Plenty of big-name free agents remain available

This does seem like a ridiculously big list of big names to be available this late in the summer. 

Looking at the those edges, my opposition to a Hunter trade might soften a bit if we could get a 1st rounder in return and then replace Hunter with one of the above. A downgrade no matter which edge we choose, but probably cheaper....potentially worth it long term if it results in the draft capital necessary to land on of the top QBs in the draft.

I get the feeling that teams are way more frugal now than
they were in the past.  It feels to me
that I used to see midlevel players breaking the bank every year and becoming
the top paid player at their position and now it feels like only the top
players are being paid like top players and teams are much more hesitant to
commit to that second tier of players, who probably feel like they deserve more
than what the market is offering now, because the market used to pay that much.  It seems like we’re moving to a world where
teams are a handful of young elite players and a bunch of rookies and nobodies.

@"medaille" said: I get the feeling that teams are way more frugal now than they were in the past.  It feels to me that I used to see midlevel players breaking the bank every year and becoming the top paid player at their position and now it feels like only the top players are being paid like top players and teams are much more hesitant to commit to that second tier of players, who probably feel like they deserve more than what the market is offering now, because the market used to pay that much.  It seems like we’re moving to a world where teams are a handful of young elite players and a bunch of rookies and nobodies.

thats been my contention for the last few years whenever somebody talks about the cap increasing as a reasoning for paying huge contracts to undeserving players.  the rest of the players in the league will be wanting a share of that bigger pie,  but larger % contracts going to only a select few are going to leave a lot of players feeling left out for their share.  Honestly though,  most of those players are past their primes and not deserving of top money deals,  or even 2nd tier money deals.

I see that RBs are crying for the union to do something for them,  honestly the best thing might be to change the way the rookie contracts are structured so that positions with shorter careers,  like RBs,  are able to hit FA sooner than the 4-5 years currently, that way they are playing most of their 2nd contract in their primes instead of hitting the back side of the contract ( the big money years ) as they are starting to show wear.  either that or they need to quit signing long term back loaded deals, that is something they could do themselves as a position group.

either way,  all this extra new money is only helping a small portion of the league,  sure the average overall is likely going up by position,  but it seems like its not very evenly applied.

I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I would have to pass,  his knees are to big a question mark.  He missed 3 games last year and only tallied 1 sack and 1 pass defense in 14 games.   I will admit I didnt watch him play last year,  but I was done with Barr his last few years here as he was never worth the hype,  he couldnt get off a block and make a play,  except out on the edge,  he did ok there, but helping inside or anything but a free rush and he was negated.

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I was thinking the same.  If there was any life left in his knee, he could be a fit for sure.

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I tend to think Davenport is also being miscast as a 3-4 OLB. He's a big guy and not particularly an incredible athlete. Which again begs the question, why are we playing 3-4 when our personnel is STILL better suited to play 4-3? I'd feel a lot better with Hunter and Davenport as our starting DE's, with Phillips, Tonga, Roy and whomever else rotating in at the DT positions. I also like the idea of more bodies up front covering our smaller linebackers and allowing them to seek and destroy without having to shed these massive lineman.

why is Dalton Risner still a FA?  IIRC he was a pretty decent OG.

IDK, he sounds fairly athletic… 

@"Kentis" said:

IDK, he sounds fairly athletic… 

I thought I read in mini camp he was hovering between 275 and 280 pounds. That's a 10-15 pound difference from his combine numbers, and regardless, he's not somebody I want flanking out into coverage. This was a point brought up by Pat Kirwin on NFL Radio is that teams will stack formations out wide to force either Hunter or Davenport into coverage and that's not a matchup that plays in our favor. 

If Akiem Hicks is healthy I'd love to see him in purple wrecking someone else's IOL for a change!

@"supafreak84" said:

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I tend to think Davenport is also being miscast as a 3-4 OLB. He's a big guy and not particularly an incredible athlete. Which again begs the question, why are we playing 3-4 when our personnel is STILL better suited to play 4-3? I'd feel a lot better with Hunter and Davenport as our starting DE's, with Phillips, Tonga, Roy and whomever else rotating in at the DT positions. I also like the idea of more bodies up front covering our smaller linebackers and allowing them to seek and destroy without having to shed these massive lineman.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"supafreak84" said:

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I tend to think Davenport is also being miscast as a 3-4 OLB. He's a big guy and not particularly an incredible athlete. Which again begs the question, why are we playing 3-4 when our personnel is STILL better suited to play 4-3? I'd feel a lot better with Hunter and Davenport as our starting DE's, with Phillips, Tonga, Roy and whomever else rotating in at the DT positions. I also like the idea of more bodies up front covering our smaller linebackers and allowing them to seek and destroy without having to shed these massive lineman.

I don't think DCs pay as much attention to the idea of prototypical size per position as fans do. Flores was on board when we signed Davenport, so I'm guessing he had a big influence on the signing.

Another thing to keep in mind is that 3-4 teams aren't always in 3-4. Especially Flores, who uses more sub-packages than most DCs. In Miami, for example, Flores was in a standard 3-4 only 34% of the time. The rest of the time was either nickel, dime, 4-3 or some variation. 

@"supafreak84" said:

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"supafreak84" said:

@"Wetlander" said: I wouldn't mind bringing Barr back as an OLB/pass rusher.  That was his position in college and he always seemed to be miscast as an OLB in a 4-3. Wonder if he'd want to come back?

I tend to think Davenport is also being miscast as a 3-4 OLB. He's a big guy and not particularly an incredible athlete. Which again begs the question, why are we playing 3-4 when our personnel is STILL better suited to play 4-3? I'd feel a lot better with Hunter and Davenport as our starting DE's, with Phillips, Tonga, Roy and whomever else rotating in at the DT positions. I also like the idea of more bodies up front covering our smaller linebackers and allowing them to seek and destroy without having to shed these massive lineman.

I don't think DCs pay as much attention to the idea of prototypical size per position as fans do. Flores was on board when we signed Davenport, so I'm guessing he had a big influence on the signing.

Another thing to keep in mind is that 3-4 teams aren't always in 3-4. Especially Flores, who uses more sub-packages than most DCs. In Miami, for example, Flores was in a standard 3-4 only 34% of the time. The rest of the time was either nickel, dime, 4-3 or some variation. 

Maybe not, but there are clearly certain athletic/size characteristics you want at certain positions, especially as it relates to something as specific as a 3-4. To me we have a bunch of strange, miscast pieces that we are trying to force into this scheme they aren't suited for. 

And we were sold on scheme flexibility last year and that they'd be running different fronts and formations....never happened. We were a base 3-4 team that stayed in a base 3-4 front almost the entirety of the season. Hoping it's different under Flores, but I'll believe it when I see it 

Netflix' QB has renewed my "ire" with our IOL...

There is one name on this list of big names Id love to see added and it's Risner

DeAndre Hopkins and Dalvin Cook lead a list of accomplished players who are still available a week before several NFL teams open training camp.Here are 10 more free agents who previously have had plenty of success in the NFL:

EZEKIEL ELLIOTT: The three-time Pro Bowl running back ran for 876 yards and 12 touchdowns while averaging a career-low 3.8 yards per carry for Dallas last season. Elliott still could return to the Cowboys, who got 1,007 yards rushing from Tony Pollard last season.
JADEVEON CLOWNEY: The former No. 1 overall pick is seeking his fifth team in six years. A three-time Pro Bowl defensive end, Clowney had two sacks last season in Cleveland after getting nine in 2021.
YANNICK NGAKOUE: The 28-year-old defensive end is an ideal fit for any team that needs a pass rush specialist. Ngakoue has had at least eight sacks in each of his seven seasons in the NFL. He had 9 1/2 last season for the Colts after tallying 10 in 2021 with Las Vegas.
MARCUS PETERS: Peters, a ball-hawking, two-time All-Pro cornerback, is coming off a subpar season in Baltimore, but he's two years removed from an ACL injury and provides an experienced playmaker for a team that needs help in pass coverage.
JUSTIN HOUSTON: At 34, Houston may be past his prime, but he had 9 1/2 sacks last season for the Ravens. The four-time Pro Bowl edge could spark a defense as a rotational player.
CARSON WENTZ: His MVP-caliber 2017 season in Philadelphia is a distant memory, and he's looking for his fourth team in four years. Wentz got booted out of Indianapolis after a 2021 season in which he threw 27 TD passes and had just seven interceptions. He struggled in an injury-shortened year with Washington in 2022 and has run out of opportunities as a starter.
JOHN JOHNSON: The veteran safety has started 80 games in his six-year career, missing only two games over the past three seasons. He had 101 tackles last season for Cleveland. The versatile Johnson has filled several roles in the defensive backfield and should find a new home, perhaps Green Bay, before the season starts.
LEONARD FOURNETTE: ''Playoff Lenny'' helped Tom Brady and the Tampa Bay Buccaneers win the Super Bowl a few years ago, but he averaged just 3.5 yards per carry behind a mediocre offensive line last season. The bruising runner may have to wait for a team that loses a couple running backs to injuries.
KAREEM HUNT: He's far removed from his 2017 rookie season in which he ran for 1,327 yards for the Chiefs, but Hunt is a versatile back who would provide depth. He may be a fit in Washington where he would reunite with former Chiefs offensive coordinator Eric Bieniemy and play behind Antonio Gibson and Brian Robinson.
DALTON RISNER: A left guard who started 62 games in four seasons in Denver, Risner shouldn't be unemployed too far into camp. He's a strong pass blocker and a potential fit for the Chargers or Vikings.

https://www.startribune.com/deandre-hopkins-and-dalvin-cook-lead-a-list-of-remaining-nfl-free-agents-ahead-of-training-camp/600288883/

Risner would be a good fit schematically, and he's a pretty good pass blocker.

But who are you replacing? The 2nd round, 4th year LG whose PFF grade as a run blocker is 30 points higher than Risner's? The 2nd round, 2nd year RG who was horrible early but improved dramatically as the season wore on? And whose run blocking grade is 10 points higher than Risner's? 

And if you do replace one of them, there goes all that continuity everyone's so excited about. I like Risner, loved him in the draft. It's just hard to see the Vikings messing with their starting five. 

For what it's worth, if you look at how all the rookie guards graded out last year, Ingram held his own, finishing in the top half, and ahead of 1st round guard Cole Strange. Not expecting Pro Bowls from Ingram, but I think we'll see a much better player in 2023. 

I hate the idea of trading Hunter. But if we can get a 1st rounder for him and replace him with a marginally less effective, but cheaper player like Yannick, you might still get away with calling this rebuild a "competitive" one. 

@"MaroonBells" said: I hate the idea of trading Hunter. But if we can get a 1st rounder for him and replace him with a marginally less effective, but cheaper player like Yannick, you might still get away with calling this rebuild a "competitive" one. 

Can never say never, but I can't see Yannick being welcomed in Eagan again...

Horrible against the run. Not sure his salary demand is commensurate with a situational only player. 

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"MaroonBells" said: I hate the idea of trading Hunter. But if we can get a 1st rounder for him and replace him with a marginally less effective, but cheaper player like Yannick, you might still get away with calling this rebuild a "competitive" one. 

Can never say never, but I can't see Yannick being welcomed in Eagan again...

Horrible against the run. Not sure his salary demand is commensurate with a situational only player.