Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ 1VikesFan said:
I have always been a Cousins believer and I think he's going to excel in KOC's offense.
If being a Cousins believer means you acknowledge his flaws but think he's among the 15 or so QBs in the NFL capable of winning a Super Bowl, then I'm a believer too.
No doubt KC is a Top 15 QB especially stat wise.
But I have see enough to disagree with the second part about being capable of winning a SB.
Just my opinion as you know 
Quote: @minny65 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ 1VikesFan said:
I have always been a Cousins believer and I think he's going to excel in KOC's offense.
If being a Cousins believer means you acknowledge his flaws but think he's among the 15 or so QBs in the NFL capable of winning a Super Bowl, then I'm a believer too.
No doubt KC is a Top 15 QB especially stat wise.
But I have see enough to disagree with the second part about being capable of winning a SB.
Just my opinion as you know
But isn't the Superbowl just one game? I mean if you believe a guy is a good QB, why can't he win one game? Of course Cousins can. Hell, Matt Stafford just did it and he hadn't even been in the same zip code before that. I'm not trying to bag on you at all, 65, just saying if you do think Cousins is a pretty good QB then he's capable of winning a Superbowl. If you don't think he's a good QB, then that's a different story.
Quote: @minny65 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ 1VikesFan said:
I have always been a Cousins believer and I think he's going to excel in KOC's offense.
If being a Cousins believer means you acknowledge his flaws but think he's among the 15 or so QBs in the NFL capable of winning a Super Bowl, then I'm a believer too.
No doubt KC is a Top 15 QB especially stat wise.
But I have see enough to disagree with the second part about being capable of winning a SB.
Just my opinion as you know
I think where we disagree most is that the Super Bowl is some ridiculously unachievable feat reserved only for the elite of the powerhouse elite. It's just not. Especially now, within the last decade or so.
Viking fans might argue "well, why have we never won one then?" Over the course of their 60 year history, the Vikings have probably fielded 8 or 9 teams fully capable of winning a Super Bowl. An examination of why we didn't leads one to an ugly purple place filled with injuries, dropped passes, 4th and 17s, wide left, running out of bounds, etc., etc., and part of the reason we were voted the NFL's #1 Dynasty of Heartbreak. God knows, we earned it.
Cousins and this current Vikings roster are fully capable of winning it all. But like all championship teams, a few things need to align. We need to stay relatively healthy and we need to get hot at the right time.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ minny65 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ 1VikesFan said:
I have always been a Cousins believer and I think he's going to excel in KOC's offense.
If being a Cousins believer means you acknowledge his flaws but think he's among the 15 or so QBs in the NFL capable of winning a Super Bowl, then I'm a believer too.
No doubt KC is a Top 15 QB especially stat wise.
But I have see enough to disagree with the second part about being capable of winning a SB.
Just my opinion as you know
But isn't the Superbowl just one game? I mean if you believe a guy is a good QB, why can't he win one game? Of course Cousins can. Hell, Matt Stafford just did it and he hadn't even been in the same zip code before that. I'm not trying to bag on you at all, 65, just saying if you do think Cousins is a pretty good QB then he's capable of winning a Superbowl. If you don't think he's a good QB, then that's a different story.
I don't really want to go through this ring-around-the-rosie again on KC (not specific to you at all) but for well over a year -since I lost confidence in KC being that guy - I have stated my thought process. Of course, under perfect conditions a Trent Dilfer can win a SB. So could KC have won with that Ravens team of course. I think Stafford ad KC are pretty comprable in terms of overall QB'ing but even Stafford has a much better pocket presence/feel/movement skills then KC and I am not convinced he (KC) would have beat the Bengals. KC panics too much and like a deer on a highway runs right towards the light too often for my liking.
I'm stuck with rooting for KC for at least another season but at least we finally ditched Zimmer. It was very difficult last year when I was convinced KC was not the guy and Zimmer sucked for years. First time in over 40 years of being a Viking fan I did not like the HC and the QB. As I predicted last preseason it was going to be a shitshow of a year and it was worse then that.
As far as the whole team and contenders for a SB I don't think we are even close to that. Let's win the division first.
Earlier this year I predicted we would have over 8 new starters which seems to be the case. With a whole new coaching staff, whole new Def scheme, whole new play caller - first time, and 8-10 new starters this is not a superbowl contending team. I am hoping to be a playoff contending team and building. Too much change for this to be a SB contending team IMO. Do I wish it to be true, yes of course. But I try not to take a homer perspective when the vast majority of indicators tell you the opposite.
Quote: @minny65 said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ minny65 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ 1VikesFan said:
I have always been a Cousins believer and I think he's going to excel in KOC's offense.
If being a Cousins believer means you acknowledge his flaws but think he's among the 15 or so QBs in the NFL capable of winning a Super Bowl, then I'm a believer too.
No doubt KC is a Top 15 QB especially stat wise.
But I have see enough to disagree with the second part about being capable of winning a SB.
Just my opinion as you know
But isn't the Superbowl just one game? I mean if you believe a guy is a good QB, why can't he win one game? Of course Cousins can. Hell, Matt Stafford just did it and he hadn't even been in the same zip code before that. I'm not trying to bag on you at all, 65, just saying if you do think Cousins is a pretty good QB then he's capable of winning a Superbowl. If you don't think he's a good QB, then that's a different story.
I don't really want to go through this ring-around-the-rosie again on KC (not specific to you at all) but for well over a year -since I lost confidence in KC being that guy - I have stated my thought process. Of course, under perfect conditions a Trent Dilfer can win a SB. So could KC have won with that Ravens team of course. I think Stafford ad KC are pretty comprable in terms of overall QB'ing but even Stafford has a much better pocket presence/feel/movement skills then KC and I am not convinced he (KC) would have beat the Bengals. KC panics too much and like a deer on a highway runs right towards the light too often for my liking.
I'm stuck with rooting for KC for at least another season but at least we finally ditched Zimmer. It was very difficult last year when I was convinced KC was not the guy and Zimmer sucked for years. First time in over 40 years of being a Viking fan I did not like the HC and the QB. As I predicted last preseason it was going to be a shitshow of a year and it was worse then that.
As far as the whole team and contenders for a SB I don't think we are even close to that. Let's win the division first.
Earlier this year I predicted we would have over 8 new starters which seems to be the case. With a whole new coaching staff, whole new Def scheme, whole new play caller - first time, and 8-10 new starters this is not a superbowl contending team. I am hoping to be a playoff contending team and building. Too much change for this to be a SB contending team IMO. Do I wish it to be true, yes of course. But I try not to take a homer perspective when the vast majority of indicators tell you the opposite.
I like your football takes, 65....you should post more of them around here. Sound logic.
The problem with saying “Kirk and this team are totally capable of winning the Super Bowl!” is that you can say that about 20+ teams before any given season and you’d be correct. And then the season starts and the playoffs start and the Tom Bradys, Aaron Rodgers’, and Pat Mahomes’ of the worlds are the ones who are actually in it, and the middle tier QBs aren’t. This isn’t gospel but by and large it’s been true the past 5-10 years.
Are the supporting casts great? Yep. But the number of “Any Given Sunday!” champions in the past 10 years is 2. Certainly doable, infinitely harder.
I think there’s a better chance of Kirk “leveling up” in the new offense and becoming elite than of him being the same Kirk we’ve seen the past few years and the Vikes winning a Super Bowl. But I’d take either!
Quote: @pattersaur said:
The problem with saying “Kirk and this team are totally capable of winning the Super Bowl!” is that you can say that about 20+ teams before any given season and you’d be correct. And then the season starts and the playoffs start and the Tom Bradys, Aaron Rodgers’, and Pat Mahomes’ of the worlds are the ones who are actually in it, and the middle tier QBs aren’t. This isn’t gospel but by and large it’s been true the past 5-10 years.
Are the supporting casts great? Yep. But the number of “Any Given Sunday!” champions in the past 10 years is 2. Certainly doable, infinitely harder.
I think there’s a better chance of Kirk “leveling up” in the new offense and becoming elite than of him being the same Kirk we’ve seen the past few years and the Vikes winning a Super Bowl. But I’d take either!
Yes, you're right. That's my whole point.
Yes, there are about 20 teams capable of winning a Super Bowl. Maybe even more than that. I typically think there are only about 8-10 teams without a shot.
Tampa went from 7-9 to Super Bowl champion. They were probably in the top 20, but just barely. Bengals were 4-11. I doubt anyone put them in the top 20. Falcons in '97 hired a new coach and turned 3-13 into 14-2. 2018 Rams hired McVeigh and turned a 4-12 team into 11-5 and then 13-3. The days of dynasties are over.
Btw, Aaron Rodgers hasn't won a Super Bowl since Madieu Williams and Asher Allen were starters on our defense and Barack Obama was 1 year into his 8-year term.
I think it depends on how one wants to define a dynasty anymore...
I think the days of winning 4 SB's in a 6 year span may be over.
Maybe a dynasty today is having a better than average shot at winning it all? A top 5/6 QB, winning your division and a few playoff games each year in a 5 year span?
I'm just spit balling on this one in the off-season.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
I think it depends on how one wants to define a dynasty anymore...
I think the days of winning 4 SB's in a 6 year span may be over.
Maybe a dynasty today is having a better than average shot at winning it all? A top 5/6 QB, winning your division and a few playoff games each year in a 5 year span?
I'm just spit balling on this one in the off-season.
Dynasty is probably the wrong word. I'm just referring to teams like the Vikings, Cowboys, Rams, Steelers from the 70s. 49ers from the 80s. They were always good and they were always playing each other. You seldom saw a bottom dweller sneak into the playoffs. Now it seems to happen all the time.
With the cap, injuries are a much bigger part of the game. A good team with 2 or 3 key injuries is hobbled. And any day of the week, those teams can be knocked off by lesser teams who happen to be fully healthy.
Not a complaint. It's a good thing. And it's what was intended. It gives probably 20 or more teams hope for a championship. Vikings are definitely one of those teams.
Quote: @pattersaur said:
The problem with saying “Kirk and this team are totally capable of winning the Super Bowl!” is that you can say that about 20+ teams before any given season and you’d be correct. And then the season starts and the playoffs start and the Tom Bradys, Aaron Rodgers’, and Pat Mahomes’ of the worlds are the ones who are actually in it, and the middle tier QBs aren’t. This isn’t gospel but by and large it’s been true the past 5-10 years.
Are the supporting casts great? Yep. But the number of “Any Given Sunday!” champions in the past 10 years is 2. Certainly doable, infinitely harder.
I think there’s a better chance of Kirk “leveling up” in the new offense and becoming elite than of him being the same Kirk we’ve seen the past few years and the Vikes winning a Super Bowl. But I’d take either!
Using the only elite logic, if you take the Goat out theres not an active QB with more then 1 win and if I’m counting right Rodgers, Mahomes and Wilson are the only ones to even play in two SBs.
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