Already mentioned in other threads, but...

@"StickyBun" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"StickyBun" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

Kirks endzone pick may have sealed the teams fate on sunday,  but the loss was hardly on him alone.  plenty of other fingers of blame to be pointed from that shit show.

Lots of bad things happened, but when it came time to overcome ALL of it, the opportunity was there....twice....and the $84 million dollar man failed miserably. That's the bottom line. Nobody asked him to go 80 yards for the TD in 30 seconds. First and goal with plenty of time and that INT was horrific. 

i have never understood the logic behind the blame going to the last one to touch something that breaks.  I dont blame a kicker who misses a last second field goal in a game of 3600 seconds any more than the guy who drops a wide open pass in the first quarter.  its a team game and if one player is allowed a trasngression,  then others should be as well regardless of the time on the clock.    scramble the fuck ups and the result is still the same.  we lost a 60 minute team game by 5 points.   hell if Diggs hadnt pushed us back 15 yards after his TD i think we would have went for 2 at that point who knows how that changes things.  if the D hadnt slept through the first quarter, if the kicker hadnt missed once again on a makeable 3 pointer... iffs and butts... its a team game and a team loss.  Cousins shit the bed,  no disputing that,  but he also was the one that dropped a perfect pass into Diggs to help claw back into that shit show.

Team Loss.

Dude, that's your opinion. I have mine. I don't agree with your 'logic', you can certainly not agree with mine. 

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"StickyBun" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"StickyBun" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

Kirks endzone pick may have sealed the teams fate on sunday,  but the loss was hardly on him alone.  plenty of other fingers of blame to be pointed from that shit show.

Lots of bad things happened, but when it came time to overcome ALL of it, the opportunity was there....twice....and the $84 million dollar man failed miserably. That's the bottom line. Nobody asked him to go 80 yards for the TD in 30 seconds. First and goal with plenty of time and that INT was horrific. 

i have never understood the logic behind the blame going to the last one to touch something that breaks.  I dont blame a kicker who misses a last second field goal in a game of 3600 seconds any more than the guy who drops a wide open pass in the first quarter.  its a team game and if one player is allowed a trasngression,  then others should be as well regardless of the time on the clock.    scramble the fuck ups and the result is still the same.  we lost a 60 minute team game by 5 points.   hell if Diggs hadnt pushed us back 15 yards after his TD i think we would have went for 2 at that point who knows how that changes things.  if the D hadnt slept through the first quarter, if the kicker hadnt missed once again on a makeable 3 pointer... iffs and butts... its a team game and a team loss.  Cousins shit the bed,  no disputing that,  but he also was the one that dropped a perfect pass into Diggs to help claw back into that shit show.

Team Loss.

Dude, that's your opinion. I have mine. I don't agree with your 'logic', you can certainly not agree with mine. 

DUDE (?)  thats all I was doing.  I didnt say you were fucked in the head or that you were wrong,  simply said I dont agree with those that try and hang the loss on 1 player or 1 play.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

@"Jor-El" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

I'm not sure that is the one (meaning only) argument that Cousins will have a very bad year: my real concern is that his attitude/confidence has been ruined. A year ago, in the tie against GB, he was great, and more importantly, he was confident and gutsy, making some amazing throws and good decisions. All those 400 yard or 4 TD games were early (and when he may have been still learning JDF's new offense). But with the turnovers and the overall team issues, by the second half of 2018 he looked like a different player and that's still how he looked last Sunday. Against Atlanta, he didn't have to do much. As for his comments about the new offense, does that really reflect his difficulty learning it - or that he doesn't like that his team has planned, and made it clear in public, that they are shifting to an offense that will minimize the need for him to throw much?
Maybe he's just a streaky, great game / terrible game type of passer, and that will lead to at least as many good Sundays as bad ones, and that a third of our games will be like Atlanta where we don't even need him. That could get this team to a winning record but it might be pretty hollow and almost certainly lead to a quick playoff exit.
No, I can't prove this, but my opinion is that Zimmer is only good with quarterbacks as long as they are playing low-risk mistake-free football, but with any challenges or even excitement, he gets critical and makes their problems worse, not better. Keenum seemed to just have a hell-with-it attitude that kept him from really caring that Zimmer was criticizing him even after wins, and he had Pat Shurmur keeping Zimmer away. Cousins has had 2 young OCs that probably don't lock Zimmer out of the QB room when he's pissed off...maybe Kubiak does, but I get the impression he's more involved with blocking schemes and game planning than in rebuilding QB confidence. We'll see..

It was a team loss. Mike deferred the coin toss to put his defense out there. That said defense let them go unabated to the endzone in like 4 plays to open a tough road game. We got down but didn't give up on the only thing that was working for us. The run game. Kirk had a terrible game. Kirk finally blew it big on one terrible throw. Then the defense couldn't get a stop to give him another chance to blow it. Team loss but bigger emotional loss for Kirk who might be psyching himself out.  

@"Jor-El" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

I'm not sure that is the one (meaning only) argument that Cousins will have a very bad year: my real concern is that his attitude/confidence has been ruined. A year ago, in the tie against GB, he was great, and more importantly, he was confident and gutsy, making some amazing throws and good decisions. All those 400 yard or 4 TD games were early (and when he may have been still learning JDF's new offense). But with the turnovers and the overall team issues, by the second half of 2018 he looked like a different player and that's still how he looked last Sunday. Against Atlanta, he didn't have to do much. As for his comments about the new offense, does that really reflect his difficulty learning it - or that he doesn't like that his team has planned, and made it clear in public, that they are shifting to an offense that will minimize the need for him to throw much?
Maybe he's just a streaky, great game / terrible game type of passer, and that will lead to at least as many good Sundays as bad ones, and that a third of our games will be like Atlanta where we don't even need him. That could get this team to a winning record but it might be pretty hollow and almost certainly lead to a quick playoff exit.
No, I can't prove this, but my opinion is that Zimmer is only good with quarterbacks as long as they are playing low-risk mistake-free football, but with any challenges or even excitement, he gets critical and makes their problems worse, not better. Keenum seemed to just have a hell-with-it attitude that kept him from really caring that Zimmer was criticizing him even after wins, and he had Pat Shurmur keeping Zimmer away. Cousins has had 2 young OCs that probably don't lock Zimmer out of the QB room when he's pissed off...maybe Kubiak does, but I get the impression he's more involved with blocking schemes and game planning than in rebuilding QB confidence. We'll see..

I dont think KC handles pressure very well and the pressure of lameblow stadium against the packers and finding himself down by 21 in what appeared to be a route before the offense even got a sweat going was likely a shit ton of pressure on him...  I honestly think the guy is in his own head to much,  I doubt that anything anybody else can say is going to make him feel any worse about his performance than what he is already telling himself.

A different start to that game and I suspect we see a completely different KC.

@"JimmyinSD" said: I dont think KC handles pressure very well and the pressure of lameblow stadium against the packers and finding himself down by 21 in what appeared to be a route before the offense even got a sweat going was likely a shit ton of pressure on him...  I honestly think the guy is in his own head to much,  I doubt that anything anybody else can say is going to make him feel any worse about his performance than what he is already telling himself.

A different start to that game and I suspect we see a completely different KC.

@"JimmyinSD" said: I dont think KC handles pressure very well and the pressure of lameblow stadium against the packers and finding himself down by 21 in what appeared to be a route before the offense even got a sweat going was likely a shit ton of pressure on him...  I honestly think the guy is in his own head to much,  I doubt that anything anybody else can say is going to make him feel any worse about his performance than what he is already telling himself.

A different start to that game and I suspect we see a completely different KC.

@"suncoastvike" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said: I dont think KC handles pressure very well and the pressure of lameblow stadium against the packers and finding himself down by 21 in what appeared to be a route before the offense even got a sweat going was likely a shit ton of pressure on him...  I honestly think the guy is in his own head to much,  I doubt that anything anybody else can say is going to make him feel any worse about his performance than what he is already telling himself.

A different start to that game and I suspect we see a completely different KC.

I agree. 
Shouldn't we expect more then a player that can win when everything goes good though? For the money I think we should.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

I'm not sure that is the one (meaning only) argument that Cousins will have a very bad year: my real concern is that his attitude/confidence has been ruined. A year ago, in the tie against GB, he was great, and more importantly, he was confident and gutsy, making some amazing throws and good decisions. All those 400 yard or 4 TD games were early (and when he may have been still learning JDF's new offense). But with the turnovers and the overall team issues, by the second half of 2018 he looked like a different player and that's still how he looked last Sunday. Against Atlanta, he didn't have to do much. As for his comments about the new offense, does that really reflect his difficulty learning it - or that he doesn't like that his team has planned, and made it clear in public, that they are shifting to an offense that will minimize the need for him to throw much?
Maybe he's just a streaky, great game / terrible game type of passer, and that will lead to at least as many good Sundays as bad ones, and that a third of our games will be like Atlanta where we don't even need him. That could get this team to a winning record but it might be pretty hollow and almost certainly lead to a quick playoff exit.
No, I can't prove this, but my opinion is that Zimmer is only good with quarterbacks as long as they are playing low-risk mistake-free football, but with any challenges or even excitement, he gets critical and makes their problems worse, not better. Keenum seemed to just have a hell-with-it attitude that kept him from really caring that Zimmer was criticizing him even after wins, and he had Pat Shurmur keeping Zimmer away. Cousins has had 2 young OCs that probably don't lock Zimmer out of the QB room when he's pissed off...maybe Kubiak does, but I get the impression he's more involved with blocking schemes and game planning than in rebuilding QB confidence. We'll see..

Is it possible that a remarkably accurate QB who has been in the NFL for 8 seasons and has thrown for over 4,000 yards for 4 straight seasons, with a 66% completion percentage, a 2-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio and a career passer rating that hovers around 100...suddenly has forgotten how to play QB? And what we got on Sunday is "WHO HE IS" now? Yeah, I suppose it is. It's just not very likely. In fact, I think it's pretty ridiculous. 

Like I said in a previous post, Cousins has his flaws, but accuracy ain't one of them. On Sunday against the Packers his problems showed up to the party, but they brought an ugly friend we hadn't seen before--a lack of accuracy. Those things combined to give us what was probably his worst day as a pro.

There are things you can develop in a QB and things that are inherent. Accuracy is one of the inherent things. You either have it or you don't. There are external elements that will affect it temporarily (like pressure or a sore arm, for example), but for the most part, until age-related decline happens, if it's good it stays good, and if it's bad it stays bad. And in Cousins, it's always been pretty good. That is why I'm not overly concerned about what happened on Sunday. Forget the fumbles and the ill-advised pass (I'm afraid that's just who he is). The biggest problem was the accuracy. That miss to Diggs, the other to Rudy in the endzone. That sort of stuff won't continue.  

@"greediron" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"suncoastvike" said: Kirk so far this 2nd year here has only proven he can win when he throws 10 times or less. He's not digressing is he? It's got to get better...doesn't it?

It will get a lot better. In fact, I'm guessing that his owner in my fantasy league is going to drop him tonight and I'll get a pretty good QB2 for $0 FAAB. :-)

There is one argument to make that he just won't be good this year and that's the new offense. Cousins mentioned several times in camp that it was a challenge learning a new system. If that is still a problem and continues to be, then his problems could continue. 

But it's not likely. Remember, there were games last year where this guy just couldn't miss. 400 yard games, 4 TD games, games where his accuracy was dead on. I expect there will be a few games like that this year, too. 

I'm not sure that is the one (meaning only) argument that Cousins will have a very bad year: my real concern is that his attitude/confidence has been ruined. A year ago, in the tie against GB, he was great, and more importantly, he was confident and gutsy, making some amazing throws and good decisions. All those 400 yard or 4 TD games were early (and when he may have been still learning JDF's new offense). But with the turnovers and the overall team issues, by the second half of 2018 he looked like a different player and that's still how he looked last Sunday. Against Atlanta, he didn't have to do much. As for his comments about the new offense, does that really reflect his difficulty learning it - or that he doesn't like that his team has planned, and made it clear in public, that they are shifting to an offense that will minimize the need for him to throw much?
Maybe he's just a streaky, great game / terrible game type of passer, and that will lead to at least as many good Sundays as bad ones, and that a third of our games will be like Atlanta where we don't even need him. That could get this team to a winning record but it might be pretty hollow and almost certainly lead to a quick playoff exit.
No, I can't prove this, but my opinion is that Zimmer is only good with quarterbacks as long as they are playing low-risk mistake-free football, but with any challenges or even excitement, he gets critical and makes their problems worse, not better. Keenum seemed to just have a hell-with-it attitude that kept him from really caring that Zimmer was criticizing him even after wins, and he had Pat Shurmur keeping Zimmer away. Cousins has had 2 young OCs that probably don't lock Zimmer out of the QB room when he's pissed off...maybe Kubiak does, but I get the impression he's more involved with blocking schemes and game planning than in rebuilding QB confidence. We'll see..

Is it possible that a remarkably accurate QB who has been in the NFL for 8 seasons and has thrown for over 4,000 yards for 4 straight seasons, with a 66% completion percentage, a 2-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio and a career passer rating that hovers around 100...suddenly has forgotten how to play QB? And what we got on Sunday is "WHO HE IS" now? Yeah, I suppose it is. It's just not very likely. In fact, I think it's pretty ridiculous. 

Like I said in a previous post, Cousins has his flaws, but accuracy ain't one of them. On Sunday against the Packers his problems showed up to the party, but they brought an ugly friend we hadn't seen before--a lack of accuracy. Those things combined to give us what was probably his worst day as a pro.

There are things you can develop in a QB and things that are inherent. Accuracy is one of the inherent things. You either have it or you don't. There are external elements that will affect it temporarily (like pressure or a sore arm, for example), but for the most part, until age-related decline happens, if it's good it stays good, and if it's bad it stays bad. And in Cousins, it's always been pretty good. That is why I'm not overly concerned about what happened on Sunday. Forget the fumbles and the ill-advised pass (I'm afraid that's just who he is). The biggest problem was the accuracy. That miss to Diggs, the other to Rudy in the endzone. That sort of stuff won't continue.  

I put that on Diggs.  Watch it again if you can, Diggs slowed down very briefly before he saw the ball was coming his way.  That is why he was so upset and lay on the field IMO.  He knew he gave up on it and cost him a huge catch.

I don't think it's the scoreboard as much as it's about his own personal adversity play to play. I think he walks out to the huddle down 7 like it never happened. He walks out to the huddle down 14 feeling pressured by a couple incompletions on the previous drive - fumbles on back to back plays. Down 21, we run it into the endzone after another incompletion.  Green Bay fumbles on their next possession, and now we have a serious opportunity to grab a hold of this game. Kirk throws 2 incompletions and we go 3 and out... he never snapped out of it.

Maybe that touchdown pass called back for OPI would have been a big underrated momentum booster for him...