Do you want Kirk Cousins to return in 2024?

It's only one game but seeing Hall and Dobbs play decently and us eeking out a win was pretty telling. If Kirk plays maybe we win more comfortably? But I'm not sure about that. Obviously Kirk is much better than both but if these-- for lack of a better term-- scrub QBs can be serviceable in KO's offense then maybe we don't NEED a $40M/yr QB? It made me think.
If the Hall/Dobbs combo can continue playing decently (big if), I think that would give me enough confidence to roll with them and a first round rookie next year. The rest of the season is going to be very interesting.
I'd still take Kirk back for a year or two for sure, but if he moves on it might not be the end of the world, if today was any indication.

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB.
At our draft pick;
Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there.
And there are others that would qualify.

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

The problem is the Kirk decision is a month before the draft. So if even by your admission, the top 5 could all be gone before our pick (unlikely but possible), then we'll be screwed. Without Kirk teams will know we're desperate to trade up and will require even more picks. Then KAM will get killed for getting "fleeced". It's a tough situation to be in. We just all need to hope the football gods smile on us this offseason. Could set our team up for a long time, one way or the other.

Give me a rookie or Hall or Dobbs with players like:

Leonard Williams (DL instead of Bullard) 
Tenir Tart (DT instead of Lynch)
Tony Pollard (RB instead of Mattison)

Then a (1) 36 year old immobile QB off an achilles injury.

Those 3 should add up to $40 million.

What would this team be like with those two on the DL and a RB that can hit the hole fast?

This 2023 team is winning 10 games, book it

@"pattersaur" said:

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

The problem is the Kirk decision is a month before the draft. So if even by your admission, the top 5 could all be gone before our pick (unlikely but possible), then we'll be screwed. Without Kirk teams will know we're desperate to trade up and will require even more picks. Then KAM will get killed for getting "fleeced". It's a tough situation to be in. We just all need to hope the football gods smile on us this offseason. Could set our team up for a long time, one way or the other.

@"pattersaur" said:

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

The problem is the Kirk decision is a month before the draft. So if even by your admission, the top 5 could all be gone before our pick (unlikely but possible), then we'll be screwed. Without Kirk teams will know we're desperate to trade up and will require even more picks. Then KAM will get killed for getting "fleeced". It's a tough situation to be in. We just all need to hope the football gods smile on us this offseason. Could set our team up for a long time, one way or the other.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

The problem is the Kirk decision is a month before the draft. So if even by your admission, the top 5 could all be gone before our pick (unlikely but possible), then we'll be screwed. Without Kirk teams will know we're desperate to trade up and will require even more picks. Then KAM will get killed for getting "fleeced". It's a tough situation to be in. We just all need to hope the football gods smile on us this offseason. Could set our team up for a long time, one way or the other.

Just remember that Rodgers, Mahomes, Cousins, Hurts and Prescott, were taken 24th, 10th, 102nd, 53rd and 135th, while Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Trubisky, Wentz, Winston, Mariota, Bortles and RGIII were all taken top 5. 

I'm not saying you don't improve your chances by picking higher, because you do. But it's nowhere near as much as one might think. 

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

Your plan is to get rid of one of the best QB's in the league and let him walk hoping we hit the lottery in the draft?  I sure hope you're not on the KAM advisory board.  Whomever we draft will be much better suited sitting for a bit behind a veteran QB who by all accounts has the maturity and preparedness to groom a rookie to be the next Vikings QB.

@"AGRforever" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

@"FLVike" said:

I hate to break up this party but the answer is simply no, unless he accepts that he is the backup. There are way too many QBs in this draft that will be very, very good in the NFL.And who knows, perhaps KAM does the opposite this draft and trades up to get a franchise QB. At our draft pick; Caleb Williams will be gone.Penix should be goneDrake Maye should be goneJJ McCarthy should be gone but could still be there.Bo Nix should be gone but could still be there. And there are others that would qualify.

The problem is the Kirk decision is a month before the draft. So if even by your admission, the top 5 could all be gone before our pick (unlikely but possible), then we'll be screwed. Without Kirk teams will know we're desperate to trade up and will require even more picks. Then KAM will get killed for getting "fleeced". It's a tough situation to be in. We just all need to hope the football gods smile on us this offseason. Could set our team up for a long time, one way or the other.

Just remember that Rodgers, Mahomes, Cousins, Hurts and Prescott, were taken 24th, 10th, 102nd, 53rd and 135th, while Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Trubisky, Wentz, Winston, Mariota, Bortles and RGIII were all taken top 5. 

I'm not saying you don't improve your chances by picking higher, because you do. But it's nowhere near as much as one might think. 

Isn't it roughly 50% on top 5 QBs that they'll turn out to be a decent starter?  I think they'll resign Kirk and draft and draft a QB personally. I think the most logical pick is JJ McCarthy right now.  Might not have to have a top 5 pick for him.  Might be able to be in the 7-10 area.  We'll probably need to trade 2 1sts and a little more to get the deal done.

Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it
makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline
starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise,
I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a
commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good
player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or
two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

^^^

This, no way I want to give up a top 10 QB for a hope and a prayer...ESPECIALLY QB. 

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

^^^

This, no way I want to give up a top 10 QB for a hope and a prayer...ESPECIALLY QB. 

@"Skodin" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

^^^

This, no way I want to give up a top 10 QB for a hope and a prayer...ESPECIALLY QB. 

But if this QB isn't going to win you a Super Bowl (Unless he takes a team friendly deal to build a stronger roster around him), why do you keep going to the well to end with mid to late first round picks.

Either Cousins takes a steep pay cut and we use $25M to add 2-3 more players (DE, DT, RB) where you have a complete roster where he can win OR you cut bait and use his $40M to upgrade 3 positions and roll with a younger QB.

This defense is missing a DE and DT who can create pressure away from being a top 5-8 defense in the league (12th now).  This offense needs speed at RB and maybe a better RG (the two cheapest positions on the offense in the 21st century)

This roster isn't far off to being built for anyone to take reign.  Give me a young guy with legs and options to grow

@"Skodin" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

^^^

This, no way I want to give up a top 10 QB for a hope and a prayer...ESPECIALLY QB. 

But if this QB isn't going to win you a Super Bowl (Unless he takes a team friendly deal to build a stronger roster around him), why do you keep going to the well to end with mid to late first round picks.

Either Cousins takes a steep pay cut and we use $25M to add 2-3 more players (DE, DT, RB) where you have a complete roster where he can win OR you cut bait and use his $40M to upgrade 3 positions and roll with a younger QB.

This defense is missing a DE and DT who can create pressure away from being a top 5-8 defense in the league (12th now).  This offense needs speed at RB and maybe a better RG (the two cheapest positions on the offense in the 21st century)

This roster isn't far off to being built for anyone to take reign.  Give me a young guy with legs and options to grow

@"AGRforever" said:

@"Skodin" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

^^^

This, no way I want to give up a top 10 QB for a hope and a prayer...ESPECIALLY QB. 

But if this QB isn't going to win you a Super Bowl (Unless he takes a team friendly deal to build a stronger roster around him), why do you keep going to the well to end with mid to late first round picks.

Either Cousins takes a steep pay cut and we use $25M to add 2-3 more players (DE, DT, RB) where you have a complete roster where he can win OR you cut bait and use his $40M to upgrade 3 positions and roll with a younger QB.

This defense is missing a DE and DT who can create pressure away from being a top 5-8 defense in the league (12th now).  This offense needs speed at RB and maybe a better RG (the two cheapest positions on the offense in the 21st century)

This roster isn't far off to being built for anyone to take reign.  Give me a young guy with legs and options to grow

Why should, or why would a top couple QB take a big paycut?

Kirk Cousins — two weeks out from his Achilles surgery — spent the evening serving Thanksgiving meals with Vikings teammates at the Salvation Army in St. Paul.

(via @BenGoessling) pic.twitter.com/AElh26BX0x

— Front Office Sports (@FOS) November 15, 2023

According to reports, both Cousins and the Vikings are "very receptive" to having Cousins return on an extension. Cousons relationship with KOC and the respect he has in the locker room are listed as huge factors in getting something done  

@"supafreak84" said: According to reports, both Cousins and the Vikings are "very receptive" to having Cousins return on an extension. Cousons relationship with KOC and the respect he has in the locker room are listed as huge factors in getting something done  

My own preference is this...

Unless Dobbs goes off like few of us can imagine, having KC on a team friendlier deal AND getting a QBOTF in the next draft seems optimal. 

Best chance to win in 24 and let a younger guy curate a season or 2. 

@"medaille" said: Opinions will change depending on how good Hall and Dobbs do.  If either of them perform at a high level it makes it hard to justify Kirk having a big salary.  If they both look more backupish or borderline starter and Cousins achilles heals properly and he’s “normal Kirk” athletic-wise, I think it just makes sense to keep bringing Kirk back for as short a commitment as you can and keep trying to find the next guy until you do.  I’m not a big fan of getting rid of a good player, before you have his replacement, especially at QB.  I think you can probably tell within a year or two if a guy has a credible chance at being the guy as most top tier guys.

you are going to be forced to make that decision on Kirk before you know the status of his Achilles IMO.  I think Kirks career mirrors Gannons in the respect that neither were that great in their "prime",  until they hit that point where their increased experience overlapped with what their game was lacking and they hit a small window of good/great play.  However, IIRC Gannon wasnt all that expensive for the Raiders so they had a pretty well rounded team around him,  vs Kirk who is likely to demand as much as he can get and the roster around him will suffer, especially when we add in the contracts of JJ, Darrisaw, and a few other of the pending free agents, restricted free agents, or guys like Bynum coming off their 3rd year that you want to lock down before the ball is in their court.

IMO if Dobbs looks solid in the next couple games,  I start trying to lock him up.  If Kirk wants to stay and compete on a cheap deal,  sign him as well.  No "no trade clauses",  go into next year with KC, Dobbs, on short term non guaranteed deals, Hall,  and the best rookie we can target without getting stupid.

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"supafreak84" said: According to reports, both Cousins and the Vikings are "very receptive" to having Cousins return on an extension. Cousons relationship with KOC and the respect he has in the locker room are listed as huge factors in getting something done  

My own preference is this...

Unless Dobbs goes off like few of us can imagine, having KC on a team friendlier deal AND getting a QBOTF in the next draft seems optimal. 

Best chance to win in 24 and let a younger guy curate a season or 2.