Fire Donatell tonight
let Pettine take over. This has become embarrassing. I am having recurring visions of Serwanga, Tate, Walker and Bass getting torched week in and week out.
I wouldn't mind but you know they won't.
They have to do something about the defense. 10-2 sort of disguised the one thing that will very likely prevent the Vikings from advancing in the playoffs.
A defense with Hunter, Z, DT, Kendricks, Harry, P2 and Dantzler shouldn't be this bad. It shouldn't be awesome, but it shouldn't be THIS bad.
The passing game appears to be hitting its stride, but we can't run the ball and we can't play defense, the foundations of good football teams.
That's exactly right, when you can't run well? Or play defense? Good luck in the post-season!
Not absolving KOC for some bad play calling yesterday, but Donatell is the coach that needs to go.
And I gotta say 1 more thing, I watched P2 quit a bit yesterday and it wasn't pretty. He looked entirely disinterested and not engaged. I am starting to suspect there are some attitude things going on with that side of the ball.
Kevin O'Connell's decisions cost Vikings dearly in loss to the LionsAbove all Sunday, what Vikings coach Kevin O'Connell may regret the most is hiring Ed Donatell as his defensive coordinator.All week, Vikings players called their visit to Detroit a "hat and shirt game," meaning that if they won, they'd get to wear championship gear.
Their 34-23 loss to the Lions did not earn new clothing for the players, or a diploma and mortarboard for their head coach.
Kevin O'Connell's first season with the Vikings has been a resounding success. His first try at winning a division title resembled a graduate tripping while climbing the stairs to the stage.
On a day when Justin Jefferson set a franchise record with 223 receiving yards and Kirk Cousins threw for 425, O'Connell made a pivotal play call that involved neither.
Late in the first half and trailing by seven points, the Vikings faced first-and-goal from the Lions 3. O'Connell called for running back Dalvin Cook to take a handoff and make a jump pass to tight end Johnny Mundt.
These plays often work. In this instance, Cook looked uncomfortable as he approached the line. Instead of tucking the ball under his arm as he would on a running play, he was holding it away from his body, waiting to throw.
He got hit. He fumbled. Detroit recovered. The Vikings played catch-up the rest of the game.
"We had some interior penetration on the play," O'Connell said. "Ultimately, trying to be aggressive in that moment. We had a play set up and just didn't execute and the ball went the other way. It was a critical, critical error."
Any play call that fails can be second-guessed. Generally, NFL coaches spend so much time assessing their opponent's weaknesses and situational probabilities that second-guesses can be uninformed.
Sometimes, though, NFL coaches spend so much time dreaming and scheming during the week that they lose sight of obvious truths. In this case, the obvious truth was that the Lions couldn't cover Jefferson, Cook had scored easily on a previous goal-line carry, Adam Thielen is a gifted red-zone receiver, and T.J. Hockenson and K.J. Osborn are worthy options.
Instead, O'Connell called for Cook, who had never attempted a pass in the NFL, to throw to a blocking tight end.
This was not the same as a run-first offense like Tennessee's handing the ball to Derrick Henry and knowing that the defense would overreact. Cook was not presenting a threat to the middle of the Lions defense. He would rush for 1.5 yards per carry.
"I'm always going to rely on our guys to make that play and execute in that moment," O'Connell said. "We practiced it quite a bit."
O'Connell might have cost his team points with two other decisions.
The Vikings moved into range for a 64-yard field-goal attempt at the end of the half, but decided to throw the ball instead of attempting a field goal.
This is more of a quibble than a second-guess, but the ease with which modern kickers make long field goals, especially in domed stadiums, might have given O'Connell reason to call on Greg Joseph rather than trying a desperation pass play.
In the third quarter, after Cousins hit Thielen for a touchdown to make it 21-13, O'Connell called for a two-point conversion.
This wasn't merely odd. This was strange. Then O'Connell called for a pass to Thielen along the line of scrimmage, and the conversion failed.
The Cook fumble, the two-point conversion decision and the choice not to try a long field goal could have cost the Vikings up to 11 points
The Vikings also allowed a 42-yard run on a fake punt against a team known for special-teams surprises.
The decision that might bother O'Connell the most, were he to submit to questioning under oath, might be one he made in February, when he hired defensive coordinator Ed Donatell.
The Vikings defense is currently the worst in the NFL. They have set a franchise record by allowing 400 yards of total offense in five straight games. They have allowed 300 yards passing in all five.
"We've got to take a look at what we can do to help our guys be in position to make more plays," O'Connell said. "Be a little more aggressive, possibly. I think we've got to generate some more rush, however we do it, and then just try to limit the explosives."
O'Connell and Donatell should take the blame for this one
Vikings coach Kevin O'Connell says Ed Donatell will retain defensive play-calling dutiesAfter giving up 400 yards for the fifth game in a row, the Vikings fell to last in the NFL in total defense.
Vikings coach Kevin O'Connell said Monday there are "a lot of things on the table" to repair his team's 32nd-ranked defense, but shifting play-calling duties away from defensive coordinator Ed Donatell is not one of them.
"You know you're always looking at things that you think might be — what could be a possible answer to help the guys play better and be more consistent," O'Connell said, "but as of right now, no, that's not something I'm considering."
In the first season under Donatell and a new coaching staff, the Vikings defense has regressed to the point of allowing a franchise-worst five consecutive 400-yard games, including 464 in Sunday's loss to a Lions offense that didn't punt after halftime in Detroit's 34-23 home victory. The Vikings are now giving up an average of 403.7 yards per game, more than the franchise-worst 397.6 yards per game allowed in 2013.
A rash of mental and physical errors have plagued the Vikings secondary that, when combined with an inconsistent four-man pass rush, have led to open skies for quarterbacks. O'Connell said coaches can do a better job of forcing the defensive disruption that has been a key ingredient to the Vikings' winning formula during a 10-3 season; their 20 takeaways are tied for seventh in the NFL. They had no takeaways or sacks in recent losses to the Lions and Cowboys.
"Whether it be personnel-based, schematics-based," O'Connell said, "changing some looks, being a little bit more aggressive at times. Just picking our spots defensively to put our players in situations to be aggressive and try to make some plays. I think we've thrived this year when we've been able to turn the football over and be around the football."
O'Connell said coaches can't "completely change the scheme outright" in December, but they are looking for feasible adjustments to build momentum during a four-game stretch to end the regular season.
"Coaching is very important in times like this," O'Connell said. "Although we don't want to completely revamp, we have to be honest and look at things in a way where we can be the most competitive group we can possibly be over there, and that's what we're doing.
A Discouraging StreakThe Vikings defense has yielded more than 400 yards for five games in a row, and is now last in the NFL in yards allowed (403.7 per game) and passing yards allowed (287.2):
Week 10: W 33-30 (OT) at Buffalo
486 total yards (311 passing, 175 rushing), 6.8 yards per play, 4 takeaways
Week 11: L 40-3 vs. Dallas
458 total yards (307 passing, 151 rushing), 6.5 yards per play, 0 takeaways
Week 12: W 33-26 vs. New England
409 total yards (364 passing, 45 rushing), 7.4 yards per play, 0 takeaways
Week 13: W 27-22 vs. Jets
486 total yards (366 passing, 120 rushing), 5.9 yards per play, 2 turnovers
Week 14: L 34-23 at Detroit
464 total yards (330 passing, 134 rushing), 6.7 yards per play, 0 takeaways
I thought the most interesting quote from KOC was "but as of right now" that doesn't seem like someone who thinks there is not going to be a change at some point. From someone who has been dumped a lot, I am sensitive to that kind of language =)
The article fails to mention an important piece of information highlighting just how stupid the Cook pass call was -- the situation. It was first and goal at the 3 with 1:06 on the clock. The Lions had just taken their 2nd timeout. The play progression is easy -- power run to your strong side. If you score, great. If you don't, you force the Lions to use their last timeout. You have two goals -- score a touchdown and leave the Lions no time on the clock to come back and score. There are two things you do not do on that 1st and goal play -- pass the ball or run a play that risks negative yardage. Worst case you end up kicking a FG with no time left in the half and you are down 14-10 and receiving the 2nd half kickoff. I can't stress enough how monumentally stupid a play call that has Dalvin Cook tip toeing up to the line of scrimmage looking to pass the ball on 1st down was. Even if it works, you give the Lions over a minute with a timeout to comeback and likely get 3 of those points back, if not more.
the offense and special teams have both improved with the Coaching changes.
The defense..... not so much.
the defensive personnel still playing is better than last year.
I get this isn't a top 5 defense?
But it also shouldn't be bottom 5 either.
@"purplefaithful" said: That's exactly right, when you can't run well? Or play defense? Good luck in the post-season!Not absolving KOC for some bad play calling yesterday, but Donatell is the coach that needs to go.
And I gotta say 1 more thing, I watched P2 quit a bit yesterday and it wasn't pretty. He looked entirely disinterested and not engaged. I am starting to suspect there are some attitude things going on with that side of the ball.
In fairness, they’re already a game over what I thought would be a successful season. KOC has been a blessing. We’ve got a long way to go on D, but it’s doable over the next few years.
The Vikings will win a SB with KOC in control.
That defense has a chance to eclipse the worst Vikings D season in history (2013).
@"Purpleblooded" said: The article fails to mention an important piece of information highlighting just how stupid the Cook pass call was -- the situation. It was first and goal at the 3 with 1:06 on the clock. The Lions had just taken their 2nd timeout. The play progression is easy -- power run to your strong side. If you score, great. If you don't, you force the Lions to use their last timeout. You have two goals -- score a touchdown and leave the Lions no time on the clock to come back and score. There are two things you do not do on that 1st and goal play -- pass the ball or run a play that risks negative yardage. Worst case you end up kicking a FG with no time left in the half and you are down 14-10 and receiving the 2nd half kickoff. I can't stress enough how monumentally stupid a play call that has Dalvin Cook tip toeing up to the line of scrimmage looking to pass the ball on 1st down was. Even if it works, you give the Lions over a minute with a timeout to comeback and likely get 3 of those points back, if not more.
^This^
@"Purpleblooded" said: The article fails to mention an important piece of information highlighting just how stupid the Cook pass call was -- the situation. It was first and goal at the 3 with 1:06 on the clock. The Lions had just taken their 2nd timeout. The play progression is easy -- power run to your strong side. If you score, great. If you don't, you force the Lions to use their last timeout. You have two goals -- score a touchdown and leave the Lions no time on the clock to come back and score. There are two things you do not do on that 1st and goal play -- pass the ball or run a play that risks negative yardage. Worst case you end up kicking a FG with no time left in the half and you are down 14-10 and receiving the 2nd half kickoff. I can't stress enough how monumentally stupid a play call that has Dalvin Cook tip toeing up to the line of scrimmage looking to pass the ball on 1st down was. Even if it works, you give the Lions over a minute with a timeout to comeback and likely get 3 of those points back, if not more.Agree. KOC hasn't made many bad situational decisions this year, but this was one of them. He was probably trying to catch them off guard. I'm sure Detroit, too, was expecting a Dalvin run. But too much can go wrong with this kind of play, and even if it's successful you give Detroit a possession before the half.
Kevin O'Connell irked with Ed Donatell's defense. But he's not handling it like Mike Zimmer — for nowOn the NFL: Don't be fooled. Kevin O'Connell isn't happy with his defensive coordinator, but he's expressing his displeasure in a different way than when Mike Zimmer went after his offensive coordinators.
Even the Vikings' woodshed for wayward coordinators sounds like a kinder, gentler place to be admonished by young Kevin O'Connell as opposed to old Mike Zimmer.
In 2016, Zim's team started 5-0 but wasn't doing a great job protecting Sam Bradford. Zim, whose interpersonal communication was a bit more shall we say old-school than O'Connell's new-school vernacular, visited Norv Turner's offensive meeting room.
The defensive-minded Zim told Norv in no uncertain terms that he was to change his protection schemes because they were stale and predictable. Norv, however, was equal to Zim in stubbornness. The Vikings gave up six sacks in a loss to the Eagles and five more in another loss to the Bears at Chicago on Monday Night Football.
Norv quit the next morning with the Vikings atop the NFC North at 5-2.
Two years later, Zim gruffly scolded first-year offensive coordinator John DeFilippo repeatedly in public for not running the ball enough. DeFilippo ignored it right up to the moment Zim fired him after a 21-7 loss at Seattle. The Vikings were 6-6-1 and still in the playoff race.
"Dude, that Seahawks game on Monday night, there was tension between Zim and Flip," former Viking and then-Browns defensive end Ifeadi Odenigbo told the Star Tribune last year. "I know the play that got him fired. What could have been an easy run, Coach Flip said, 'Screw it' and went for the play-action bomb. Incomplete. It was a complete debacle. Those two were like oil and vinegar," although Ifeadi surely meant oil and water.
Those days, apparently, are gone. For now, at least.
For the first time in his 13-game head coaching career, O'Connell has felt the need to remind everyone publicly that while the culture of collaboration is fine and dandy, he's still da boss. And don't let the boyish looks and softspoken nature fool you. This boss isn't happy with defensive coordinator Ed Donatell and a soft unit that's dead last in yards allowed, just set a franchise record by giving up 400-plus yards in five straight games, and is seemingly content to sit back while even middling quarterbacks hand out explosive plays and touchdowns like they're at a Toys for Tots event.
Monday, a day after Jared Goff torched the Vikings in Detroit's 34-23 win, O'Connell said schematic changes were needed. More blitz packages were needed. As for Donatell keeping his job as play-caller, O'Connell said that's not something he's considering "right now."
Tuesday, O'Connell said: "My role as the head coach is one where I'm ultimately responsible for everything we do as a football team. I tend to look at things from the background that I have from the opposite lens. 'This is what they're seeing. This is what they might attack.' This is where we may have some looks where we've got to make some adjustments, some changes, a different picture for the offense. I think all those things have been good conversations, good dialogue."
O'Connell went on for a few more minutes, but, basically, it was a very long way of saying the same thing Zim used to snort out with a few terse words and a scowl when the other side of the ball was coming up woefully short.
Like Zimmer had with Pat Shurmur in 2016 and Kevin Stefanski in 2018, O'Connell does have a Plan B play-caller to turn to in mentor, friend and assistant head coach Mike Pettine. Of course, O'Connell doesn't think it will come to that. Not now, at least.
"There are times and moments when has to actually be put into action," he said. "That's where the relationships matter. We got to be honest with each other. … Have the ability to communicate with people in an honest manner, respectful, but make sure that, ultimately, I'm responsible for everything we do as a football team."
We'll find out relatively soon where this kinder, gentler public paddling goes from here. Next up is a Saturday meeting with a Colts team that's 4-8-1, more interested in next year's draft and coming off a bye after being nipped 33-0 in the fourth quarter of a 54-19 loss to the Cowboys.
On paper, it promises to be a feel-good game. We just don't know which guy will be feeling better about his future come Saturday night: Donatell or Colts quarterback Matt Ryan, a 37-year-old who looks 47, leads the league in interceptions (13) and turnovers (18), ranks fourth in sacks (35), and no doubt is looking forward to taking his cuts at Ed Donatell's defense.
https://www.startribune.com/minnesota-vikings-kevin-oconnell-unhappy-with-ed-donatells-defense-mike-zimmer/600235587/
I think the league has a bead on Donatell's D strategy. I'm quite sure KOC isn't happy about it, but why go red ass on it publicly? Nothing to be done this year anyway. I'd be surprised if there isn't some kind of offseason change on that side of the ball.
@"kmillard" said: That defense has a chance to eclipse the worst Vikings D season in history (2013).Man NO kidding. Good grief that team should have been at MINIMUM 10-5-1. Found a way to lose games in the last minute every single week.
Joe Barry will probably be available… ;) :p
Anybody who thought Donatell was a good hire in the first place is an idiot and that includes KOC. Donatell is a turd, and has always been a turd. He was rewarded for hanging on to Fangio's coat tales in Denver last year while not calling the defense. I told everybody he was a shitty hire and this 3-4 switch was a bad idea based on our roster strengths. You CAN NOT play "bend but don't break" in today's NFL. Teams and QB's are too good and will carve defenses up, which is exactly what has happened with us. If we get bounced in the playoffs because the defense falters, then KOC has nobody to blame but himself for making this ridiculous hire for his DC.
@"supafreak84" said: Anybody who thought Donatell was a good hire in the first place is an idiot and that includes KOC. Donatell is a turd, and has always been a turd. He was rewarded for hanging on to Fangio's coat tales in Denver last year while not calling the defense. I told everybody he was a shitty hire and this 3-4 switch was a bad idea based on our roster strengths. You CAN NOT play "bend but don't break" in today's NFL. Teams and QB's are too good and will carve defenses up, which is exactly what has happened with us. If we get bounced in the playoffs because the defense falters, then KOC has nobody to blame but himself for making this ridiculous hire for his DC.The roster wasn't there for the 34, but 8n fairness nobody expected this team to be in this position so a retooling year was no big deal....well a couple lucky bounces and a string of back up QBs and we are #2 seed with no defense and no running game. In the grand scheme of things we are not likely to be looking back at this year thinking what could have been if donatell hadn't been the DC as our O still has a long way to go to compete for the only real prize in pro football.
Whats gonna suck is an offseason with very few decent draft picks and the only way to create cap space is to potentially lose our veterans who are still performing at a high level. Imagine if Harry and AT say FO when the team comes asking for a pay cut for next year? More than likely I see a major can kicking offseason to try and fund a major all in effort, and a hard hard rebuilding period starting in about 3 years.
Reporters just had a really engaging session with Vikings DC Ed Donatell. Took all questions. Acknowledged need to cover tighter and rush better. But he pointed more to execution than scheme and said: "Eventually we'll be there. We know what we're doing and how to do it."
— Kevin Seifert (@SeifertESPN) December 14, 2022
With tighter coverage, Donatell said, the pass rush is more likely to get home. Asked about OLB Danielle Hunter, he said: "I think he's getting more comfortable every week. It'll take the whole year. Standing up and playing in our base is a little new to him, still..."
— Kevin Seifert (@SeifertESPN) December 14, 2022
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