.500 when we needed to fatten the wins..

Cook's injury was DEFINITELY a punch to the gut...  but I'm still optimistic this is a playoff team.  However, that's assuming we will have Bradford under center for the rest of the season.  If Keenum has to start too many more games, I would expect us to be a 6-7 win team.  Everyone was pretty high on him after a great game against Tampa Bay...  unfortunately we all saw his floor again against Detroit. 

Yes, I am quite bummed about Dalvin. It's to the point where I'm not all that enthused about the rest of the season, primarily because having an actual running game (and a good one, at that) I believe is the only way we're going to sniff the playoffs. If we can't run the ball it's going to be open season on our QB (whoever that ends up being) once again and then we're back to the same thing as last year. Our pass D needs to improve and the run D isn't there yet either. This defense isn't the sort that can be on the field for long stretches and having a good running game keeps them on the sideline. Color me dubious at best.
That said, I don't want to slam the door shut on what Murray can potentially bring to the offense. He's been a good player in this league. I'm just concerned about his ankle and whether or not he's going to be able to stay healthy for the rest of the season. I don't want us having to trot McKinnon out there as our starter again this season.

Losing Cook was a gut punch, knee to the groin, girlfriend left you, dog died moment...but, if Murray can shoulder the load, I might watch more than half the game Monday...830pm start is just brutal...add to that the nonstop nonsense being spewing from Gruden's wing hole and I have really grown to loathe MNF...cmon Vikes, give me a reason to go into work on 4 hours of sleep!

I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

@"BlackMagic7" said: I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

He's good for 2/3 games. We need Sam back - asap and before its too late. Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes. 

"Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes"

Truth...

@"BlackMagic7" said: But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

Do the Vikings run especially complicated systems - or is "getting up to speed" just a euphemism they throw out for players with other issues (or some guys being surprisingly dumb)? I know Murray has been hurt, and that's a different matter, but it isn't clear if injury is his issue.

@"Jor-El" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said: But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

All this talk about Murray "getting up to speed" and light bulbs needing to go on is giving me Cordarelle Patterson deja vu. It sure seems like we often get reports suggesting players need a PhD to understand how to play football for the Vikings. Murray played in the NFL for 4 years before coming here, and we've seen RBs for other teams get signed and play productively a week later.

Do the Vikings run especially complicated systems - or is "getting up to speed" just a euphemism they throw out for players with other issues (or some guys being surprisingly dumb)? I know Murray has been hurt, and that's a different matter, but it isn't clear if injury is his issue.

People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  We no longer have a team that is based around
the running back.  I know it’s very vivid
in people’s minds of AD singlehandedly driving our entire offense through the
rushing game despite a horrific OLine and a horrific passing game.  That is not who we are now.  We’ve built an OLine that is more than solid
in both pass blocking and run blocking.  We’ve got a passing game that is flourishing that
goes 4 deep in receiving threats.  The
key thing to both of our losses was our mistakes and playing top level defenses
with a backup QB.  If we play a clean
game, which we know we can, and we get slightly better QB play, that is enough
for us to consistently win.  And it will
help to not play top 5 scoring defenses all the time.

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said: I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

We've seen Keenum and the league has too.

He's good for 2/3 games. We need Sam back - asap and before its too late. Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes. 

@"medaille" said: People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  We no longer have a team that is based around the running back.  I know it’s very vivid in people’s minds of AD singlehandedly driving our entire offense through the rushing game despite a horrific OLine and a horrific passing game.  That is not who we are now.  We’ve built an OLine that is more than solid in both pass blocking and run blocking.  We’ve got a passing game that is flourishing that goes 4 deep in receiving threats.  The key thing to both of our losses was our mistakes and playing top level defenses with a backup QB.  If we play a clean game, which we know we can, and we get slightly better QB play, that is enough for us to consistently win.  And it will help to not play top 5 scoring defenses all the time.

The sheer volume of stuff he was relied on for... the coaching staff had a lot of belief in his ability to do it. Our passing game often was centered around his ability to protect. He was phenominal at making the right reads and holding up at the point of attack. 

I think Murray should be able to replicate the ground production. Our running game seems to mainly be shotgun, read option type, "here's the ball, don't get smeared," runs. What will probably take some tinkering is how the passing game adjusts to lossing a reliable protection piece in 3 WR sets. The more Murray can take over those small passing game nuances, the less screwing around with adjustments we'll have to make.

Cook was letting us find good playcalling rhythm in the passing game. Murray either fills in and executed all of those same responsibilites, or were going to have to adjust with rotations, formations or playcalls. The less he can handle, the more defenses will attack him. The more he handles, the less they bother.

...

I dont know if Murray is like a Patterson situation though Jor. If the season was a 16 year old's drivers exam; Patterson would have been like a guy who test drove with on his permit with his mother all spring and summer long in her car; the exam came, he drove her car... and he rolled stop signs, never signaled; and Ace Ventura'd his 90 degree parking spot "like a gloooovvve."  ... Murray got his permit and didnt drive anywhere. He sat at home all spring and summer looking at it, reading a drivers ed packlet. When it was time to take the exam, he didnt have a car. Then one day, Dad showed up with his shiney truck and said, "get your shit on, were taking that test right now. I'll let you drive down there."

... iiits a stretch... but... kinda....

@"medaille" said: People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  We no longer have a team that is based around the running back.  I know it’s very vivid in people’s minds of AD singlehandedly driving our entire offense through the rushing game despite a horrific OLine and a horrific passing game.  That is not who we are now.  We’ve built an OLine that is more than solid in both pass blocking and run blocking.  We’ve got a passing game that is flourishing that goes 4 deep in receiving threats.  The key thing to both of our losses was our mistakes and playing top level defenses with a backup QB.  If we play a clean game, which we know we can, and we get slightly better QB play, that is enough for us to consistently win.  And it will help to not play top 5 scoring defenses all the time.

I think the Cook injury is why I have very little enthusiasm this season. Seems it has been one thing after another. I really don't know. After seeing the way the team played against the Saints I was almost suckered back in.

But, when Sam didn't play after that first game and now Cook going down, I just don't know how much more heartache I can take. The game doesn't bring any joy anymore. 

I will probably watch the rest of the season from a distance this season. 

@"medaille" said: People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  We no longer have a team that is based around the running back. 

Cook imo was quickly on his way to taking what looks like a good passing game (finally) and making the offense overall more impactful.

Said another way, Cook could have meant to Diggs and Defenses what L' Bell means to Antonio Brown and Defenses.
 

@"BlackMagic7" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said: I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

We've seen Keenum and the league has too.

He's good for 2/3 games. We need Sam back - asap and before its too late. Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes. 

The point was just that his time out there gave the team an early oppertunity to respond to adversity. It gives them a slap in the face reminder to keep grinding away when things don't go their way at the QB position.

When Bradford gets back; if he faces adversity, maybe the team will be more primed to rise and respond to the situation, instead of panicing once the game is on them. They've had 3 games on them now. 

When a QB plays well, it suddenly is "their team." We all expect to win when Bradford plays well. What happens when he plays average? I'm thinking with this Keenum experience, there at least shouldn't be any panic or desperation.

If we take care of business in Chicago I think we will be fine. Especially since we will have Bradford back at the latest for the home game against the Packers, which I think we can win. Hopefully he can stay on the field for the rest of the year and that knee doesn't flair up yet again.

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said: I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

We've seen Keenum and the league has too.

He's good for 2/3 games. We need Sam back - asap and before its too late. Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes. 

The point was just that his time out there gave the team an early oppertunity to respond to adversity. It gives them a slap in the face reminder to keep grinding away when things don't go their way at the QB position.

When Bradford gets back; if he faces adversity, maybe the team will be more primed to rise and respond to the situation, instead of panicing once the game is on them. They've had 3 games on them now. 

When a QB plays well, it suddenly is "their team." We all expect to win when Bradford plays well. What happens when he plays average? I'm thinking with this Keenum experience, there at least shouldn't be any panic or desperation.

Hogwash lol!

Just go beat F'ing Detroit at home after being swept the year before...

S hit, we might have to go back before Bud Grant was coach to see when a Vikings team lost 3 times in a row to the F'ing Lions. 3 times in a row.

They'll be plenty of panic and desperation in that locker room if they lose (again) @ Soldier Field. And a very empty bandwagon as fickle, beatdown Vike fans scramble to sell their tix to Packer fans next week @ USB. 

But lets hope that doesnt happen...I really hope that doesnt happen. 

Next two games are pretty much make or break. 

@"BarrNone55" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"BlackMagic7" said: I think Keenum gives the team an oppertunity to grow a bit; everyone needs to step their game up right now to compensate for the QB. Keenum has shown he can win a game with the guys, and that he can lose games with the guys. If guys want to win, they need to grind.

I think it could be a good thing when Bradford gets back. Much like Keenum's game against Tampa, Bradford's game against New Orleans probably isnt the norm for Bradford. Guys can't expect to ride Bradford to wins on spectacular performances all of the time. Its a good reminder to keep grinding.

...

I hope Murray gets it going. I don't believe we've seen anything that he can do yet. He's been very limited for obvious injury reasons; he missed OTAs and a part of training camp. Both Cook and Murray were new to our playbook. Ome got a lot of reps, the other didnt... 

I always kind of figured Murray would end up easing into reps as he got more familiar with what we do. With the time he missed, he has ended up extending his practice time in a way. Cook has shown a RB has a ton of roles and accountability in this offense, Murray's first time doing anything with the offense for real was practically in the middle of camp. He didnt get any low pressure time to ease into this... he got healthy enough to go and thrown into the camp mix...

But were at Week 5 now... the light bulb should be starting to flicker. He hasnt really been asked to do much with how well Cook was beyond running the ball. He's got to get protections down to stay on the field...

We've seen Keenum and the league has too.

He's good for 2/3 games. We need Sam back - asap and before its too late. Tired of wasting this marvelous D with these offensive ineptitudes. 

The point was just that his time out there gave the team an early oppertunity to respond to adversity. It gives them a slap in the face reminder to keep grinding away when things don't go their way at the QB position.

When Bradford gets back; if he faces adversity, maybe the team will be more primed to rise and respond to the situation, instead of panicing once the game is on them. They've had 3 games on them now. 

When a QB plays well, it suddenly is "their team." We all expect to win when Bradford plays well. What happens when he plays average? I'm thinking with this Keenum experience, there at least shouldn't be any panic or desperation.

Hogwash lol!

Just go beat F'ing Detroit at home after being swept the year before...

S hit, we might have to go back before Bud Grant was coach to see when a Vikings team lost 3 times in a row to the F'ing Lions. 3 times in a row.

They'll be plenty of panic and desperation in that locker room if they lose (again) @ Soldier Field. And a very empty bandwagon as fickle, beatdown Vike fans scramble to sell their tix to Packer fans next week @ USB. 

But lets hope that doesnt happen...I really hope that doesnt happen. 

Next two games are pretty much make or break. 

90-91 was the last time we lost 3 in a row to Detroit... Ugh...

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"medaille" said: People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  ...

Cook balanced the attack which opened more room for Diggs and Thielen,  it's not just Cooks running it's his contributions in the passing game both as a receiver and anD in blitz pickup.   Hope Murray can be nearly as effective.

@"medaille" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"medaille" said: People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  ...

Cook balanced the attack which opened more room for Diggs and Thielen,  it's not just Cooks running it's his contributions in the passing game both as a receiver and anD in blitz pickup.   Hope Murray can be nearly as effective.

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"medaille" said:
People are overstating Cooks importance to our success.  ...

I hear yah, but it wasn't my point. For me its unfulfilled potential on offense. 

Cook imo was quickly on his way to taking what looks like a good passing game (finally) and making the offense overall more impactful.

Said another way, Cook could have meant to Diggs and Defenses what L' Bell means to Antonio Brown and Defenses.