We better hope JJM has some magic

Bullazin wrote:
 

Way too many boneheaded penalties reeks of lack of discipline. 

 JM.

 Pace leading the league in missed tackles supports the lack of  discipline.

IMO players aren't following the coaching and instruction.

After tonight I suspect changes are incoming.

Unfortunately it's one of those years. The Vikings are a bad team. It's too bad for JJ because no matter how good he might be he isn't going to turn this mess around. Given the lack of successful draft picks and future cap restraints, I don't see it improving for some time!

hogjowlsjohnny wrote:
Unfortunately it's one of those years. The Vikings are a bad team. It's too bad for JJ because no matter how good he might be he isn't going to turn this mess around. Given the lack of successful draft picks and future cap restraints, I don't see it improving for some time!

I wouldn’t say bad, but they are not good. You are right about the drafting, they have hit on very few picks.  With the FA’s from this year not panning out, including giving Murphy big money that has not been redeemed at all, Kwesi’s grade is dropping to Poor overall. If JJM is not a superstar, it may be time to start thinking of burning it down the end of next year.

If JJM isn’t THE SHIZNIT, we in serious trouble

The best offensive series tonight was the last one with Brosmer running out the clock. Passes on target was refreshing.

JJM looks to be good for Detroit unless he tweaked something in this clip.

JJ McCarthy (ankle) is inactive tonight
pic.twitter.com/h9J6tgIwQv

— Barstool Sports (@barstoolsports) October 24, 2025

I truly think JJM is 90-95%. I just think KOC was absolutely not starting him on a short week after all that time off.

Now he has 10 days to get ready

CFIAvike wrote:
I truly think JJM is 90-95%.  I just think KOC was absolutely not starting him on a short week after all that time off.

Now he has 10 days to get ready

With the current offensive line woes, KOC fears for McCarthy's life...

lets be honest about JJ, he didnt look good most of what he did play, I want him back when he is fully healthy so there will be no excuses, but until then, for the love of God...no more Wentz!

Bullazin wrote:
Cause this team is cooked without some magic.

KOC is not helping either with bad decisions, will not commit to the run, will not run with 6 and 7 in the box, never runs on 3 rd and 2, not going for it on 4 th down when getting dominated. He needs a strong QB and a line that protects to run his scheme. 

Way too many boneheaded penalties reeks of lack of discipline. 

Get well soon JJM.

Honestly they can't run without Darrisaw and O'Neill.  That was the problem early on before CD came back.  Skule has no push.

StickierBuns wrote:
Well, he'll need to be Houdini and David Copperfield both behind this disgrace of an offensive line....and the D can put him in a 14 point hole in no time. Quite the incubator for a 22 year old.  :rolleyes:  :dodgy:

At least the Superbowl expectations are gone...

This is a learning year. But with what he has seen from the revolving door OL, he needs to learn to throw the ball away and avoid sacks. There is no magic this year and the expectations should be low, they can see what they have in him if he stays healthy

lets talk about the OL, yes they look terrible at times, but guess what, OL play looks like shit for a lot of teams and they find ways to win. It starts with a QB that will move around and use that movement to help his OL, I think we have been seeing Wentz pull his best Cousins impersonation as far as setting his feet at the top of his drop and anchoring there... makes it really easy for the D when they know where he is and isnt likely to move unless he is run into. What made Darnold look good last year was his ability to slide not just up into the pocket, but he would slide away and around pressure early in the year ( before the voices in head started screaming again around mid season or so ) JJM has shown this ability in the past, not sure about Brosmer, but either way, the OL is getting no help from Wentz in terms of movement, as well as snap count, how many times do we see the ball snapped right as the play clock is set to expire? is this KOC not getting plays in to him in time... Wentz taking to long to read what the D is up to.... either way, kind of takes the guess work out for the D, get up there and quick snap once in a while, do something to try and give your OL an advantage.

and for Gods sake.... RUN the damn ball! OL love to run block, feed that a little more, it also tires the opposing D more. Somebody call Tice up and get his ass back to MN to work with our OL, they are big strong men, they can be better than we are seeing.

JimmyinSD wrote:
lets talk about the OL,  yes they look terrible at times, but guess what, OL play looks like shit for a lot of teams and they find ways to win. It starts with a QB that will move around and use that movement to help his OL,  I think we have been seeing Wentz pull his best Cousins impersonation as far as setting his feet at the top of his drop and anchoring there... makes it really easy for the D when they know where he is and isnt likely to move unless he is run into.  What made Darnold look good last year was his ability to slide not just up into the pocket, but he would slide away and around pressure early in the year ( before the voices in head started screaming again around mid season or so )  JJM has shown this ability in the past, not sure about Brosmer,  but either way,  the OL is getting no help from Wentz in terms of movement, as well as snap count,  how many times do we see the ball snapped right as the play clock is set to expire?  is this KOC not getting plays in to him in time... Wentz taking to long to read what the D is up to.... either way,  kind of takes the guess work out for the D,  get up there and quick snap once in a while,  do something to try and give your OL an advantage.

and for Gods sake.... RUN the damn ball!  OL love to run block,  feed that a little more,  it also tires the opposing D more.  Somebody call Tice up and get his ass back to MN to work with our OL,  they are big strong men,  they can be better than we are seeing.

The announcers actually started mentioning that Wentz wasn't helping the battered o-line.  Biggest issue IMO is that he holds the ball forever, missing the checkdowns and not taking what is there.

JimmyinSD wrote:
lets talk about the OL,  yes they look terrible at times, but guess what, OL play looks like shit for a lot of teams and they find ways to win. It starts with a QB that will move around and use that movement to help his OL,  I think we have been seeing Wentz pull his best Cousins impersonation as far as setting his feet at the top of his drop and anchoring there... makes it really easy for the D when they know where he is and isnt likely to move unless he is run into.  What made Darnold look good last year was his ability to slide not just up into the pocket, but he would slide away and around pressure early in the year ( before the voices in head started screaming again around mid season or so )  JJM has shown this ability in the past, not sure about Brosmer,  but either way,  the OL is getting no help from Wentz in terms of movement, as well as snap count,  how many times do we see the ball snapped right as the play clock is set to expire?  is this KOC not getting plays in to him in time... Wentz taking to long to read what the D is up to.... either way,  kind of takes the guess work out for the D,  get up there and quick snap once in a while,  do something to try and give your OL an advantage.

and for Gods sake.... RUN the damn ball!  OL love to run block,  feed that a little more,  it also tires the opposing D more.  Somebody call Tice up and get his ass back to MN to work with our OL,  they are big strong men,  they can be better than we are seeing.

We are breaking the huddle at 10-15, just not enough time to pre read and make changes.  KOC seems pretty rigid in his calls no matter the pre read.  That’s horrible.  Could be because wentz is pretty new in the system, but I don’t want to see us breaking the huddle at less than 15 when JJ is back.  If you have 6 in the box you have to run the ball unless it’s 3rd and 12.

greediron wrote:

The announcers actually started mentioning that Wentz wasn't helping the battered o-line.  Biggest issue IMO is that he holds the ball forever, missing the checkdowns and not taking what is there.

Yeah he’s not helping them much.  Hey I like Carson Wentz as a backup and he has showed a lot of grit, but he’s not ready to lead a good team yet. Maybe KOC can resurrect his career, but it’s too early to expect that.

JimmyinSD wrote:
lets talk about the OL,  yes they look terrible at times, but guess what, OL play looks like shit for a lot of teams and they find ways to win. It starts with a QB that will move around and use that movement to help his OL,  I think we have been seeing Wentz pull his best Cousins impersonation as far as setting his feet at the top of his drop and anchoring there... makes it really easy for the D when they know where he is and isnt likely to move unless he is run into.  What made Darnold look good last year was his ability to slide not just up into the pocket, but he would slide away and around pressure early in the year ( before the voices in head started screaming again around mid season or so )  JJM has shown this ability in the past, not sure about Brosmer,  but either way,  the OL is getting no help from Wentz in terms of movement, as well as snap count,  how many times do we see the ball snapped right as the play clock is set to expire?  is this KOC not getting plays in to him in time... Wentz taking to long to read what the D is up to.... either way,  kind of takes the guess work out for the D,  get up there and quick snap once in a while,  do something to try and give your OL an advantage.

and for Gods sake.... RUN the damn ball!  OL love to run block,  feed that a little more,  it also tires the opposing D more.  Somebody call Tice up and get his ass back to MN to work with our OL,  they are big strong men,  they can be better than we are seeing.

I was actually kind of encouraged by the O-line in the Philly game. Last night was a different story but I am with you, Wentz is a statue back there and he's failing to consistently make presnap reads to identify mismatches that can lead to "easy" plays. The vets who have success rely on that stuff and Wentz just hasn't been able to do it. Kind of reminded me of Ponder last night to be honest.

pattersaur wrote:

I was actually kind of encouraged by the O-line in the Philly game. Last night was a different story but I am with you, Wentz is a statue back there and he's failing to consistently make presnap reads to identify mismatches that can lead to "easy" plays. The vets who have success rely on that stuff and Wentz just hasn't been able to do it. Kind of reminded me of Ponder last night to be honest.

And some of this blame has to fall on KOC who completely mismanaged the backup QB position trading for Sam Howell and investing all offseason on him before deciding he sucked and bringing in Wentz a week before the season started. For a QB "guru" he has certainly mismanaged the QB room this year

supafreak84 wrote:

And some of this blame has to fall on KOC who completely mismanaged the backup QB position trading for Sam Howell and investing all offseason on him before deciding he sucked and bringing in Wentz a week before the season started. For a QB "guru" he has certainly mismanaged the QB room this year

Fair and easily the most frustrating part of this season. We all hoped after JJM was drafted, the QB situation would for better or worse be resolved for a time. It's been anything but that ever since and last night things reached a crescendo.

JimmyinSD wrote:
lets talk about the OL,  yes they look terrible at times, but guess what, OL play looks like shit for a lot of teams and they find ways to win. It starts with a QB that will move around and use that movement to help his OL,  I think we have been seeing Wentz pull his best Cousins impersonation as far as setting his feet at the top of his drop and anchoring there... makes it really easy for the D when they know where he is and isnt likely to move unless he is run into.  What made Darnold look good last year was his ability to slide not just up into the pocket, but he would slide away and around pressure early in the year ( before the voices in head started screaming again around mid season or so )  JJM has shown this ability in the past, not sure about Brosmer,  but either way,  the OL is getting no help from Wentz in terms of movement, as well as snap count,  how many times do we see the ball snapped right as the play clock is set to expire?  is this KOC not getting plays in to him in time... Wentz taking to long to read what the D is up to.... either way,  kind of takes the guess work out for the D,  get up there and quick snap once in a while,  do something to try and give your OL an advantage.

and for Gods sake.... RUN the damn ball!  OL love to run block,  feed that a little more,  it also tires the opposing D more.  Somebody call Tice up and get his ass back to MN to work with our OL,  they are big strong men,  they can be better than we are seeing.

So how come the Vikings have performance injury excuses (not accusing you) because of the line, but just last night we saw a team that was as banged up if not more on the line than ours and down to RB#3 on the year. How Did that team run for over 200 yards on our mostly heathy defense? Might be something KOC wants to consider when our line is beat up and dysfunctional. I never did believe all that "we're going to run the ball more this year" garbage that was spewed all summer.

JimmyinSD wrote:
lets be honest about JJ,  he didnt look good most of what he did play, I want him back when he is fully healthy so there will be no excuses, but until then, for the love of God...no more Wentz!

We were sold a bill of goods that, to date, have been woefully less than advertised. Came out of a pro style offense but we have to spend time on core fundamentals? 

Hopefully he’s healthy and ready to go in Detroit. Hopefully Darrisaw and O’Neil are back too. I can’t sit through another 60 minutes of Wince.

JustInTime wrote:

We were sold a bill of goods that, to date, have been woefully less than advertised. Came out of a pro style offense but we have to spend time on core fundamentals? 

Hopefully he’s healthy and ready to go in Detroit. Hopefully Darrisaw and O’Neil are back too. I can’t sit through another 60 minutes of Wince.

I think people are reading too much into the fundamentals comment.

I think people keep reading into it like JJM is deficient at something and needed to go back to remedial school.

I kind of see it more like a kid asking what he should do on the bye week, and KOC tells him to just go work on his fundamentals, while coaches are busy self-scouting and everyone else is taking time off.