A second look at lions trade

@"minny65" said:

@"medaille" said:

...

And can we all admit that it was not a "good" trade at least, right?  Even without any chart.  Just looking for a baseline but actually I think about 80% have already agreed to that.  You can find anyone/chart indicating what you want.  

@"medaille" said:

@"minny65" said:

@"medaille" said:

...

And can we all admit that it was not a "good" trade at least, right?  Even without any chart.  Just looking for a baseline but actually I think about 80% have already agreed to that.  You can find anyone/chart indicating what you want.  

I don’t feel a strong need to agree with you.  I think a lot of Vikings fans look at Spielmans drafts of continually trading down and just wanted something different and didn’t really get it and that’s coloring their opinions.  I think a lot of fans are getting exposed to the “analytical” draft value charts for perhaps the first time and their heads are filled more with the traditional draft charts values and that’s what they’ve internalized and for them, they’re obviously disappointed because the values didn’t work in our favor according to those charts.

For me, I’m still figuring out how I feel on this.  I do think it would have been nice if we
would have gotten more value, but I’m not at the point of feeling bad about the
trade.  I didn’t really pay attention
before the draft to players, so I wasn’t really attached to specific guys.  I do feel confident that the more important
part of drafting is who you pick rather than when you pick, where a GM who is
slightly better at avoiding busts and coaches who consistently get slightly
more out of their players will outcompete the guys who are better at trades but
bust more.

A better look at the Packers trade....

The #Vikings' trade down with the #Packers makes @SethWalder's list of the best five deals in the 2022 #NFLdraft. In Walder's analysis, the trade's value increased because it came with a division opponent -- not in spite of it. https://t.co/5ksSUZ8rjq pic.twitter.com/GAY4gtUhCQ

— Kevin Seifert (@SeifertESPN) May 6, 2022

I think people are giving Kwesi waaaay too much credit and chalking it up as "well the decision makers know more then we do" when that's not necessarily the case. That's like saying Biden knows what the hell he is doing just because he's the President, so he must, right?  Blind squirrels. Kwesi had zero football experience up until 8 years ago. Dude has been in the game less then a decade and his experience had little to nothing to do with roster building. He shit the bed on the Lions trade. People can try to rationalize it all they want, but it was an awful trade and no amount of spin is going to change that and he's not beyond criticism. I know he's everybody's golden boy right now but the guy hasn't done anything and his first offseason has been pretty lackluster thusfar. If this is a sign of things to come in future offseasons then this is going to be a very long four years until his contract expires and he's gone. Proof will be on the field, but I was extremely skeptical when we hired this guy and his first offseason has done nothing to change that. 

@"supafreak84" said: I think people are giving Kwesi waaaay too much credit and chalking it up as "well the decision makers know more then we do" when that's not necessarily the case. That's like saying Biden knows what the hell he is doing just because he's the President, so he must, right?  Blind squirrels. Kwesi had zero football experience up until 8 years ago. Dude has been in the game less then a decade and his experience had little to nothing to do with roster building. He shit the bed on the Lions trade. People can try to rationalize it all they want, but it was an awful trade and no amount of spin is going to change that and he's not beyond criticism. I know he's everybody's golden boy right now but the guy hasn't done anything and his first offseason has been pretty lackluster thusfar. If this is a sign of things to come in future offseasons then this is going to be a very long four years until his contract expires and he's gone. Proof will be on the field, but I was extremely skeptical when we hired this guy and his first offseason has done nothing to change that. 

@"AGRforever" said:

@"supafreak84" said: I think people are giving Kwesi waaaay too much credit and chalking it up as "well the decision makers know more then we do" when that's not necessarily the case. That's like saying Biden knows what the hell he is doing just because he's the President, so he must, right?  Blind squirrels. Kwesi had zero football experience up until 8 years ago. Dude has been in the game less then a decade and his experience had little to nothing to do with roster building. He shit the bed on the Lions trade. People can try to rationalize it all they want, but it was an awful trade and no amount of spin is going to change that and he's not beyond criticism. I know he's everybody's golden boy right now but the guy hasn't done anything and his first offseason has been pretty lackluster thusfar. If this is a sign of things to come in future offseasons then this is going to be a very long four years until his contract expires and he's gone. Proof will be on the field, but I was extremely skeptical when we hired this guy and his first offseason has done nothing to change that. 

Youre probably right. We should trust posters on an internet forum. Theyre the real geniuses. 

I love reading these posts, positive and negative, commenting on value of trades in the draft. None of these guys have played a down in the NFL. We have all seen high picks fail and lower picks excel. Time will tell how these trades pan out. Right now none of us really has a clue.

@"1VikesFan" said: I love reading these posts, positive and negative, commenting on value of trades in the draft. None of these guys have played a down in the NFL. We have all seen high picks fail and lower picks excel. Time will tell how these trades pan out. Right now none of us really has a clue.

Oh, did you see Kirk's new ride - wowza!  He is looking quit like the Dilf these daze!

@"Wetlander" said:

@"ap88ap28" said: The value of a dollar changes constantly. Why would the value of draft picks be set in stone. There was one QB taken on the first round and the 2nd dropped to what 80 something, The pick only has value of what is available at the time. A team is not giving as much for an injured wide reciever as a promising QB.Detroit did not have to take a wr at that pick if they did not feel comfortable with the value. They could have moved on to someone else with their pick.Value is only what somene will give you. If the pick had so much value some team would have offered it

The Lions were in love with Jameson Williams and wanted to move up for him.  Go read their GM's comments after they drafted him...  they obviously valued him highly.

The problem was Kwesi undervalued our pick at 12 IMO.  The Vikings didn't seem to hold Williams in the same regard as other players they liked.  He forgot the other half of the trade and that is if someone really wants to move up, you better make sure to get a good deal.

By any charts out there, the Vikings received a "fair" deal (analytics chart, which I heard we won by 10%) or lost the deal if you are using recent draft precedent and older charts.

That's where I have my biggest gripe with the trade...  Sure this draft may be "weaker" at the top than other drafts...  but that was mainly because there were no top tier QB prospects.  We were still picking top 12 and there were a couple blue chip guys (including Jameson) left at our pick.  Kwesi undervalued our pick in the trade back, plain and simple.  We could have gotten more value for trading out of the couple blue chip guys left.