Could This Be Spielman’s Best Draft?

Thanks for taking the time to put this together Bob...

RS had a ridiculous amount of offensive starters to have to replace this offseason. How much that'll translate to into an improved offense remains to be seen. I suspect some pieces will be around a couple of years, like Reiff, not sure Remmers is more than a year on-board guy or not?

The one thing RS did this draft that I still don't understand is all the trade-downs late. I think we passed on some potential depth along the way.

@"purplefaithful" said:

The one thing RS did this draft that I still don't understand is all the trade-downs late. I think we passed on some potential depth along the way.

Well, we started with a 2nd, two 3rds, two 4ths, and a 5th, 6th, and 7th round pick for 8 total picks.

Rick had to trade our 2nd and one of the 4ths to get Dalvin...  So now we're down to two 3rds and a 4th plus our 5th through 7th.  Seven total picks now.

Then Rick moved up again with our early 3rd to get Elflein and had to give up a 5th as well.  

Now we've picked 2 players earlier than our original draft slots and have a late 3rd, a 4th, and a 6th and 7th round pick left.  Started with 8 picks and now we only have 6.

I don't mind Rick trading back with our 3rd to get another 4th and recoup a 5th. After all his dealing, we ended up picking twice in the 4th, added an extra 5th from our original set of picks, and added 3 more 7ths.

It's confusing as hell, but if you want to look at the end result...  We essentially gave up our late 3rd to move up in the 2nd and 3rd round for Dalvin and Elflein and ended up with an extra 5th and three extra 7th round picks from our original set of 8.

If Cook and Elflein shine and Hodges and Isidora turn into starters, no one will be complaining about all the trading around...  I agree with Bob, this could be one of Spielman's best drafts.  I have the same feeling about this one as I did in 2015...  Time will tell.

Ahh Pre season hype in all it's best form ;)   I am all for the enthusiasm but lets not forget last year was one of the worst in vikings history too.  And that's after 1 year in the books. 

I think we should wait a bit before declaring this one of the best drafts.  Every draft has potential.  I like this draft a lot but I wouldn't put it up there yet.

6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson 

I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

@"twgerber" said: Ahh Pre season hype in all it's best form ;)   I am all for the enthusiasm but lets not forget last year was one of the worst in vikings history too.  And that's after 1 year in the books. 

I think we should wait a bit before declaring this one of the best drafts.  Every draft has potential.  I like this draft a lot but I wouldn't put it up there yet.

Why was last years draft one of the worst in history? We traded our number 1 for last years, and this years starting QB, we banked enough picks last year to aid in making transitions this year. What I mean buy that is even though we didn't have a first round draft pick this year we still were able to manipulate the draft and snag a bargain 1st round talent and not suffer too much with the remainder of our draft. As far as last year's draft the only pick that I can see not being great was the Beavers pick. Other than that I think it was smart to bank future picks last year when it was thought that many of those picks wouldn't be making the team that year. 

Also I'd like to point out that the title of Bobs' piece was that it may be one of Rick Spielman's best drafts. Not one of the best in VIkings History. 

And to me last year one of Rick's worst.  They got too damn cute.

Beavers, The german dude, etc.   They didn't draft one guy that contributed last year and may not even this year.   Alexandar has a chance to contribute.  Might be the only guy with Treadwell hurt yet again.  

And I doubt this year tops 2015 draft which was outstanding so far.

Just too early - after one preseason game to speculate it may be one of Rick's best.

@"twgerber" said: And to me last year one of Rick's worst.  They got too damn cute.

Beavers, The german dude, etc.   They didn't draft one guy that contributed last year and may not even this year.   Alexandar has a chance to contribute.  Might be the only guy with Treadwell hurt yet again.  

And I doubt this year tops 2015 draft which was outstanding so far.

Just too early - after one preseason game to speculate it may be one of Rick's best.

I think Bob is going off more than just the single preseason game,  but also the information that is coming from OTAs, minicamps, and several weeks of training camps talking about how much of an impact many of this years draft picks are contributing already.  I have to admit that I was pretty impressed by several of those guys that when picked I thought were likely a wasted pick.  

Also,  I have to look at Bradford as a 2017 draft pick... how can we not?  so far we have  1 nearly full season as a starter and likely a second one on the way from a position that is nearly impossible to find success with.

as far as 2016... well ya got that one.  we really havent gotten shit from that draft class,  and nothing outstanding seems very imminent.

@"JimmyinSD" said: 6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson  I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

Read it again Jimmy, it says Speedster Rodney Adams AND Danny Isodora to hopefully replace CP AND add OL Depth 

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said: 6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson  I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

Read it again Jimmy, it says Speedster Rodney Adams AND Danny Isodora to hopefully replace CP AND add OL Depth 

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said: 6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson  I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

Read it again Jimmy, it says Speedster Rodney Adams AND Danny Isodora to hopefully replace CP AND add OL Depth 

I know what you wrote and what you meant to say... I am saying it reads that you are expecting Isidora to replace CP and add OL depth.  had you added the word respectively to that sentence it would have reverted the "replace patterson" back to Adams.  No big deal, just having a little fun.  ;)

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said: 6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson  I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

Read it again Jimmy, it says Speedster Rodney Adams AND Danny Isodora to hopefully replace CP AND add OL Depth 

I know what you wrote and what you meant to say... I am saying it reads that you are expecting Isidora to replace CP and add OL depth.  had you added the word respectively to that sentence it would have reverted the "replace patterson" back to Adams.  No big deal, just having a little fun.  ;)

First attempt, it's a lot harder than it looks   LOL

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Viking Bob" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said: 6’3 305 pounder from Miami G Danny Isodora, to hopefully replace Patterson  I dont see him on KR,  but I cant wait to see Isadora on the little bubble screen that Patterson was known for...  :p 

Read it again Jimmy, it says Speedster Rodney Adams AND Danny Isodora to hopefully replace CP AND add OL Depth 

I know what you wrote and what you meant to say... I am saying it reads that you are expecting Isidora to replace CP and add OL depth.  had you added the word respectively to that sentence it would have reverted the "replace patterson" back to Adams.  No big deal, just having a little fun.  ;)

First attempt, it's a lot harder than it looks   LOL

ya did a good job Bob,  but if I didnt crack yer nuts a little bit... whats the point?

I'm historically a big RS supporter, but not this time. I think this Draft was almost as bad as last year's.

First, Cook is no gimme. Dude was dinged up like every other game at FSU. He's only a good or great pick If he leaves the injury bug in college. If it follows him to the Pros...

No complaints on the Elflein pick. Nor do I have an issue with trading up for either Pat or Dalvin. That Rick went on tilt trying to replace the picks he gave up is another big problem, though.

Jaleel Johnson? What the Hell? Team has Tom Johnson coming back, signed Jones and Sutton, then used their 3rd selection on yet another 3T?

What makes it worse is that Dorian Johnson went just a few picks later. Unquestionably a better prospect for a Unit that really needed help then Danny Isidora.

Gedeon is what, the replacement for Audi Cole? Wasn't Audie an UDFA? The kid can't cover. But let's say he does pan out. Will he make a bigger impact on the Defense than Nico Siragusa, who was available and also undeniably a better prospect than Isidora.

Will Ben Gedeon help the team more than developmental OT prospect Julie'n Davenport, who was also available? 

And then we get to the Trader Rick section of the Draft where acquiring as many late picks as he could resulted in passing on Chad Hansen, Jake Butt, George Kittles, and Isaac Asiata.

All of them are better prospects than what Rick ended up selecting. And he whiffed on Kickers too. And virtually guaranteed that the team has to pick OTs early and often next year.

I defend Rick a lot. But his last two Drafts stink from a 'What's available' standpoint. It's possible every one of these kids pans out. Or at least several do, which would make him look like a genius.

But given his track record at drafting O-Line guys and what he passed on to settle for Danny Isidora, whom I've heard described multiple times as career backup at best, I'm not holding my breath.

I am not a draftnik by any stretch, but just a simple question.  Have any of those players you mention started an NFL game yet?  Have any made the HOF or even an NFL roster at this point?

I F'n love the Elfien pick. Only time will tell, but I have been thinking it might be the best as well, especially considering we were handicapped by the lack of a 1st round pick. I believe in this team, but mostly the coaching staff who will bring home our first Super Bowl victory ever. Glass is always half full in preseason! SKOL!!!

Lets see, they drafted Bradford in the first, Cook in the 2nd, Elflein in the third, Jaleel Johnson in the fourth, in the 5th through 7th they got bunch of development prospects and a few of them have shown some real potential in Hodges, Isadora, and Coley, who all could be nice finds at that point in the draft and then many others to round out the 90 man roster. 

So far it looks like a good draft.  How many OG do you need to draft at a time?  As it is it's going to be a numbers game for some young prospects and maybe even an old vet like Berger.   Reiff, Remmers, Elflein, Hill, Boone, Easton are near locks as is Berger most likely that leaves 2 spots for OG or preferably swing tackles.  Isadora looks solid so you have Clemmings, Sirles, Beavers, Kerin, already on the bubble so I don't know that adding any other rookie OG would have been very beneficial.  It should shake out more this year and they likely will need to try to get an OT or high quality OG in next years draft.  I think it was a good draft at this point.

Cole was drafted FYI.

I don't have a big issue with late round manuvers overall.   I have no idea about any of the late round guys that went anywhere to any team.  A few will work out. Most won't.

Late rounds are a numbers game generally.  If there was a prospect still there rounds 5 or later then there was a reason.

Its going to be difficult for any draft class to top 2015...

Waynes
Kendrick
Hunter
Diggs
Robinson

Kendrick, Hunter, and Diggs are cornerstones, Waynes could be, and Robinson will most likely be a solid starter and ST contributor...

Cook is the bellcow of the current class, could/should be a stud... Coley could be a steal, but at best he's the #4 WR...same for Adams...After that, I think we get a bunch of solid guys...guys who start or contribute on ST...Bower could be the lynchpin to maximizing this class, but even if he does, he's still likely the 4th DE at best...

@"greediron" said: I am not a draftnik by any stretch, but just a simple question.  Have any of those players you mention started an NFL game yet?  Have any made the HOF or even an NFL roster at this point?

FSUVike knows college football very well and his prospect evaluations are solid. Of course none of his suggested players are in the HOF yet. But neither are any of the guys Spielman picked this spring, but plenty of people are endorsing them.  You need to look at the record of the guy who chose all these players, and his strategy of accumulating late picks (rounds 5-7) over earlier ones.

In the drafts from 2006 (when Spielman joined the team) through 2016, he has picked 50 players in rounds 5-7, and 41 in rounds 1-4. We've had an average of 1.5 picks in every round 5 or later, but .93 picks in the first 4. He likes to collect late picks.

For his 50 late-round picks, what has Spielman acquired as far as productive players?

• John Sullivan - very good starter
• Stefon Diggs - very good starter, could be great
• Brandon Fusco - decent starter for 5 seasons
• Robert Blanton, Shamar Stephen - fill-in backups
• A couple of kickers who are gone now

3 starters for 50 picks in those late rounds - 1 in 16. He picked 7 late-rounders this year, so we shouldn't expect more than about 1/2 a starting player among Isadora, Adams, Coley, Hodges, and the rest. "Coaches say so-and-so looks great in practice"..? So did MyCole Pruitt, Jeff Baca, Brandon Watts, DeMarcus Love, etc....

I think this draft was ok with a chance of being really
good.

I’m a fan of Cook and Elflein.  I think both are high floor – high ceiling prospects.
 I probably would have went Feeney, but I
can see the desire to go C over G with all the guys we can plug into RG.  I’m not really buying into the Cook off the
field issues.  I really like Hodges.  He was a big value pick in the 6th,
but for the most part I’m not a fan of the bottom bulk of the draft.  Isidora and Gedeon are growing on me.  It really seemed like we were drafting ST
only players.  I think we really should
have drafted a top kicker and/or punter. 
Best of class options were available at the bottom of the draft, and it’s
not like many of these late round picks are going to be sticking. 

I think a lot of things have to go right for it to be the “best
draft” over the 2015 draft.