Source: Vikings pondering a change with left tackle Riley Reiff

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"MaroonBells" said: Keep Reiff at LT, keep O'Neill at RT for now. Sign either Saffold or Easton at LG, move Elflein to RG. Draft Risner at 18 to play center (Risner also gives us depth at every other position except left tackle). Draft future LT or RT Edoga in the 3rd.

With Collins and Isidora as experienced depth, this is suddenly a solid, versatile and deep offensive line with 3 players capable of playing center (if Easton), 5 at tackle (if Saffold) and 5 at guard. 

i am with all of that except moving Elf.   I know he was a good OG in college,  but i really question if he has the lead in his ass to play OG in the pros.  at Center he is a bit protected from having to single up on a monster DT,  but at OG he will find himself without help quite a bit.   and I really thought he played C quite well as a rookie and that he could still show a lot of improvement and growth at the position.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"MaroonBells" said: Keep Reiff at LT, keep O'Neill at RT for now. Sign either Saffold or Easton at LG, move Elflein to RG. Draft Risner at 18 to play center (Risner also gives us depth at every other position except left tackle). Draft future LT or RT Edoga in the 3rd.

With Collins and Isidora as experienced depth, this is suddenly a solid, versatile and deep offensive line with 3 players capable of playing center (if Easton), 5 at tackle (if Saffold) and 5 at guard. 

i am with all of that except moving Elf.   I know he was a good OG in college,  but i really question if he has the lead in his ass to play OG in the pros.  at Center he is a bit protected from having to single up on a monster DT,  but at OG he will find himself without help quite a bit.   and I really thought he played C quite well as a rookie and that he could still show a lot of improvement and growth at the position.

Well, we're all just guessing at what we're going to be looking for now that Kubiak (and his minions) will be dictating the makeup of our offensive line. 

I would say that, based on his draft profile anyway, Elflein's strengths were precisely the lead in his ass--his leverage and leadership, and his weakness was his footwork and athleticism. Will Kubiak want a more zone-friendly center?

I keep thinking about what Kyle Shanahan (another zone evangelist) did right after drafting McGlinchey. He traded his behemoth, and ill-fit-in-a-zone, right tackle Trent Brown to the Patriots.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Bullazin" said: Reiff can kick inside and produce at a high level way faster than a rookie OT.  Guy is a captain for a reason

what does captain have to do with position flexibility?   LJ is a team captain,  but I dont think he would do shit at DE or LB.

Another thing about moving Reiff: his cap hit in 2019 is $11.7M. That's OK for OT (projected currently at 13th in the NFL), but 7th highest OG.
I'm cautious about moving him to either RT (didn't do well there in Detroit) or OG. Leave LT and RT alone for another year and work on the interior. Vikings will probably move on from Reiff a year from now when his salary increases but his dead cap drops a lot.

@"Jor-El" said: Another thing about moving Reiff: his cap hit in 2019 is $11.7M. That's OK for OT (projected currently at 13th in the NFL), but 7th highest OG. I'm cautious about moving him to either RT (didn't do well there in Detroit) or OG. Leave LT and RT alone for another year and work on the interior. Vikings will probably move on from Reiff a year from now when his salary increases but his dead cap drops a lot.

As others pointed out he is the least of our worries in the OL.  i wanted but failed to make a clear point that Reif would excel at LG way more reasonably than drafting a college T and moving them inside. 

As to the failure of Remmers to move inside and succeed, theres no comparing skillsets between Remmers and Reif. 

taking a "subpar" LT out of his natural position and assuming a great RT will be a great LT sounds like a recipe for disaster. This is something that could have been tried already. The coaching staff could have spoken up and it would have been done. This rotation could have at least been attempted so there is actually film supporting the idea.

To sit here at the end of the season saying, "wait, all we need to do is shuffle these guys around!" is exactly the type of shit i'm tired of this front office doing. This is totally something that could have happened around Week 7, not an off-season solution to our issues on the line.

How did this work out for Mike Remmers at RG? It's a do nothing and pretend we're better fantasy. We had O'Neil to play RT - moving O'Neil to LT and Reiff to LG gives us 2 players playing new positions and hands someone the RT tackle position. Move Remmers back outside? Who's playing RG? Forget moving people around as a solution and just fill the fucking holes on the line. You can move these guys around easy in OTAs and Camp if it's not happening... but to do nothing but rely on something you could have already done... it's just.... uuughhh...

This is like being forced to watch a bad movie again.  My all time worst movie was ...
The Attack of the Killer Tomatoes"
... awful.  Just awful.
Now Rieff is no tomato but moving him to guard should come with a roll of duct tape.

I don't think this an awful idea, but it isn't great either. It ultimately depends what the larger plan is to fill the other four positions. It does give the team more options as they approach free agency and the draft. Historically the Vikings have felt more comfortable drafting OT's early vs. guards. With O'Neill having some flexibility it would allow them to draft a day one starter (hopefully) and play them on their natural side. That still leaves a gap at RG but that is maybe where you target a guy in free agency or trade. Follow it up with a mid to late round pick and re-sign Easton or Compton for near the minimum and you actually have a decent talent pool. 

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I don't think this an awful idea, but it isn't great either. It ultimately depends what the larger plan is to fill the other four positions. It does give the team more options as they approach free agency and the draft. Historically the Vikings have felt more comfortable drafting OT's early vs. guards. With O'Neill having some flexibility it would allow them to draft a day one starter (hopefully) and play them on their natural side. That still leaves a gap at RG but that is maybe where you target a guy in free agency or trade. Follow it up with a mid to late round pick and re-sign Easton or Compton for near the minimum and you actually have a decent talent pool. 

@"Bullazin" said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I don't think this an awful idea, but it isn't great either. It ultimately depends what the larger plan is to fill the other four positions. It does give the team more options as they approach free agency and the draft. Historically the Vikings have felt more comfortable drafting OT's early vs. guards. With O'Neill having some flexibility it would allow them to draft a day one starter (hopefully) and play them on their natural side. That still leaves a gap at RG but that is maybe where you target a guy in free agency or trade. Follow it up with a mid to late round pick and re-sign Easton or Compton for near the minimum and you actually have a decent talent pool. 

Geoff have you heard any news on Eastons injury?  He is UFA and possibly signing for the min?  sounds like a big turnaround from a 2nd rd tender

Since the team doesn't have a boat load of cap money this year, keep Elflein at center, O-Neil and Reiff at tackles and fix the guard positions with at least one free agent and a couple of draft picks.  Future cap money can go to tweeking the tackle spots later.

@"ArizonaViking" said: Since the team doesn't have a boat load of cap money this year, keep Elflein at center, O-Neil and Reiff at tackles and fix the guard positions with at least one free agent and a couple of draft picks.  Future cap money can go to tweeking the tackle spots later.

@"pumpf" said:

@"ArizonaViking" said: Since the team doesn't have a boat load of cap money this year, keep Elflein at center, O-Neil and Reiff at tackles and fix the guard positions with at least one free agent and a couple of draft picks.  Future cap money can go to tweeking the tackle spots later.

Or, maybe, play some of the guards we already have (Easton was hurt... so he *might* help next year), like Isadora.  Yeah, I know, the team didn't think that he was better than Compton or Remmers.  But the "team" also didn't think that O'Neill was better than Hill.

Reiff, still a big strong man who is agile, not so much fast out of the gate, seems like sliding over to LG could be a good fit.  Playing inside could hide some of his weaknesses, remember we dont need top 5 G performance, we need 12-18th G performance for a major upgrade.

To me, the biggest ????? is Collins.  If he is healthy, he is a super intriguing player.  He has size, speed, and stregth, agile and looks to be very good on the second level.  If he can step into the RT position and perform admirably (as good as ONeill did in 18’) without any major upgrades via FA or the early draft, we could have soldified the line with only RG as the weakness.  

How to address RG?
1) Draft Ford in the 1st and resign Easton
OL: ONeill-Reiff-Elf-Ford-Collins with back ups Easton (G), Jones (C), Isodora (G), rookie or Hill as T

2) Sign Easton and add another FA from a ZBS (Levitre? Carpenter?)
OL: ONeill-Reiff-Elf-Levitre-Collins with Easton, 2nd Round OL, Jones, Isodora

3) Trade Xavier for Osemele
OL: ONeill-Reiff-Elf-Osemele-Collins with Easton, 2nd Round OL, Jones, Isodora, Rookie T

3# would be a very long shot but the contract numbers are similar, I’m not certain how KO would fit in ZBS but man that would be amassive OL.  No doubt the riskier move but could have the biggest payoff.  I could see a much maligned OLmoving into the league top 10.  How good is this team with a top 10 OL?  How many wins would that have been worth in 2018, the Rams game? Both Bears games? Seattle?  Could we have gone 11-4-1, 10-5-1?

Going to be interesting

I asked around on this and it sounds like moving Reiff inside is an option on the table but not the plan as of today. Based on the Vikings past draft philosophies I doubt they'd choose at guard unless they trade down in the 1st. But that doesn't mean they wouldn't take the right OT, which would potentially make Reiff the guy to move. There are a lot of unknowns but there are really 3 ways I see it going. 

1. They draft a LT. It would make the most sense to leave the rookie on their natural side and then if they can start day one bump Reiff inside. If they need a year of development you end up leaving Reiff on the outside and develop the rookie at LG. 

2. Draft a RT. This is probably more clear-cut. They would move O'Neill back to LT which is theoretically his natural side and bump Reiff inside. 

3. Draft a guard outside of round one. Obviously Reiff stays put. 

Personally I would be planning to move on from Reiff in 2020 barring a restructure this off-season. You can't eat the dead money unless you do it post-June 1. That is the fall through if they do bump him inside to guard and he is beat out. But more likely than a straight up cut, he'd have trade value. 

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I asked around on this and it sounds like moving Reiff inside is an option on the table but not the plan as of today. Based on the Vikings past draft philosophies I doubt they'd choose at guard unless they trade down in the 1st. But that doesn't mean they wouldn't take the right OT, which would potentially make Reiff the guy to move. There are a lot of unknowns but there are really 3 ways I see it going. 

1. They draft a LT. It would make the most sense to leave the rookie on their natural side and then if they can start day one bump Reiff inside. If they need a year of development you end up leaving Reiff on the outside and develop the rookie at LG. 

2. Draft a RT. This is probably more clear-cut. They would move O'Neill back to LT which is theoretically his natural side and bump Reiff inside. 

3. Draft a guard outside of round one. Obviously Reiff stays put. 

Personally I would be planning to move on from Reiff in 2020 barring a restructure this off-season. You can't eat the dead money unless you do it post-June 1. That is the fall through if they do bump him inside to guard and he is beat out. But more likely than a straight up cut, he'd have trade value. 

Since their inception, the Vikings have drafted one OG in the first round of the draft. 

Any guesses as to who that was, or how far back you have to go to find it?

A long ways and we'll just say it was one hell of a pick too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Minnesota_Vikings_first-round_draft_picks#By_position

@"purplefaithful" said: Since their inception, the Vikings have drafted one OG in the first round of the draft. 

Any guesses as to who that was, or how far back you have to go to find it?

A long ways and we'll just say it was one hell of a pick too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Minnesota_Vikings_first-round_draft_picks#By_position

@"Geoff Nichols" said: I asked around on this and it sounds like moving Reiff inside is an option on the table but not the plan as of today. Based on the Vikings past draft philosophies I doubt they'd choose at guard unless they trade down in the 1st. But that doesn't mean they wouldn't take the right OT, which would potentially make Reiff the guy to move. There are a lot of unknowns but there are really 3 ways I see it going. 

1. They draft a LT. It would make the most sense to leave the rookie on their natural side and then if they can start day one bump Reiff inside. If they need a year of development you end up leaving Reiff on the outside and develop the rookie at LG. 

2. Draft a RT. This is probably more clear-cut. They would move O'Neill back to LT which is theoretically his natural side and bump Reiff inside. 

3. Draft a guard outside of round one. Obviously Reiff stays put. 

Personally I would be planning to move on from Reiff in 2020 barring a restructure this off-season. You can't eat the dead money unless you do it post-June 1. That is the fall through if they do bump him inside to guard and he is beat out. But more likely than a straight up cut, he'd have trade value.