My take on fixing the review process ...(edited for clarity)

I have always said, take it out of the hands of the coaches.  They shouldn't be responsible for catching and fixing blown calls.

There should be a watcher to catch obvious mistakes and he could buzz down to the head ref to say they may need to look at it. 

Other than that, I think they should do away with so much of it.  catch the obvious ones, but trust the judgment of the guys paid to do the job.

How about just getting rid of the old slow and visually impaired REFS!!!! There should be a farm system of full time refs that earn their way onto the field. This is just bizarre to see a 65 year old Ed Hockuly he's a dinosaur!

@"greediron" said: I have always said, take it out of the hands of the coaches.  They shouldn't be responsible for catching and fixing blown calls.

There should be a watcher to catch obvious mistakes and he could buzz down to the head ref to say they may need to look at it. 

Other than that, I think they should do away with so much of it.  catch the obvious ones, but trust the judgment of the guys paid to do the job.

and for the love of God,  get full time refs that are graded after each game and have some sort of minimum proficiency standard as well as a pool of trainees to pull from,  this reffing has gotten to be so bad its really making the league look more like the WWF every day.

@"ATXVIKE" said: How about just getting rid of the old slow and visually impaired REFS!!!! There should be a farm system of full time refs that earn their way onto the field. This is just bizarre to see a 65 year old Ed Hockuly he's a dinosaur!

funny,  i was typing the same thing.   i dont think its necessarily an age thing,  but they need to be graded and those that dont make the grade get dumped.  full time refs with training classes and such during the week.

but instant replay needs to be fixed.  even with the best refs you will have calls that get botched,  we need to be able to quickly get those calls fixed, fixed right,  and keep the games moving.

4 minutes????? 1 minute max. 

The things that bothers me most about challenges:

1. That they have a bias towards ruling something in a way that is challengeable.  They are biased towards TDs and TOs because they’re automatically challengeable.  But then they are also biased against changing things that aren’t 100% obvious clear.  It’s not as big an issue with TDs, but often they’ll not really see what’s going on, all of a sudden a defender has the ball and they rule it a fumble on the field because it’s reviewable, and then with replay it looks like it’s not a fumble, but it’s not 100% clear if a knee was down or something.
2. That coaches can’t review stuff in the last 2 minutes.  So you’re at the mercy of the officials when the games most critical.
3. That they can’t challenge everything.  If a ref misses an obvious game changing penalty, we’ll just pretend it didn’t happen?
4. That refs can’t use instant replay to get the call right in the first place.  In one of the games (Saints vs Panthers?) this weekend a WR caught it near the sidelines.  The ref was clearly looking the wrong way, but decided to call it a catch, and the defense had to burn a challenge because the ref missed it and made a guess.  With review the WR was clearly out prior to catching the ball.  Other times, you’ll see the refs huddle up and argue about things and in the end they just pick one of them without being in consensus.  Just let the booth ref stream his take to the head ref’s headset.
5. Bad Camera angles.  How often do they show you a replay where you can kind of see what’s happening but you miss a key detail because the cameras at a weird angle or you’re getting the D broadcast team, so they only brought 4 cameras with.  How is there not a fixed camera system in every stadium looking down the goal lines and boundaries?  They don’t even have to be broadcast quality cameras with the giant hoods and perfect color contrast, etc.  We’re spending a billion dollars for a stadium and we couldn’t throw in an extra $5M to ensure that there’s enough cameras to support instant replay?  I don’t even think the broadcast group should own them like the other cameras.  They should just be fixed within the stadium and be available to every broadcast team.

Part of the problem I have with instant replay (like it is anywhere near instant) is that they spend so much time looking at it that I think they convince themselves one way or the other. Look at it and make the call. You might get it wrong -again- but at least make the call

@"Mike Olson" said: 4 minutes????? 1 minute max. 

1 minute to get from the field to the replay equipment,  2 minutes to discuss with new york,  and 1 minute to have results announced and play resumed.  the ball will be set by the result of the play so it only has to be changed if the call is overturned and the play clock will be wound immediately with the game clock following the result of the play.   maybe cut all that to 2 minutes by only giving NY 1 minute to make their case, and only giving the ref 30 seconds to get in and out of the head gear,  but I think this all can be sped up. 

@"medaille" said: The things that bothers me most about challenges:

1. That they have a bias towards ruling something in a way that is challengeable.  They are biased towards TDs and TOs because they’re automatically challengeable.  But then they are also biased against changing things that aren’t 100% obvious clear.  It’s not as big an issue with TDs, but often they’ll not really see what’s going on, all of a sudden a defender has the ball and they rule it a fumble on the field because it’s reviewable, and then with replay it looks like it’s not a fumble, but it’s not 100% clear if a knee was down or something.
2. That coaches can’t review stuff in the last 2 minutes.  So you’re at the mercy of the officials when the games most critical.
3. That they can’t challenge everything.  If a ref misses an obvious game changing penalty, we’ll just pretend it didn’t happen?
4. That refs can’t use instant replay to get the call right in the first place.  In one of the games (Saints vs Panthers?) this weekend a WR caught it near the sidelines.  The ref was clearly looking the wrong way, but decided to call it a catch, and the defense had to burn a challenge because the ref missed it and made a guess.  With review the WR was clearly out prior to catching the ball.  Other times, you’ll see the refs huddle up and argue about things and in the end they just pick one of them without being in consensus.  Just let the booth ref stream his take to the head ref’s headset.
5. Bad Camera angles.  How often do they show you a replay where you can kind of see what’s happening but you miss a key detail because the cameras at a weird angle or you’re getting the D broadcast team, so they only brought 4 cameras with.  How is there not a fixed camera system in every stadium looking down the goal lines and boundaries?  They don’t even have to be broadcast quality cameras with the giant hoods and perfect color contrast, etc.  We’re spending a billion dollars for a stadium and we couldn’t throw in an extra $5M to ensure that there’s enough cameras to support instant replay?  I don’t even think the broadcast group should own them like the other cameras.  They should just be fixed within the stadium and be available to every broadcast team.

i agree on the cameras,  the nfl dictates so many aspects of the games,  how can they leave something like replay up to the broadcast teams?  in fact they could get rid of the NY connection all together and have a review official in a booth with a small camera crew that can run the cameras for the best angles to get to the sideline for the review process.

or fuck it,  i will just give them my cell phone number,  then can shoot me the vid quick and I will give them the right answer immediately.

@"Mike Olson" said: 4 minutes????? 1 minute max. 

thats what she said

First, it is Replay, not Instant Replay. Instant Replay is when they replay the previous play just so we can see it again.

Nobody ever said replay would be quick, and when they try to limit the time it is usually a cluster fuck, or should I say more of a cluster fuck.

I would rather it take a little bit longer for them to get it right than to hurry and get it wrong.

Finally, I think the only way to fix this system is to go with the college system. It seems like they get a lot of things right where the NFL gets them wrong.

I do think limiting the coaches to a certain number of challenges is BS, if the ref screws up 4 times, you will only get to challenge 3 times. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt and saying they will get the first two right when they do challenge.

@"Riphawkins" said: First, it is Replay, not Instant Replay. Instant Replay is when they replay the previous play just so we can see it again.

Nobody ever said replay would be quick, and when they try to limit the time it is usually a cluster fuck, or should I say more of a cluster fuck.

I would rather it take a little bit longer for them to get it right than to hurry and get it wrong.

Finally, I think the only way to fix this system is to go with the college system. It seems like they get a lot of things right where the NFL gets them wrong.

I do think limiting the coaches to a certain number of challenges is BS, if the ref screws up 4 times, you will only get to challenge 3 times. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt and saying they will get the first two right when they do challenge.

no matter how long they take they are fucking it up so if they are going to fuck it up anyway then I want it to be INSTANT... its currently is not and thats why i want it fixed.

either make it quick and thusly able to be expanded,  or get rid of it all together.   i can be improved upon and made quicker if the string pullers in NY wanted it to be that way.

I'm still at a loss as to how, as professional football has been played since before 1920, the definition of a catch and what constitutes a TD is still debated today.  Replays can certainly help confirm what the current definition is, but the tortuous explanations I have heard and seen over the last several years leave me perplexed.

My fix: HIRE. FULLTIME. REFS.

Having the incompetent verify the work of the incompetent fixes nothing.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Mike Olson" said: 4 minutes????? 1 minute max. 

1 minute to get from the field to the replay equipment,  2 minutes to discuss with new york,  and 1 minute to have results announced and play resumed.  the ball will be set by the result of the play so it only has to be changed if the call is overturned and the play clock will be wound immediately with the game clock following the result of the play.   maybe cut all that to 2 minutes by only giving NY 1 minute to make their case, and only giving the ref 30 seconds to get in and out of the head gear,  but I think this all can be sped up. 

@"ATXVIKE" said: How about just getting rid of the old slow and visually impaired REFS!!!! There should be a farm system of full time refs that earn their way onto the field. This is just bizarre to see a 65 year old Ed Hockuly he's a dinosaur!

They have a Union, that allows them to stay in place. 

@"greediron" said: I have always said, take it out of the hands of the coaches.  They shouldn't be responsible for catching and fixing blown calls.

There should be a watcher to catch obvious mistakes and he could buzz down to the head ref to say they may need to look at it. 

Other than that, I think they should do away with so much of it.  catch the obvious ones, but trust the judgment of the guys paid to do the job.

That' a great idea, but the watcher should be in New York, and he should also make the end call on the review.  Take it out of the hands of the on the field officials. British the viewing audience with some in game advertising. But  I still would allow the coaches to challenge calls, but I would let them challenge as many as they want.  As long as they keep getting the challenges right.

The NCAA system works far better, why reinvent the wheel.  NFL works like DC.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Riphawkins" said: First, it is Replay, not Instant Replay. Instant Replay is when they replay the previous play just so we can see it again.

Nobody ever said replay would be quick, and when they try to limit the time it is usually a cluster fuck, or should I say more of a cluster fuck.

I would rather it take a little bit longer for them to get it right than to hurry and get it wrong.

Finally, I think the only way to fix this system is to go with the college system. It seems like they get a lot of things right where the NFL gets them wrong.

I do think limiting the coaches to a certain number of challenges is BS, if the ref screws up 4 times, you will only get to challenge 3 times. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt and saying they will get the first two right when they do challenge.

no matter how long they take they are fucking it up so if they are going to fuck it up anyway then I want it to be INSTANT... its currently is not and thats why i want it fixed.

either make it quick and thusly able to be expanded,  or get rid of it all together.   i can be improved upon and made quicker if the string pullers in NY wanted it to be that way.

The UGA Ala game just had a review on a scoring play, super close call and it took about a minute for them to get it right.

NFL-watch and learn.

@"Riphawkins" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Riphawkins" said: First, it is Replay, not Instant Replay. Instant Replay is when they replay the previous play just so we can see it again.

Nobody ever said replay would be quick, and when they try to limit the time it is usually a cluster fuck, or should I say more of a cluster fuck.

I would rather it take a little bit longer for them to get it right than to hurry and get it wrong.

Finally, I think the only way to fix this system is to go with the college system. It seems like they get a lot of things right where the NFL gets them wrong.

I do think limiting the coaches to a certain number of challenges is BS, if the ref screws up 4 times, you will only get to challenge 3 times. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt and saying they will get the first two right when they do challenge.

no matter how long they take they are fucking it up so if they are going to fuck it up anyway then I want it to be INSTANT... its currently is not and thats why i want it fixed.

either make it quick and thusly able to be expanded,  or get rid of it all together.   i can be improved upon and made quicker if the string pullers in NY wanted it to be that way.

I don’t know that they fuck it up anyway. Yes, they make mistakes and get it wrong. Probably too many times, but they do get it right also. 

The officials get a lot of shit wrong, from not calling holding on the Packers, to making fans hold their breath on every pass play wondering if it is going to be a catch or pass interference call.

I don’t think it will ever be fixed to satisfy everyone.