Gee, who coulda seen this coming?

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@FSUVike said:

@StickyBun said:
He traded away their best player....how do you think that sits with the other vets in the locker room? You aren't getting better by doing that, the players know who can really play and who can't. Gruden has been out of the league FOREVER in NFL years. He was also an abrasive coach to players. He got lucky once, just like Brian Billick did. 

Did you miss the part about how those same vets were supposed to challenge NE and flamed out? How many of them have already bailed on Carr?

Pretty sure Carr hasn't lost the locker room, especially those that matter:

1:10

95.7 The GameVerified account @957thegame#Raiders TE Lee Smith on Derek Carr reports: “The attacking of our strongest leader & the strongest man in this locker room is absolute horse%*t.”

[Guest]

@StickyBun said:

@FSUVike said:

@StickyBun said:
He traded away their best player....how do you think that sits with the other vets in the locker room? You aren't getting better by doing that, the players know who can really play and who can't. Gruden has been out of the league FOREVER in NFL years. He was also an abrasive coach to players. He got lucky once, just like Brian Billick did. 

Did you miss the part about how those same vets were supposed to challenge NE and flamed out? How many of them have already bailed on Carr?

Pretty sure Carr hasn't lost the locker room, especially those that matter:

1:10

95.7 The GameVerified account @957thegame#Raiders TE Lee Smith on Derek Carr reports: “The attacking of our strongest leader & the strongest man in this locker room is absolute horse%*t.”

What about those that block for him?  They matter. 

[Guest]

My real point here is that McKenzie just threw money at guys instead of building through the Draft and selecting Players with certain personality traits as well as physical traits.

So the Raiders have a collection of FAs, not a core group of draftees indoctrinated into their culture, whatever that may be.

Meanwhile, Rick and Mike have built a core of draftees that truly drink the purple kool aid and bolstered that with key FA signings like Reiff and KC that seamlessly fit the team culture.

Very different approaches that continue to yield very different results.

[Guest]

@FSUVike said:
My real point here is that McKenzie just threw money at guys instead of building through the Draft and selecting Players with certain personality traits as well as physical traits.

So the Raiders have a collection of FAs, not a core group of draftees indoctrinated into their culture, whatever that may be.

Meanwhile, Rick and Mike have built a core of draftees that truly drink the purple kool aid and bolstered that with key FA signings like Reiff and KC that seamlessly fit the team culture.

Very different approaches that continue to yield very different results.

Why is the "Raiders approach" working for the Rams? I actually agree with what you are saying that throwing mercenary FAs together doesn't work - usually. It's why I expected the Rams to disappoint this year. I'm really surprised that team is playing well. McVay is probably a better coach than Gruden, but is that all?

[Guest]

@Jor-El said:

@FSUVike said:
My real point here is that McKenzie just threw money at guys instead of building through the Draft and selecting Players with certain personality traits as well as physical traits.

So the Raiders have a collection of FAs, not a core group of draftees indoctrinated into their culture, whatever that may be.

Meanwhile, Rick and Mike have built a core of draftees that truly drink the purple kool aid and bolstered that with key FA signings like Reiff and KC that seamlessly fit the team culture.

Very different approaches that continue to yield very different results.

Why is the "Raiders approach" working for the Rams? I actually agree with what you are saying that throwing mercenary FAs together doesn't work - usually. It's why I expected the Rams to disappoint this year. I'm really surprised that team is playing well. McVay is probably a better coach than Gruden, but is that all?

But the core of their team is guys they drafted: Goff, Gurley, Donald. They filled in spots they were whiffing on in the draft like OT & CB with FAs.

Agree with you about chemistry, though. Their FO signed some major malcontents, which is usually what the Raiders do. The fact that it's working so well is really a testament to McVay.

[Guest]

@FSUVike said:

@Jor-El said:

@FSUVike said:
My real point here is that McKenzie just threw money at guys instead of building through the Draft and selecting Players with certain personality traits as well as physical traits.

So the Raiders have a collection of FAs, not a core group of draftees indoctrinated into their culture, whatever that may be.

Meanwhile, Rick and Mike have built a core of draftees that truly drink the purple kool aid and bolstered that with key FA signings like Reiff and KC that seamlessly fit the team culture.

Very different approaches that continue to yield very different results.

Why is the "Raiders approach" working for the Rams? I actually agree with what you are saying that throwing mercenary FAs together doesn't work - usually. It's why I expected the Rams to disappoint this year. I'm really surprised that team is playing well. McVay is probably a better coach than Gruden, but is that all?

But the core of their team is guys they drafted: Goff, Gurley, Donald. They filled in spots they were whiffing on in the draft like OT & CB with FAs.

Agree with you about chemistry, though. Their FO signed some major malcontents, which is usually what the Raiders do. The fact that it's working so well is really a testament to McVay.

The other consideration with the Rams: this season isn't even half over. Plenty of time for Suh, Talib, Peters, Cooks to screw up that locker room.

[Guest]

of course most of the Vererans will not be with Oakland next year.  they are way too young!

[Guest]

@Jor-El said:

@FSUVike said:
My real point here is that McKenzie just threw money at guys instead of building through the Draft and selecting Players with certain personality traits as well as physical traits.

So the Raiders have a collection of FAs, not a core group of draftees indoctrinated into their culture, whatever that may be.

Meanwhile, Rick and Mike have built a core of draftees that truly drink the purple kool aid and bolstered that with key FA signings like Reiff and KC that seamlessly fit the team culture.

Very different approaches that continue to yield very different results.

Why is the "Raiders approach" working for the Rams? I actually agree with what you are saying that throwing mercenary FAs together doesn't work - usually. It's why I expected the Rams to disappoint this year. I'm really surprised that team is playing well. McVay is probably a better coach than Gruden, but is that all?

Yeah the Rams had a core, and then added to that.  The Raiders didn't really have a core and tried to buy one.  I think a core is something you build over time by players being on the team for a few years.