This Is As Bad As Last Year

JimmyinSD wrote:

Ive never understood why its never the QBs fault. Longstanding tradition of not laying blame on the 1 guy that touches the ball on every play around here.

Oh, Murray has been complete dog shit. No question. Really thought he was turning the corner after NO. He’s regressed badly the last two games.

But, again, KC decided to go away from what had been working.

JustInTime wrote:

So, KC is continuing to play a QB who isn’t prepared?

Clearly someone on the offense isn't, since those were JJs words that everyone needs to come prepared for the week every day. That is not on coaching. I will stick with Jefferson on this one. I'm over it. No accountability and now it is the coach's fault.

JimmyinSD wrote:

Ive never understood why its never the QBs fault. Longstanding tradition of not laying blame on the 1 guy that touches the ball on every play around here.

But don't you remember, it was always JJ McCarthy's fault in here and in most Vikings boards. Hmmmm...

IceRatz16 wrote:

But don't you remember, it was always JJ McCarthy's fault in here and in most Vikings boards. Hmmmm...

But never ONCE the coach. Not once.

Then walking out of todays post game pressers. Not saying a word. Looking at Kyler like WTF was that during the game. HIs facial expressions. That does not scream "It's the coaching"

JimmyinSD wrote:

Ive never understood why its never the QBs fault. Longstanding tradition of not laying blame on the 1 guy that touches the ball on every play around here.

Except for last year…all his fault.

Koc doesn't know how to manage a game. Down 5, going for it on 4th and 4 with that pass and not moving KM out of the pocket was ridiculous. Its not like he was on a heater.

Then, I know he watched Detroit run the ball down our throat the drive before and he decided to punt on 4th and 4 after throwing a 40 yd punt on 3rd down.

Canthony wrote:

But never ONCE the coach. Not once.

Well, McCarthy has looked better since leaving and Murray is currently playing his worst football.

I took those inputs and decided there was a constant in both situations. When more data becomes available, I might have another theory. That’s what thinking logically looks like.

nawlinsvike1 wrote:

Koc doesn't know how to manage a game. Down 5, going for it on 4th and 4 with that pass and not moving KM out of the pocket was ridiculous. Its not like he was on a heater.

Then, I know he watched Detroit run the ball down our throat the drive before and he decided to punt on 4th and 4 after throwing a 40 yd punt on 3rd down.

Yup. Razor thin margin to work with and that was a really poor decision. Not like there was a go to that had been working consistently.

JustInTime wrote:

Well, McCarthy has looked better since leaving and Murray is currently playing his worst football.
I took those inputs and decided there was a constant in both situations. When more data becomes available, I might have another theory. That’s what thinking logically looks like.

He did great with Darnold and Cousins.

And again, Jefferson sure isn't making it sound like it is coaching. He is making it sound like Murray has the same shit issues he had in Arizona.

Canthony wrote:

He did great with Darnold and Cousins.

Yup. With Udinski on staff.

Bullazin wrote:

If Buffalo beats us at our house next week and the offense struggles again, I think you have to go to Wentz. Probably it would take 2 more losses but I’m getting close to calling it with Murray.
KOC did him no favors today. That was a winnable game but because we tried and failed miserably to pass on a bad defense instead of sticking to a balanced attack and shortening the game, our D finally wore down.

Getting there as well. KOC can still call a good game, but Murray won't throw the ball. Not sure what you do with that. Wentz isn't the answer, but right now he looks better than Murray.

And yes, passing up a sure FG to try an emotionally amped up D on 4th down is beyond stupid. Take the points, let the emotions fade and finish the game.

But I wager KOC wasnt confident Murra6could put another drive together.

JustInTime wrote:

Yup. With Udinski on staff.

If you have watched Murray play, not sure how you can determine it is coaching when he is flat out passing the ball as bad as he is.

greediron wrote:

Getting there as well. KOC can still call a good game, but Murray won't throw the ball. Not sure what you do with that. Wentz isn't the answer, but right now he looks better than Murray.

And yes, passing up a sure FG to try an emotionally amped up D on 4th down is beyond stupid. Take the points, let the emotions fade and finish the game.

But I wager KOC wasnt confident Murra6could put another drive together.

I would agree with this 100.

Had we kicked the FG, we could have won with another FG and the life wouldnt have been sucked out of us.

It was just an idiotic call. And I almost understand the 3rd down call on the last drive if you know you going for it on 4th but its such a low percentage throw and id at least have given jefferson a chance

Canthony wrote:

If you have watched Murray play, not sure how you can determine it is coaching when he is flat out passing the ball as bad as he is.

It’s a theory.

Go look at Murray’s career averages and see if he’s playing up to those numbers.

If you’re not seeing a possible correlation between his play before and after, even with a small sample size so far, I don’t know that I can say any further or plainly.

No one bitched that much about KOC’s system or coaching with Cousins or Darnold.

The REAL problem with KOC is ego and this QB whisperer bullshit. The fact is, he can’t make ANY QB work in his system, but if he has the RIGHT QB his system is nearly unstoppable.

People hated Cousins contract and wanted him gone. Then he got hurt and KOC went on this Linsanity run with Dobbs and then Darnold the very next season. Everyone started to believe it didn’t matter who the QB was…KOC can make them successful.

What people (myself included) failed to see was that Cousins and Darnold were actually very similar QBs (heady, strong armed, accurate and willing to hang in the pocket). But we all just chalked it up to “KOC is a genius” and McCarthy will just step in no problem. He didn’t…and here we are.

Now, I personally beyond JJ could have eventually become that, but KOC lost patience and panic bought into Murray. If you have a fault with KOC, that should be it.

A good playcaller would understand what murray does well and get his ass outside the pocket. He cant see. Thats why he stands there aimlessly and takes 2 sacks a game because all his launch points are schemed from the pocket. Murray should be running rpo or getting outside. Hes faster than every defender on the field.

That last drive, you spread their ass out wide. If they all go a WR, they in man and you audible to all deep routes and have murray run for 15. If they show zone, you throw into a hole in coverage.

Just cant tell me that a wizard OC coach thought its a good play call to throw a fade away lob to Addison on 3rd AND 4 knowing you were going to punt if you dont get it.

CFIAvike wrote:

No one bitched that much about KOC’s system or coaching with Cousins or Darnold.
The REAL problem with KOC is ego and this QB whisperer bullshit. The fact is, he can’t make ANY QB work in his system, but if he has the RIGHT QB his system is nearly unstoppable.
People hated Cousins contract and wanted him gone. Then he got hurt and KOC went on this Linsanity run with Dobbs and then Darnold the very next season. Everyone started to believe it didn’t matter who the QB was…KOC can make them successful.
What people (myself included) failed to see was that Cousins and Darnold were actually very similar QBs (heady, strong armed, accurate and willing to hang in the pocket). But we all just chalked it up to “KOC is a genius” and McCarthy will just step in no problem. He didn’t…and here we are.
Now, I personally beyond JJ could have eventually become that, but KOC lost patience and panic bought into Murray. If you have a fault with KOC, that should be it.

"Cough" Wentz... Basically the exact same guy. Pocket statue with a big arm that wants to distribute the ball. I dont think he is a long term answer, but better than the dog shit we have been getting from murray.

greediron wrote:

Getting there as well. KOC can still call a good game, but Murray won't throw the ball. Not sure what you do with that. Wentz isn't the answer, but right now he looks better than Murray.

And yes, passing up a sure FG to try an emotionally amped up D on 4th down is beyond stupid. Take the points, let the emotions fade and finish the game.

But I wager KOC wasnt confident Murra6could put another drive together.

This is why I was fine with going for it. We would have still been trailing and scoring drives are few and far between this year.

I think Murray can still figure this out given enough leash, but we all knew he was going to have to wake up for the next 5 weeks, and he sure napped through and failed his first test.