I dont think $20mm is too much for Cousins...I think he's a better qb today than all 3 on our rosters sans a healthy Sam, which unfortunately is an oxymoron.
| Player | APY |
|---|
| Matt Stafford | $27,000,000 | | Derek Carr | $25,005,000 | | Andrew Luck | $24,594,000 | | Drew Brees | $24,250,000 | | Kirk Cousins | $23,943,600 | | Joe Flacco | $22,133,333 | | Aaron Rodgers | $22,000,000 | | Russell Wilson | $21,900,000 | | Ben Roethlisberger | $21,850,000 | | Eli Manning | $21,000,000 |
I don't know what to think about Cousins. Mainly I worry about how much he'd cost. I look at who we have on the roster and for sentimental reasons (which don't count when making a decision on QB skill set) I would like to see Teddy stay with the team. But, even in saying that, I worry about that leg. The more I think about the QB situation the more I just have no clue.
Off the subject but a tad bit noteworthy...did anyone see how well Brees worked with Thielen and Rudolph in the Pro Bowl? It looked like they'd played together for years.
We need that kind of QB.
Quote: @FSUVike said:
Seriously? Cousins has thrown for 4k yards how many times in a row including this year with squat for WRs but Keenum is better after one year with a much better supporting cast?
This move boils down to Kirk saying he wants the opposite of the Home Town Discount after two years of being tagged instead of extended.
And although the Skins are idiots for letting it get this far at least they were smart enough to grab their bridge guy while they look for a Franchise QB they haven't already pissed off.
Or the Redskins were smart and said it will cost us much less to obtain Smith with almost identical production to Cousins. Let's look at some numbers. Smith played one less game than Cousins in 2017.
Smith Cousins
15 GP 16
341 CMP 347
505 ATT 540
67.5% CMP% 64.3%
4042 YDS 4093
269.5 YPG 255.8
8.0 YPA 7.6
26 TD 27
5 INT 13
4 Fum 8
You can argue that Smith had a better supporting cast, but other than Kelce and a gimmick WR in Tyreek Hill, they both have average receiving corps and Smith was much better at protecting the ball.
Luck signed a 6 year extension in 2016 for $140 Million with $80 Million guaranteed. Stafford upped that number by signing a 5 year deal for $135 Million and $92 Million guaranteed in 2017. The Redskins got Smith at a good cap number this year, and his average for his extension will be under the Franchise Tag level for QB's in 2018 with less guaranteed money than Cousins will demand in the open market. At a bare minimum, Cousins' Agent will want at least the Franchise Tag level as a base salary which will approximately be at the $24 million range in 2018. I think his asking price will be closer to a $26 Million per year average to slot right behind Stafford. Or a team like the Jets who have expressed a high interest in Cousins and have a ton of Cap Space could throw stupid money at him and outbid everyone else.
Cousins hasn't proven anything. He's started 1 playoff game, and has not elevated his team's play like elite QB's do. To your point, he needs a good supporting cast to be successful just like Keenum, Bradford, Teddy, and Smith. He's a very good QB, but not an elite franchise QB. I would be excited if we signed him, but I wouldn't throw stupid money at him when we could sign one of the 3 we had last year for a lot less money and fill some of the critical holes we have on the offensive and defensive lines.
Winners and losers from Alex Smith trade to Redskins: Cousins cashes in, Reid upgradesWinners Kirk Cousins: The most obvious choice by a wide margin, Cousins is about to make Scrooge McDuck money on the open market. Cousins spent the last two years playing for the Redskins on one-year deals, playing through the franchise tag and refusing to cave on the Redskins' demands to take less money than he believed he was worth.
Barring something VERY unexpected, the Redskins and Cousins will not be negotiating any further on a contract, and the Redskins will not be utilizing a third franchise tag or the transition tag on Cousins. The result is a 29-year-old quarterback hitting unrestricted free agency in a league where there are multiple teams desperate for a quarterback.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
I don't think this says anything about what cousins wants except to be out of DC. This isn't a knock on the skins (this year anyway) as cousins was never gong to resign with them after the disrespect of the tag the last few years.
I would stI'll pass on him if he is going to insist on being paid 20+ million every year. You know why the most competitive teams are often the ones with cheaper QBs, they can afford to put better talent around them. We have the better talent, we need to find a QB that wants to win first and is not worried about where his contract ranks among other QBs. Anybody think brady cares about where his contract ranks when he's polishing his superbowl rings?
Iirc the skins wanted to extend cousins but he wanted top dollar, maybe they will be better off in the long run without him. The Vikings have done pretty good without a 20 plus million dollar arm, I would rather see a solid team than a golden arm surrounded by shit. Or 1 really good year and then 3 years or so rebuilding because we can't keep our core together.
Most fans are worried about which QB we will sign, I am more worried about how much it's going to cost us in terms of future free agents, both our own and those we want/need to add.
Cousins wanted out of Washington after they lowballed him on a contract in his first year starting and proceeded to tag him in consecutive seasons. I don't know that he wanted an exorbitant amount, but the Redskins weren't willing to pay him the going rate for a top 10 QB. That soured him and he was perfectly content to play on the franchise tag until he was able to hit the free agent market.
He should easily get over 20 million per year on a new deal. Look at the recent contracts that were signed... Matthew Stafford has a cap figure of 26.5 million next season... Derek Carr is right behind him at 25 million. Flacco and Luck have cap figures of 24.75 and 24.4 million...
Then if you want to get into QBs who have won Super Bowls recently and/or have had their teams in the playoffs consistently... Russell Wilson has a 23.8 million cap figure in 2018. Big Ben is at 23.2 million. Tom Brady is at 22 million. Matt Ryan is at 21.65 million. Cam Newton is 21.5... and Aaron Rodgers is due for an extension and has a cap hit of 20.5 million next year.
Cousins is a legit top 12 QB in the league. He's worth a contract similar to Stafford and Carr and he might get a bit more because the cap keeps going up and good QBs are getting deals that average over 25 million per year now.
The Vikings should have almost 63 million in cap space once they cut Sharrif Floyd. They have plenty of room to absorb a large cap hit from Cousins if they can front load his deal (like they've done with players in the last couple years) and still have wiggle room to get extensions done for Diggs, Hunter, Kendricks, and potentially Barr.
The question the Vikings front office needs to ask themselves is this... do we pay the going rate for a proven top 12 QB that is still in his prime (he'll be turning 30 in August). Or do we pay 10 million less for Bradford or Teddy and hope the former can stay healthy and the latter can realize his potential AND prove he's fully healthy? Or sign Case for around 18-20 million on a short term deal and hope he doesn't regress? The Vikings Super Bowl window is open RIGHT NOW with a great defense and a number of young playmakers on offense with a solid offensive line. The pieces are in place, all the team needs is a reliable QB to lead them for the next 5+ years.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I don't think this says anything about what cousins wants except to be out of DC. This isn't a knock on the skins (this year anyway) as cousins was never gong to resign with them after the disrespect of the tag the last few years.
I would stI'll pass on him if he is going to insist on being paid 20+ million every year. You know why the most competitive teams are often the ones with cheaper QBs, they can afford to put better talent around them. We have the better talent, we need to find a QB that wants to win first and is not worried about where his contract ranks among other QBs. Anybody think brady cares about where his contract ranks when he's polishing his superbowl rings?
Iirc the skins wanted to extend cousins but he wanted top dollar, maybe they will be better off in the long run without him. The Vikings have done pretty good without a 20 plus million dollar arm, I would rather see a solid team than a golden arm surrounded by shit. Or 1 really good year and then 3 years or so rebuilding because we can't keep our core together.
Most fans are worried about which QB we will sign, I am more worried about how much it's going to cost us in terms of future free agents, both our own and those we want/need to add.
Cousins wanted out of Washington after they lowballed him on a contract in his first year starting and proceeded to tag him in consecutive seasons. I don't know that he wanted an exorbitant amount, but the Redskins weren't willing to pay him the going rate for a top 10 QB. That soured him and he was perfectly content to play on the franchise tag until he was able to hit the free agent market.
He should easily get over 20 million per year on a new deal. Look at the recent contracts that were signed... Matthew Stafford has a cap figure of 26.5 million next season... Derek Carr is right behind him at 25 million. Flacco and Luck have cap figures of 24.75 and 24.4 million...
Then if you want to get into QBs who have won Super Bowls recently and/or have had their teams in the playoffs consistently... Russell Wilson has a 23.8 million cap figure in 2018. Big Ben is at 23.2 million. Tom Brady is at 22 million. Matt Ryan is at 21.65 million. Cam Newton is 21.5... and Aaron Rodgers is due for an extension and has a cap hit of 20.5 million next year.
Cousins is a legit top 12 QB in the league. He's worth a contract similar to Stafford and Carr and he might get a bit more because the cap keeps going up and good QBs are getting deals that average over 25 million per year now.
The Vikings should have almost 63 million in cap space once they cut Sharrif Floyd. They have plenty of room to absorb a large cap hit from Cousins if they can front load his deal (like they've done with players in the last couple years) and still have wiggle room to get extensions done for Diggs, Hunter, Kendricks, and potentially Barr.
The question the Vikings front office needs to ask themselves is this... do we pay the going rate for a proven top 12 QB that is still in his prime (he'll be turning 30 in August). Or do we pay 10 million less for Bradford or Teddy and hope the former can stay healthy and the latter can realize his potential AND prove he's fully healthy? Or sign Case for around 18-20 million on a short term deal and hope he doesn't regress? The Vikings Super Bowl window is open RIGHT NOW with a great defense and a number of young playmakers on offense with a solid offensive line. The pieces are in place, all the team needs is a reliable QB to lead them for the next 5+ years.
I agree with you that our window is open now, but I think we need a lot more than just a QB. We desperately need to find a 3T for the defensive line, we need a starting RG and possibly a starting RT unless you are satisfied with Remmers or Hill as your starters and that's assuming Easton and Elflein fully recover. We need to find Nickel and Dime DB's when teams attack us with a spread passing game, and could also use some additional Pass Rushers as we saw both Hunter and Griffin wear down and become ineffective. If we can afford Cousin's big price tag and fill all of our holes through the draft and FA, I fine giving him a big contract, but I think that is going to be tough when you have some big extensions looming with Barr, Diggs, Kendricks, and Hunter.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I don't think this says anything about what cousins wants except to be out of DC. This isn't a knock on the skins (this year anyway) as cousins was never gong to resign with them after the disrespect of the tag the last few years.
I would stI'll pass on him if he is going to insist on being paid 20+ million every year. You know why the most competitive teams are often the ones with cheaper QBs, they can afford to put better talent around them. We have the better talent, we need to find a QB that wants to win first and is not worried about where his contract ranks among other QBs. Anybody think brady cares about where his contract ranks when he's polishing his superbowl rings?
Iirc the skins wanted to extend cousins but he wanted top dollar, maybe they will be better off in the long run without him. The Vikings have done pretty good without a 20 plus million dollar arm, I would rather see a solid team than a golden arm surrounded by shit. Or 1 really good year and then 3 years or so rebuilding because we can't keep our core together.
Most fans are worried about which QB we will sign, I am more worried about how much it's going to cost us in terms of future free agents, both our own and those we want/need to add.
Cousins wanted out of Washington after they lowballed him on a contract in his first year starting and proceeded to tag him in consecutive seasons. I don't know that he wanted an exorbitant amount, but the Redskins weren't willing to pay him the going rate for a top 10 QB. That soured him and he was perfectly content to play on the franchise tag until he was able to hit the free agent market.
He should easily get over 20 million per year on a new deal. Look at the recent contracts that were signed... Matthew Stafford has a cap figure of 26.5 million next season... Derek Carr is right behind him at 25 million. Flacco and Luck have cap figures of 24.75 and 24.4 million...
Then if you want to get into QBs who have won Super Bowls recently and/or have had their teams in the playoffs consistently... Russell Wilson has a 23.8 million cap figure in 2018. Big Ben is at 23.2 million. Tom Brady is at 22 million. Matt Ryan is at 21.65 million. Cam Newton is 21.5... and Aaron Rodgers is due for an extension and has a cap hit of 20.5 million next year.
Cousins is a legit top 12 QB in the league. He's worth a contract similar to Stafford and Carr and he might get a bit more because the cap keeps going up and good QBs are getting deals that average over 25 million per year now.
The Vikings should have almost 63 million in cap space once they cut Sharrif Floyd. They have plenty of room to absorb a large cap hit from Cousins if they can front load his deal (like they've done with players in the last couple years) and still have wiggle room to get extensions done for Diggs, Hunter, Kendricks, and potentially Barr.
The question the Vikings front office needs to ask themselves is this... do we pay the going rate for a proven top 12 QB that is still in his prime (he'll be turning 30 in August). Or do we pay 10 million less for Bradford or Teddy and hope the former can stay healthy and the latter can realize his potential AND prove he's fully healthy? Or sign Case for around 18-20 million on a short term deal and hope he doesn't regress? The Vikings Super Bowl window is open RIGHT NOW with a great defense and a number of young playmakers on offense with a solid offensive line. The pieces are in place, all the team needs is a reliable QB to lead them for the next 5+ years.
of those QBs that have the bigger deals 22+ million per year, how many are legit superbowl contenders every year with the teams they have around them now? after they pay their high dollar QB contracts their teams begin to decline because they cant put quality players around that high dollar QB. If people want a load up now and be a one and done or at least watch our team decline going forward with younger players walking for better money then sign cousins to the money that people say he wants. I would rather see us continue to build through the draft and that includes our QBs and everybody else and only add high dollar free agents when it is a true need like last year at OT. Case proved that an average QB with a good/great supporting cast can win in this league. Cousins has better flash stats ( completions, yards, and TD), but is that because he had to throw so much more? I have never thought he was really that great of a player, seems like he makes a fair amount of duh throws and we already have that in Case, but Case doesnt do it as often.
I expect Cousins top suitor to be the New York Jets.
If Washington was smart and had the Cap Space they could put the transition tag on him and work a trade out with a team.
Because you know he won't sign it and even if he does teams are still going to be intrested.
|
