Come home Kirko. Come home.

@"PurpleCrush" said: I think Dobbs let the whole Passtronaut thing get to his head. 

@"StickyBun" said:

@"PurpleCrush" said: I think Dobbs let the whole Passtronaut thing get to his head. 

JMO, I just don't think he's good. He balled out athletically upon arrival but it's been diminishing returns since.

@"StickyBun" said:

@"PurpleCrush" said: I think Dobbs let the whole Passtronaut thing get to his head. 

JMO, I just don't think he's good. He balled out athletically upon arrival but its been diminishing returns since.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"StickyBun" said:

@"PurpleCrush" said: I think Dobbs let the whole Passtronaut thing get to his head. 

JMO, I just don't think he's good. He balled out athletically upon arrival but its been diminishing returns since.

No he's not. Never has been. Teams don't move on from good QBs 8 times. Was it possible he could've continued the circus act and led the Vikings to the playoffs? You bet. Still is. But the idea that we may have uncovered some kind of hidden greatness with Dobbs was pretty silly. 

This is going to be a brutal two weeks for Dobbs, which is truly sad. He seems like such a good human. But if he's as smart as they say, he had to know this day was coming. 

@"AGRforever" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"StickyBun" said:

@"PurpleCrush" said: I think Dobbs let the whole Passtronaut thing get to his head. 

JMO, I just don't think he's good. He balled out athletically upon arrival but its been diminishing returns since.

No he's not. Never has been. Teams don't move on from good QBs 8 times. Was it possible he could've continued the circus act and led the Vikings to the playoffs? You bet. Still is. But the idea that we may have uncovered some kind of hidden greatness with Dobbs was pretty silly. 

This is going to be a brutal two weeks for Dobbs, which is truly sad. He seems like such a good human. But if he's as smart as they say, he had to know this day was coming. 

A Viking fan can dream. 

@"Clanzomaelan" said: Holy crap, Dobbs is off target. that sideline pass to Addison… a bit less air, a bit more to the inside of the field, and we have the lead. I know Chicago had a safety closing, but that’s a TD with a moderately accurate QB. 

@"pattersaur" said: Stop throwing at Jaylon Johnson! For Pete’s sake he’s killing us. 

EDIT- And why isn’t KO calling more QB runs?

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't.
I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that.
Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game.
For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*"
*for 1 or 2 years.
Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

I'm not sure who you could put back when our blocking scheme looks like it did last night

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

Look at Goff in Detroit for comparison. At 29, he's probably less mobile than Cousins if Kirk had both ankles fused, and was taped to  the bumper of a cement mixer. Kirk still throws a better long ball, anticipates better, and has been better under pressure. This mobility trope is just so much bullshit, when you look at the number of runs "mobile" QB's actually make per game, number of games missed by said "mobile QB's and the overall shelf life of said "mobile" QB's vs. QB's that can move in the pocket with a more balanced attack and better o-line. KOC and Kwesi have taken their eye off the ball ignoring the run game. We've become much too one dimensional, and can't control the clock.

Don't forget that prior to this non-contact freak injury, Cousins has been an iron man that has shown zero deterioration in his game, and in fact was leading the league in passing this year. Is there any statistical evidence that he can't get it done based on his performance these past 2 years? 

You pay the guy what he's currently worth, given his stats he was putting up before the injury, but you also protect the franchise by making it a 2-3 yr. deal with minimal guarantees. Yes, you grab QB's in the drafts until you find someone, but it's a crapshoot, and rarely mortgaging the future for a pick turns out well.
   

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

Look at Goff in Detroit for comparison. At 29, he's probably less mobile than Cousins if Kirk had both ankles fused, and was taped to  the bumper of a cement mixer. Kirk still throws a better long ball, anticipates better, and has been better under pressure. This mobility trope is just so much bullshit, when you look at the number of runs "mobile" QB's actually make per game, number of games missed by said "mobile QB's and the overall shelf life of said "mobile" QB's vs. QB's that can move in the pocket with a more balanced attack and better o-line. KOC and Kwesi have taken their eye off the ball ignoring the run game. We've become much too one dimensional, and can't control the clock.

Don't forget that prior to this non-contact freak injury, Cousins has been an iron man that has shown zero deterioration in his game, and in fact was leading the league in passing this year. Is there any statistical evidence that he can't get it done based on his performance these past 2 years? 

You pay the guy what he's currently worth, given his stats he was putting up before the injury, but you also protect the franchise by making it a 2-3 yr. deal with minimal guarantees. Yes, you grab QB's in the drafts until you find someone, but it's a crapshoot, and rarely mortgaging the future for a pick turns out well.
   

you are confusing mobile QB with a running QB,  mobility is about moving in the pocket,  rolling out,  making defenses work to stop you from passing the ball.  running QBs are like Fields where you run to set up your passes,  those are the guys that miss games and have short careers.  Kirk is a statue and as such is why he gets hit so much.  There are plenty of QBs that arent running QBs,  but dont take as many hits because they move around the pocket,  and have escapability in their game.

if you think kirk is going to take a non  guaranteed deal full of escalators,  i dont think you've been paying attention to his track record.  He has been all about his money since day one,  why does that change now?  I dont see it happening and as such,  take that QB,  find a bridge guy,  build a better IOL and IDL,  and be ready to go compete instead of sitting there with a declining statue for a QB that has the team financially handcuffed now as well as in the void years you have to add to make his new deal work.   remember,  incentives still count against that cap now if they are likely to be earned,  much of what he would agree to would likely have to fit into that category,  so no cap relief from that type of deal.

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

Look at Goff in Detroit for comparison. At 29, he's probably less mobile than Cousins if Kirk had both ankles fused, and was taped to  the bumper of a cement mixer. Kirk still throws a better long ball, anticipates better, and has been better under pressure. This mobility trope is just so much bullshit, when you look at the number of runs "mobile" QB's actually make per game, number of games missed by said "mobile QB's and the overall shelf life of said "mobile" QB's vs. QB's that can move in the pocket with a more balanced attack and better o-line. KOC and Kwesi have taken their eye off the ball ignoring the run game. We've become much too one dimensional, and can't control the clock.

Don't forget that prior to this non-contact freak injury, Cousins has been an iron man that has shown zero deterioration in his game, and in fact was leading the league in passing this year. Is there any statistical evidence that he can't get it done based on his performance these past 2 years? 

You pay the guy what he's currently worth, given his stats he was putting up before the injury, but you also protect the franchise by making it a 2-3 yr. deal with minimal guarantees. Yes, you grab QB's in the drafts until you find someone, but it's a crapshoot, and rarely mortgaging the future for a pick turns out well.
   

you are confusing mobile QB with a running QB,  mobility is about moving in the pocket,  rolling out,  making defenses work to stop you from passing the ball.  running QBs are like Fields where you run to set up your passes,  those are the guys that miss games and have short careers.  Kirk is a statue and as such is why he gets hit so much.  There are plenty of QBs that arent running QBs,  but dont take as many hits because they move around the pocket,  and have escapability in their game.

if you think kirk is going to take a non  guaranteed deal full of escalators,  i dont think you've been paying attention to his track record.  He has been all about his money since day one,  why does that change now?  I dont see it happening and as such,  take that QB,  find a bridge guy,  build a better IOL and IDL,  and be ready to go compete instead of sitting there with a declining statue for a QB that has the team financially handcuffed now as well as in the void years you have to add to make his new deal work.   remember,  incentives still count against that cap now if they are likely to be earned,  much of what he would agree to would likely have to fit into that category,  so no cap relief from that type of deal.

not confusing the two at all. Kirk is amazing when running off play action. That doesn’t work when you have no run threat. I have no idea why there aren’t more designed rollouts. It’s not that Kirk isn’t capable, but it does often put him on an island against an edge rusher.

I don’t think Kirk has the same leverage for guarantees. If he hits incentives that means he’s healthy and performing. How is that a downside?  Again, this is the best bridge scenario you could hope for because we’re not going to spend our #1 on a QB this year with about 9 teams ahead of us needing QBs, and as you said, already owing him about 28.5 mil in dead money, just rolling that over into the new contract with the cap rising.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

Look at Goff in Detroit for comparison. At 29, he's probably less mobile than Cousins if Kirk had both ankles fused, and was taped to  the bumper of a cement mixer. Kirk still throws a better long ball, anticipates better, and has been better under pressure. This mobility trope is just so much bullshit, when you look at the number of runs "mobile" QB's actually make per game, number of games missed by said "mobile QB's and the overall shelf life of said "mobile" QB's vs. QB's that can move in the pocket with a more balanced attack and better o-line. KOC and Kwesi have taken their eye off the ball ignoring the run game. We've become much too one dimensional, and can't control the clock.

Don't forget that prior to this non-contact freak injury, Cousins has been an iron man that has shown zero deterioration in his game, and in fact was leading the league in passing this year. Is there any statistical evidence that he can't get it done based on his performance these past 2 years? 

You pay the guy what he's currently worth, given his stats he was putting up before the injury, but you also protect the franchise by making it a 2-3 yr. deal with minimal guarantees. Yes, you grab QB's in the drafts until you find someone, but it's a crapshoot, and rarely mortgaging the future for a pick turns out well.
   

you are confusing mobile QB with a running QB,  mobility is about moving in the pocket,  rolling out,  making defenses work to stop you from passing the ball.  running QBs are like Fields where you run to set up your passes,  those are the guys that miss games and have short careers.  Kirk is a statue and as such is why he gets hit so much.  There are plenty of QBs that arent running QBs,  but dont take as many hits because they move around the pocket,  and have escapability in their game.

if you think kirk is going to take a non  guaranteed deal full of escalators,  i dont think you've been paying attention to his track record.  He has been all about his money since day one,  why does that change now?  I dont see it happening and as such,  take that QB,  find a bridge guy,  build a better IOL and IDL,  and be ready to go compete instead of sitting there with a declining statue for a QB that has the team financially handcuffed now as well as in the void years you have to add to make his new deal work.   remember,  incentives still count against that cap now if they are likely to be earned,  much of what he would agree to would likely have to fit into that category,  so no cap relief from that type of deal.

I think a lot of my strategy at QB would be based on what
happens to Flores.  I think if Flores is
back next year, I would be much more in win now mode for the short time we have
Flores than I would if he gets poached and we have to deal with having a different,
probably lesser coordinator.  I think with
a lesser coordinator, we’re probably back to talking about needing to add more
talent on that side of the roster in order to maintain competitiveness and we’ll
have further to go in our rebuild.

@"AGRforever" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"mgobluevikes" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

Saying the media went to Dobbs' head or whatever is unfounded conjecture. I'm sure he's putting in the work and learning the offense and trying like heck to play better. It sucks last night he didn't. I said this in another thread and I say it as a big KO fan, but he is underutilizing Dobbs' mobility to a criminal level right now. I understand it took the Bears half a season before they realized last year, "oh, we should let Fields run more," but I hold KO to a higher standard than Eberflub and he should know this. Mattison/Chandler/whoever is not a competent run game. Watch Chicago, Philly, Baltimore, whoever... steal those QB run plays and incorporate them over the bye week or the season is lost for good. I'm talking 8-10 designed runs/game for Dobbs or Hall if it comes to that. Powell also seemed to be getting open at will last night and needed more targets. I'm a shmuck on a couch and even I can see these things plain as day. Man. What a frustrating game. For me the jury is still out on Kirk. It's easy to sit here and say "BRING HIM BACK*" *for 1 or 2 years. Great plan until a team like Atlanta offers him 3 years fully guaranteed. Then what?

Then what?  You move on,  I move on regardless, but they definitely can't get locked to Cousins again. 

You can if his achilles is right and if he's in a realistic contract, and we're drafting QBOTF for the next 3 years. All those 5 star can't miss QBs around week 5 of the college season now all look flawed playing against college competition. They might go top 5 in the draft which we aren't sniffing this year, so what's the plan? A season with the astronaut and Hall? lol... We're going to be drafting a 2nd or 3rd rd. QB MAYBE and crossing our fingers that we got something, I'd want Cousins (if healthy) at least to teach the ropes until the new kid is brought up to speed or the wheels fall off.

ok,  what is realistic to pay an immobile guy,  coming off a season ending injury that could make him even less mobile ( if its even possible )  who is in the twilight of his career?  Keep in mind he likely wont be working out prior to free agency starting so how do you sign off on that when he likely wants  a multi year guaranteed money deal?  how much do you pay him when hes already on the books for 28.5 million over the next year or two?  How much more can you add on top of that and realistically justify kicking his contract onto future teams?

I think the team has to get after it and grab their QB early this year,  if it dont pan out then try again next year,   but they have to move on from a high dollar aging statue,  the odds of him coming back as good as he was this year are slim,   and will only go down with age.

Look at Goff in Detroit for comparison. At 29, he's probably less mobile than Cousins if Kirk had both ankles fused, and was taped to  the bumper of a cement mixer. Kirk still throws a better long ball, anticipates better, and has been better under pressure. This mobility trope is just so much bullshit, when you look at the number of runs "mobile" QB's actually make per game, number of games missed by said "mobile QB's and the overall shelf life of said "mobile" QB's vs. QB's that can move in the pocket with a more balanced attack and better o-line. KOC and Kwesi have taken their eye off the ball ignoring the run game. We've become much too one dimensional, and can't control the clock.

Don't forget that prior to this non-contact freak injury, Cousins has been an iron man that has shown zero deterioration in his game, and in fact was leading the league in passing this year. Is there any statistical evidence that he can't get it done based on his performance these past 2 years? 

You pay the guy what he's currently worth, given his stats he was putting up before the injury, but you also protect the franchise by making it a 2-3 yr. deal with minimal guarantees. Yes, you grab QB's in the drafts until you find someone, but it's a crapshoot, and rarely mortgaging the future for a pick turns out well.
   

you are confusing mobile QB with a running QB,  mobility is about moving in the pocket,  rolling out,  making defenses work to stop you from passing the ball.  running QBs are like Fields where you run to set up your passes,  those are the guys that miss games and have short careers.  Kirk is a statue and as such is why he gets hit so much.  There are plenty of QBs that arent running QBs,  but dont take as many hits because they move around the pocket,  and have escapability in their game.

if you think kirk is going to take a non  guaranteed deal full of escalators,  i dont think you've been paying attention to his track record.  He has been all about his money since day one,  why does that change now?  I dont see it happening and as such,  take that QB,  find a bridge guy,  build a better IOL and IDL,  and be ready to go compete instead of sitting there with a declining statue for a QB that has the team financially handcuffed now as well as in the void years you have to add to make his new deal work.   remember,  incentives still count against that cap now if they are likely to be earned,  much of what he would agree to would likely have to fit into that category,  so no cap relief from that type of deal.

I’ll take the $40m/yr statue who can read a defense and throw revivers open. Feel free to trade up for his replacement in this years draft. 

@"medaille" said: I think a lot of my strategy at QB would be based on what happens to Flores.  I think if Flores is back next year, I would be much more in win now mode for the short time we have Flores than I would if he gets poached and we have to deal with having a different, probably lesser coordinator.  I think with a lesser coordinator, we’re probably back to talking about needing to add more talent on that side of the roster in order to maintain competitiveness and we’ll have further to go in our rebuild.

I still say that this offseason is the time to either go all-in (IE re-sign Kirk, draft best DL available in first round) or move on from Kirk and draft QB. Trying to do both simultaneously only makes both paths harder.