I think the most important aspect of QB success is having
the right system and supporting cast in place to properly develop the QB. I think there’s a lot of dumpster fire teams
out there that destroy QBs that a better team could have developed into at
least starting caliber. I think you need
an offensive minded coach, preferably one that is QB focused. You need to have at least a decent OLine and
decent WR/TE group. I think beyond that
the front office has to be good at finding out which guys are coachable and
which guys are either too dumb, too lazy or have too much ego to learn the
position. After that, I think luck plays
a part.
Quote: @ArizonaViking said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ ArizonaViking said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ ArizonaViking said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
I want us to take a QB in the 1st round of the '24 draft. And I think we will. It's time. I also think we'll extend Cousins short term to give the young QB time. But everyone should keep in mind that it's not very likely that QB will be better than what we already have.
Think about this: In just 3 games, Cousins has had 2 receivers fumble in the red zone. He’s also had 2 TD passes hit his receivers in the hands only to be stolen away (Bucs) or tipped into a pick (Chargers). Despite this he still leads the league in passing yards, TDs, completions and completions over 20 yards. He has 1075 yards, 9 TDs and 2 INTs. And yes, both picks hit his receivers in the hands.
Some fans think Kirk is the problem.....they'll only realize that he wasn't after he's been gone.
Yes, Cousins is a pure pocket passer with limited mobility and pocket awareness, we all know that. But as fast as the pocket collapses due to the massive push straight up the middle of the interior line, Cousins has held up extremely well and actually perform really well all considering. I know the majority here want a running quarterback that can pass too and are looking real hard for the quarterback of the future. But until the organization address the interior lines on both sides of the ball, the team will still have the same results. Any new quarterback regardless, playing behind this existing line is literally putting his own life in danger. Look at Andrew Luck when he was playing for the Colts. He got beaten up so bad behind a shitty offensive line, he only played a few years and retired due to numerous injuries. First order of business for the Viking is to fix both interior lines either through free agency or the draft. Here's where they should spend their money.
I dont think you are right on what you think the majority wants, for the most part IMO the majority still wants a passer, just one that can move the pocket, and when the defense allows take a free 5 yards or at least extend plays and make throws off script. I dont know of many/any fans that want to see a running QB as those typically arent worth a shit as a passer and have considerably shorter careers.
I agree on the OL and DL though and have been screaming for years to prioritize those positions, but paying a statue QB top of the market money ( along with a few other shit contracts ) didnt leave much on the table for adding talent at the needed areas, and then there is the draft.
Yeah, running QB was a bad description on my part. More like a more mobile QB that can get outside or extend plays with his legs with the option of flinging the ball or gaining positive yards running.
also I sometimes wonder if the stonewall OL is a thing of the past, the athleticism of todays DLs is getting so much better every year. I am not saying we dont have room to improve, but I wonder how much we can expect to gain without making some changes to our O including that mobile QB and making the location of the QB on every passing play more of a question to force defense to take a beat before pinning their ears back to rush directly back from the center on every pass play.
You also got to take in account that there are some defensive ends and linebackers that can flat-out run just as fast as running backs and receivers, capable of closing space real quick.
oh absolutely, the game has become a game of not only inches, but fractions of seconds, which makes it even harder to continue to throw resources at a team centered around an immobile QB IMO. He can still put up decent numbers, but his age and his contract suggest its time to move on and the current state of the roster suggests to me to make it a clean rip the band aid off type of separation, I see no reason to hang onto him to keep the team mediocre, when they need to make bigger swings to get things ready for whoever is the new QB.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
I want us to take a QB in the 1st round of the '24 draft. And I think we will. It's time. I also think we'll extend Cousins short term to give the young QB time. But everyone should keep in mind that it's not very likely that QB will be better than what we already have.
Think about this: In just 3 games, Cousins has had 2 receivers fumble in the red zone. He’s also had 2 TD passes hit his receivers in the hands only to be stolen away (Bucs) or tipped into a pick (Chargers). Despite this he still leads the league in passing yards, TDs, completions and completions over 20 yards. He has 1075 yards, 9 TDs and 2 INTs. And yes, both picks hit his receivers in the hands.
Stats are one thing, I think finding someone that can create plays on the run and have better footwork in the pocket with a faster release can be better than Cousins. Michael Penix Jr. Come on down! And he doesn't have to be a cam newton, just someone that can make a few plays off script who can feel the rush. With the weapons the Vikings have I think the right guy can have early success.
Cousins has been decent, but also predictable, and after 6 years I am ready for a change.
Quote: @DeepFreeze05 said:
Well, Cousins hasn't really elevated the team after the team signed him for top dollars replacing Keenam. The year prior to his signing him, the Vikings played the NFC Championship game.
While true, it is a LOT more complicated than that Freeze. The 2017 defense ranked #1 overall. #1 in fewest points allowed. #1 in yards allowed. In 2018 that defense went to #9 in points allowed. #4 in total yards allowed. The defense definitely fell off from its 2015-2017 dominance.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
I want us to take a QB in the 1st round of the '24 draft. And I think we will. It's time. I also think we'll extend Cousins short term to give the young QB time. But everyone should keep in mind that it's not very likely that QB will be better than what we already have.
Think about this: In just 3 games, Cousins has had 2 receivers fumble in the red zone. He’s also had 2 TD passes hit his receivers in the hands only to be stolen away (Bucs) or tipped into a pick (Chargers). Despite this he still leads the league in passing yards, TDs, completions and completions over 20 yards. He has 1075 yards, 9 TDs and 2 INTs. And yes, both picks hit his receivers in the hands.
Some fans think Kirk is the problem.....they'll only realize that he wasn't after he's been gone.
there are part of kirks games that are a problem, this team has more problems than can be fixed by replacing 1 player, more than will be fixed in one draft or one offseason. This is why the competitive rebuild was such a shit idea, all that did was slow down the timeline to getting back to a real competitive team... hell Spielman should be on the hook still for the shit mess we have now. I honestly think a major move should have been made after 18 or 19 at the latest.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
Only one has won a Superbowl, Patrick Mahomes.
This isn't some quick automatic magic pill, drafting a new QB. Minnesota needs a lot of help outside that position. And the odds are against a QB selection making a gigantic impact. There are no auto fixes in the NFL. That doesn't mean you shouldn't draft them, it just means odds are lower it will hit.
That is a very deceiving statement. Answer this question;
Out of the 113 QBs, how many have got to the Superbowl?
P.S. Also, Russell Wilson was picked only 27 spots before Cousins.
P.S. 2 - Also, Nick Foles was picked just 14 spots before Cousins.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
I want us to take a QB in the 1st round of the '24 draft. And I think we will. It's time. I also think we'll extend Cousins short term to give the young QB time. But everyone should keep in mind that it's not very likely that QB will be better than what we already have.
Think about this: In just 3 games, Cousins has had 2 receivers fumble in the red zone. He’s also had 2 TD passes hit his receivers in the hands only to be stolen away (Bucs) or tipped into a pick (Chargers). Despite this he still leads the league in passing yards, TDs, completions and completions over 20 yards. He has 1075 yards, 9 TDs and 2 INTs. And yes, both picks hit his receivers in the hands.
I'm already resigned to the fact that we'll have lesser QB play from any QB other than Kirko in 2024. While I used to think that it was best for a rookie QB to sit a year, I now believe that they're better off gaining experience by playing from Game #1. Of course, in our case in would be foolish to trot out a rookie QB without substantial upgrades to our IOL.
To me the Chargers game clearly showed the difference between having a great QB & a good one…
Of those 10: - 4 for Brady, the single best QB of all time
- 2 for Mahomes
- 1 for Peyton Manning, a #1 pick
- 1 for Stafford, a #1 pick
- 1 for Foles, who was replacing an injured Wentz, who was the #2 pick
- 1 for Russell Wilson, a 3rd round pick
- 1 for Joe Flacco, a first round pick
Among the losers: - 4 (1 each) for Brady, Peyton, Mahomes, and Russ
- 1 for Hurts, and 2nd round pick
- 1 for Burrow, a #1 pick
- 1 for Garropolo, a 2nd round pick
- 1 for Goff, a #1 pick
- 1 for Newton, a #1 pick
- 1 for Kaepernick, a 2nd rounder replacing a #1 pick
Quote: @Kentis said:
To me the Chargers game clearly showed the difference between having a great QB & a good one…
Yea and Staley should be fired for multiple reasons including that head scratching 4th down call that almost won us the game. He is supposed to be a Defensive guru and his defenses the last few years have been horrible. I do think Herbert is a franchise QB but they are doing a terrible job surrounding him - IMO
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