an average salary of $150,000 each (which may not be much in NYC, I don't know).
But, hooray! Thanks to AOC, the state/city successfully spurned Amazon. By sticking to their "principles", she managed to cost them money and jobs! Now some other state will have to "suffer" the effects of "trickle-down" economics. Frankly, I hope it's MN. We could use the extra $30 Billion.
AOC was certainly not the only person opposed to HQ2 in New York. Just like in Denver, there was quite a vocal opposition. Not everyone is impacted positively by that kind of thing. For example, I own property so it would be good for me. I would imagine that my renters would be opposed.
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do 
Quote: @"minny65" said:
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do
First of all, what does Christianity have to do with it? That seems like an odd thing to bring into a conversation about taxes.
Second of all, can you offer some economic argument that would make AOC's position seem like the right thing to do for NY?
Thirdly, there is a difference between corporate "welfare" and good business sense. When the gov't gave money (not necessarily just tax incentives) to green solar companies, did you complain? Oh, and it amounted to ALOT more than $3 Billion:
The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:
- Evergreen Solar ($25 million)*
- SpectraWatt ($500,000)*
- Solyndra ($535 million)*
- Beacon Power ($43 million)*
- Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)
- SunPower ($1.2 billion)
- First Solar ($1.46 billion)
- Babcock and Brown ($178 million)
- EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*
- Amonix ($5.9 million)
- Fisker Automotive ($529 million)
- Abound Solar ($400 million)*
- A123 Systems ($279 million)*
- Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($700,981)*
- Johnson Controls ($299 million)
- Brightsource ($1.6 billion)
- ECOtality ($126.2 million)
- Raser Technologies ($33 million)*
- Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*
- Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*
- Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*
- Range Fuels ($80 million)*
- Thompson River Power ($6.5 million)*
- Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*
- Azure Dynamics ($5.4 million)*
- GreenVolts ($500,000)
- Vestas ($50 million)
- LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($151 million)
- Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*
- Navistar ($39 million)
- Satcon ($3 million)*
- Konarka Technologies Inc. ($20 million)*
- Mascoma Corp. ($100 million)
*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.
If a municipality wants to give tax breaks to a business, with the idea that it will make more money for them (the municipality) in the long run- and provide jobs for their citizens, that seems like a smart thing to do. But then I'm no economist...
Quote: @"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do
First of all, what does Christianity have to do with it? That seems like an odd thing to bring into a conversation about taxes.
Second of all, can you offer some economic argument that would make AOC's position seem like the right thing to do for NY?
Thirdly, there is a difference between corporate "welfare" and good business sense. When the gov't gave money (not necessarily just tax incentives) to green solar companies, did you complain? Oh, and it amounted to ALOT more than $3 Billion:
Why does it have to be an economic argument? One of the loudest arguments heard in Denver was about traffic. People do actually care about quality of life. And it's not always about money, especially if you're not among those who would qualify for one of those $150K jobs. And why would anyone complain about giving money to green companies? That's the whole idea, isn't it? To incentivize renewable technologies? Surely you're not against that.
Yes, your list of 19 bankrupt green energy companies looks impressive...until you realize that companies go bankrupt all the time. In fact, 114 oil and gas companies when bankrupt in 2015 and 2016 alone.
Quote: @"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do
First of all, what does Christianity have to do with it? That seems like an odd thing to bring into a conversation about taxes.
Second of all, can you offer some economic argument that would make AOC's position seem like the right thing to do for NY?
Thirdly, there is a difference between corporate "welfare" and good business sense. When the gov't gave money (not necessarily just tax incentives) to green solar companies, did you complain? Oh, and it amounted to ALOT more than $3 Billion:
The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:
- Evergreen Solar ($25 million)*
- SpectraWatt ($500,000)*
- Solyndra ($535 million)*
- Beacon Power ($43 million)*
- Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)
- SunPower ($1.2 billion)
- First Solar ($1.46 billion)
- Babcock and Brown ($178 million)
- EnerDel’s subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*
- Amonix ($5.9 million)
- Fisker Automotive ($529 million)
- Abound Solar ($400 million)*
- A123 Systems ($279 million)*
- Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($700,981)*
- Johnson Controls ($299 million)
- Brightsource ($1.6 billion)
- ECOtality ($126.2 million)
- Raser Technologies ($33 million)*
- Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*
- Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*
- Olsen’s Crop Service and Olsen’s Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*
- Range Fuels ($80 million)*
- Thompson River Power ($6.5 million)*
- Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*
- Azure Dynamics ($5.4 million)*
- GreenVolts ($500,000)
- Vestas ($50 million)
- LG Chem’s subsidiary Compact Power ($151 million)
- Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*
- Navistar ($39 million)
- Satcon ($3 million)*
- Konarka Technologies Inc. ($20 million)*
- Mascoma Corp. ($100 million)
*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.
If a municipality wants to give tax breaks to a business, with the idea that it will make more money for them (the municipality) in the long run- and provide jobs for their citizens, that seems like a smart thing to do. But then I'm no economist...
I think I finally understand. All these values antithetical to the gospel that people espouse have nothing to do with our christianity.
Quote: @"MaroonBells" said:
@"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do
First of all, what does Christianity have to do with it? That seems like an odd thing to bring into a conversation about taxes.
Second of all, can you offer some economic argument that would make AOC's position seem like the right thing to do for NY?
Thirdly, there is a difference between corporate "welfare" and good business sense. When the gov't gave money (not necessarily just tax incentives) to green solar companies, did you complain? Oh, and it amounted to ALOT more than $3 Billion:
Why does it have to be an economic argument? One of the loudest arguments heard in Denver was about traffic. People do actually care about quality of life. And it's not always about money, especially if you're not among those who would qualify for one of those $150K jobs. And why would anyone complain about giving money to green companies? That's the whole idea, isn't it? To incentivize renewable technologies? Surely you're not against that.
Yes, your list of 19 bankrupt green energy companies looks impressive...until you realize that companies go bankrupt all the time. In fact, 114 oil and gas companies when bankrupt in 2015 and 2016 alone.
That's a good point about the traffic. It was not an argument I heard (or anything like THAT) for the Amazon situation; but I can certainly understand why some communities might not want a large corporation moving in, regardless of the financial benefit. Quality of life matters, too- and I would certainly agree with that.
I still don't know what Christianity had to do with it, though. And if those 114 oil and gas companies were being given that much money by the gov't, I'd be ticked off by that, too. Kind of like the bailout: I would agree with those who were against it. If oil and gas companies need the gov't to bail them out (or prop them up), then they shouldn't be in business. Now, giving tax breaks in order to lure a company to come to a community (that wants it)? That- to me- is different.
Quote: @"Bullazin" said:
I think I finally understand. All these values antithetical to the gospel that people espouse have nothing to do with our christianity.
Huh?
Quote: @"pumpf" said:
@"MaroonBells" said:
@"pumpf" said:
@"minny65" said:
I guess folks are all in on Corporate Welfare. The Christian thing to do
First of all, what does Christianity have to do with it? That seems like an odd thing to bring into a conversation about taxes.
Second of all, can you offer some economic argument that would make AOC's position seem like the right thing to do for NY?
Thirdly, there is a difference between corporate "welfare" and good business sense. When the gov't gave money (not necessarily just tax incentives) to green solar companies, did you complain? Oh, and it amounted to ALOT more than $3 Billion:
Why does it have to be an economic argument? One of the loudest arguments heard in Denver was about traffic. People do actually care about quality of life. And it's not always about money, especially if you're not among those who would qualify for one of those $150K jobs. And why would anyone complain about giving money to green companies? That's the whole idea, isn't it? To incentivize renewable technologies? Surely you're not against that.
Yes, your list of 19 bankrupt green energy companies looks impressive...until you realize that companies go bankrupt all the time. In fact, 114 oil and gas companies when bankrupt in 2015 and 2016 alone.
And if those 114 oil and gas companies were being given that much money by the gov't, I'd be ticked off by that, too. Kind of like the bailout: I would agree with those who were against it. If oil and gas companies need the gov't to bail them out (or prop them up), then they shouldn't be in business.
Well you should be pissed off then. Oil and gas companies receive billions of dollars from the US government. All energy companies do.
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