If they play works as designed Kirks your guy. If the play breaks down and you need ad lib, heroics, buying that extra 1-2 seconds Kirk falls short. So do we want a competitive team that that is solid but gets eliminated from the playoffs each year? Or roll the dice hoping for magic? After 50 years I've had enough competitive.
If our defense could keep a team under 30 points, we would be golden
You could win with those stats if they included the big moments of the game, which unfortunately they do not. We have missed the playoffs in 3 of his 4 seasons, after winning the division 2 of 3 years before the great one got here, we have not sniffed the division since, so my answer would be you can win with those stats, but not without any kind of clutch performance, leadership and most of all passion for the game. And that is why the Stafford comparisons are totally invalid, he is not even close to possessing any of the intangibles that Stafford has. Is there anyone here who truly believes he would have made every play like Stafford did with the Super Bowl on the line, he wilts in a regular season prime time game.
Quote: @JR44 said:
You could win with those stats if they included the big moments of the game, which unfortunately they do not. We have missed the playoffs in 3 of his 4 seasons, after winning the division 2 of 3 years before the great one got here, we have not sniffed the division since, so my answer would be you can win with those stats, but not without any kind of clutch performance, leadership and most of all passion for the game. And that is why the Stafford comparisons are totally invalid, he is not even close to possessing any of the intangibles that Stafford has. Is there anyone here who truly believes he would have made every play like Stafford did with the Super Bowl on the line, he wilts in a regular season prime time game.
Do you actually watch the games? Serious question.
Quote: @Vanguard83 said:
If our defense could keep a team under 30 points, we would be golden
Well, it's Cousins' fault we could only spend the 9th most on D.
The QB was top 10 by any measure, even though pass blocking was below average (to be kind). By contrast, our Defense was bottom 5. What here needs to be fixed? The answer seems pretty obvious.
Let's put it a different way. Rank these tasks from easiest to hardest:
a) improve on a top 10 QB;
b) improve on below average pass blocking;
c) improve on a bottom 5 defense.
For me, c) seems pretty easy.
I think b) can be a bit of a challenge. Need to break that down by OL position. Our Center and Right Guard positions are well below average. That seems easier to fix than LT or even RT.
Then we come to improving on a top 10 QB. That is a tough task. Now consider the fact that 1) we win too much to have any shot at the top overall draft pick; 2) we have no salary cap space; 3) we do not have multiple first round picks to use as trade capital; and 4) this seems to be a very weak QB draft class.
Looks like we are better off focusing on improving our defense, Center, and Right Guard.
Quote: @Hawkvike25 said:
@ HappyViking said:
Great numbers for sure, but why are
so many posts showing these stats needed to convince Longshippers that the
Vikings already have a good QB?
I think it's because we all see his flaws
too, and mainly it's in leadership, swagger, and confidence. The things
that don't show up on stat sheets. There's a burning desire to succeed in
QBs like Fran, Staubach, Bradshaw, Favre, Stabler, Brady, Mahomes, and other great winning QBs that seems to be lacking in KC. There's a fire in him missing
or he's just too dorky that’s holding him back from being a leader.
Hell,
Rudy thinks the Giants QB, Daniel Jones, was the best QB he's ever played
with. Do you guys think Jones is better than Cousins? Does anyone
here have a better understanding on how to evaluate those two QBs better than
Rudy? I doubt it.
If KC stays, fine, but if he's
traded away, it's probably because of his personality makeup not found on stat
sheets.
Because there are so many Anti-Kirk folks who like to point out stats like Our third down conversion rate being awful and having it solely apply to Kirk. Not the playcalling, not the OL, not the stats of how bad our running game was on second down, just Kirk. Or there is the well he was 8-8 last year. I think a lot of the Pro Kirk or non Anti-Kirk folks realize it's a team game and there have been way bigger issues the last two years. Very few want to pay him $45MM, but how he has performed in the last 1.5 seasons makes him worth $35MM per year.
Team. Game.
I pointed out that the Vikings 3rd down conversion percentage was one of the lowest in the league and we tied for most 3 and outs. Also said it was a combination of a lack of execution (playcalling?), penalties, and Cousins checking it down and not moving the chains. Yes it's absolutely a team game, but Cousins shares in that blame. Our offense stalled a lot last year for various reasons and Cousins check downs and inability to extend plays were one of them. I'm not sure why so many are continually wanting to hitch their wagons to a 34 year quarterback who wants big money and isn't considered elite an elite player at his position. He's actually considered to be a laughing stock and one of the biggest reasons the media points out that we aren't real contenders. His record is his record...gloss it however you want..
Quote: @JustinTime18™ said:
@ JR44 said:
You could win with those stats if they included the big moments of the game, which unfortunately they do not. We have missed the playoffs in 3 of his 4 seasons, after winning the division 2 of 3 years before the great one got here, we have not sniffed the division since, so my answer would be you can win with those stats, but not without any kind of clutch performance, leadership and most of all passion for the game. And that is why the Stafford comparisons are totally invalid, he is not even close to possessing any of the intangibles that Stafford has. Is there anyone here who truly believes he would have made every play like Stafford did with the Super Bowl on the line, he wilts in a regular season prime time game.
Do you actually watch the games? Serious question.
Are you so narcissistic that it never occurs to you that someone else's opinion other than your own is correct? Or that there are just other opinions that exist. It seems very obvious there is your world and then everything else is a joke to you. Serious question.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Can't win with those numbers? Yes, I do wish his cap number was more manageable but the production is there.
A QB who can put up those kind of numbers consistently is what everyone is looking for. You build a team around that kind of talent.
It was 12 years between Culpepper and Cousins. Jets have been waiting 40 years to find their guy. Chad, Sanchez, Geno, Darnold. For the Browns, it's been 30 years since Kosar. Couch, Quinn, McCoy, Mayfield and a handful of crap in between. Lions, Bears, Commies...Giants have had shit since Manning. Eagles 13 years since McNabb. There's at least a dozen others like that.
But the Vikings will find their guy right away? It's far more likely they end up on a years, maybe decades, long QB carousel, wasting the careers of JJ, Dalvin, etc.
Stats only tell part of a story. I have watched with critical eyes all those QB's you mentioned and many many more. I have come to a different (oh my  conclusion on Kirk.
I do not think he can win us a Super Bowl.
I also don't think we are only 1 or 2 players away us to get a division title.
I think our Zimmer created "window" has closed (at least 2 years ago).
I think many of us over value some of our current roster players
It is time for a new regime to reboot and build.
I am really hoping some other team believes in the stats you mention and offers a great deal for Kirk and his $45/35.
This will enable us to reload and retry at the QB position and build with them. I have seen enough of Kirk over the many years, and I am not impressed by the stats. Just like I was advocating for Zimmer a few years ago I really hope Kwesi/O'Connell has seen enough as well.
Like I said, I am really hoping some other team believes in the stats you mention and offers a great deal for Kirk and his $45/35. Then we can rebuild because we need a lot of new players.
We will have to be aggressive to find that future franchise QB instead of just waiting for someone to drop in the 3rd round. You have to swing to hit the ball and not just be happy with a walk.
I know I am in the minority at least on this site but I don't read or blog anywhere else.
As a Viking for Life, it would be great if Kirk (and surround team with some fixes) can win us a SB. I just don't think it will happen and want another reset with a new regime.
Quote: @JustinTime18™ said:
@ HappyViking said:
Great numbers for sure, but why are
so many posts showing these stats needed to convince Longshippers that the
Vikings already have a good QB?
I think it's because we all see his flaws
too, and mainly it's in leadership, swagger, and confidence. The things
that don't show up on stat sheets. There's a burning desire to succeed in
QBs like Fran, Staubach, Bradshaw, Favre, Stabler, Brady, Mahomes, and other great winning QBs that seems to be lacking in KC. There's a fire in him missing
or he's just too dorky that’s holding him back from being a leader.
Hell,
Rudy thinks the Giants QB, Daniel Jones, was the best QB he's ever played
with. Do you guys think Jones is better than Cousins? Does anyone
here have a better understanding on how to evaluate those two QBs better than
Rudy? I doubt it.
If KC stays, fine, but if he's
traded away, it's probably because of his personality makeup not found on stat
sheets.
If leadership is an issue, why is he a captain?
Because Zimmer made him captain.
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