PFF GRADES OUR O-LINE...

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

I thought the recent issues were too many screens and quick passes.  It has kept Kirk clean, but ever since we had success with that in Darrisaw's first start, that is all it has been.  

Yeahh we sell the screen so well--ole kirk locks eyes on who is getting the ball nearly before the hike.  
Five step drop to allow the lb or just about anyone such  as the beer guy to know nd get there.  All this for a -2 to +3 yd outcome.  

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

I thought the recent issues were too many screens and quick passes.  It has kept Kirk clean, but ever since we had success with that in Darrisaw's first start, that is all it has been.  

We have been running too many predictable plays given formations. Many teams use quick passes behind the line of scrimmage as substitute running plays (Dallas, KC, and Tampa do this a lot). Also, I think we are the only team in the NFL who now runs deep fade routes to their FB. It probably also doesn't help that we love to run on 2nd and long and gain minimal yards, thus creating a difficult situation for the passing game.

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

I thought the recent issues were too many screens and quick passes.  It has kept Kirk clean, but ever since we had success with that in Darrisaw's first start, that is all it has been.  

We have been running too many predictable plays given formations. Many teams use quick passes behind the line of scrimmage as substitute running plays (Dallas, KC, and Tampa do this a lot). Also, I think we are the only team in the NFL who now runs deep fade routes to their FB. It probably also doesn't help that we love to run on 2nd and long and gain minimal yards, thus creating a difficult situation for the passing game.

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

I thought the recent issues were too many screens and quick passes.  It has kept Kirk clean, but ever since we had success with that in Darrisaw's first start, that is all it has been.  

We have been running too many predictable plays given formations. Many teams use quick passes behind the line of scrimmage as substitute running plays (Dallas, KC, and Tampa do this a lot). Also, I think we are the only team in the NFL who now runs deep fade routes to their FB. It probably also doesn't help that we love to run on 2nd and long and gain minimal yards, thus creating a difficult situation for the passing game.

again, we ran many quick passes behind the LOS.  Ours just suck.  I see people mock the deep pass to Ham, but didn't he catch that for a big gain?  So we are too predictable, but the one unpredictable thing that works, fans mock it.

I sincerely doubt most fans even know what a predictable play is other than  the D stopped it cold.  Our play calling rhythm is off, nothing gets set up, the run game isn't generating much for yards and the only "successful" plays are quick screens that get a few yards.  Either our offensive coordinator is not up to the task or we have some massive tells that defenses are keying on.

More from the PFF through Week 9 OL Rankings - Vikings 24th (up 2) from week before.

Darrisaw has impressed, showcasing a modest 65.3 rookie grade from Pro Football Focus. He’s only allowed four pressures on quarterback Kirk Cousins through 135 passing attempts. Not bad.

And PFF agrees with that statement on the Vikings lackluster offensive line production. Sam Monson from PFF released offensive line rankings heading into Week 10 – and the Vikings ranked 24th. Right on the cusp of the bottom quarter of the NFL. Monson wrote:
“Christian Darrisaw looks like he will be a major upgrade for the Vikings at left tackle, but they got a look at another potential personnel change this past week when Mason Cole started at center and earned a 74.6 PFF game-grade against Baltimore. Garrett Bradbury has only four games in his NFL career that can match that number, and none of them have come since Week 10 of 2020. Minnesota has a former first-round pick invested in Bradbury, but at some point, that is nothing but a sunk cost. Meanwhile, Brian O’Neill has allowed just eight pressures in eight games as the team’s best lineman.”
Below the Vikings in the rankings? Lions, Raiders, Texans, Steelers, Panthers, Falcons, Giants, and Dolphins. Unsurprisingly, that list is deficient of playoff teams. Offensive line prowess and postseason football go hand in hand. Whoodathunkit.

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Zanary" said: ...24th.  Better than the 27th-29th we've dealt with, but still at the wrong end of the rankings.

Why Klint can't dial up quick screens any better than his predecessors...I just can't understand.  I've wondered this about our OCs for almost a decade.

Agreed. Do we require our OC's to not watch game film of other teams' offenses? The majority of the successful teams in the NFL run a lot of screens, misdirection, and quick passes. Add this all to the list of Vikings crap I dont understand

I thought the recent issues were too many screens and quick passes.  It has kept Kirk clean, but ever since we had success with that in Darrisaw's first start, that is all it has been.  

We have been running too many predictable plays given formations. Many teams use quick passes behind the line of scrimmage as substitute running plays (Dallas, KC, and Tampa do this a lot). Also, I think we are the only team in the NFL who now runs deep fade routes to their FB. It probably also doesn't help that we love to run on 2nd and long and gain minimal yards, thus creating a difficult situation for the passing game.

again, we ran many quick passes behind the LOS.  Ours just suck.  I see people mock the deep pass to Ham, but didn't he catch that for a big gain?  So we are too predictable, but the one unpredictable thing that works, fans mock it.

I sincerely doubt most fans even know what a predictable play is other than  the D stopped it cold.  Our play calling rhythm is off, nothing gets set up, the run game isn't generating much for yards and the only "successful" plays are quick screens that get a few yards.  Either our offensive coordinator is not up to the task or we have some massive tells that defenses are keying on.

SO it looks like they have two tackles, just need to figure out the interior. Although Cole deserves some more starts after that performance. But in this era of the Vikings, starters that were named starters in the summer have to play unless the go on IR.

If you had told me this summer, after 2020's godawful pressure and protection numbers, that in November the Vikings would...

...lead the NFL in sacks AND lead the NFL in fewest sacks given up, I would've said, "Great! So we're undefeated, then?" 

The Vikings lead the NFL in defensive sacks per game.

The Vikings lead the NFL in fewest sacks surrendered to opponents per game.

The Vikings have thrown the fewest interceptions in the NFL.

Kirk Cousins has not lost a fumble.

The Vikings are 3-5.

what. the. hell.

— Dustin Baker (@DustBaker) November 11, 2021

@"MaroonBells" said: If you had told me this summer, after 2020's godawful pressure and protection numbers, that in November the Vikings would...

...lead the NFL in sacks AND lead the NFL in fewest sacks given up, I would've said, "Great! So we're undefeated, then?" 

https://twitter.com/DustBaker/status/1458682456111042560

Yep. And honestly, this guy is to blame. He's squandered a season with promise:

Some new HC is going to have a GOOD team to work with. I would think it'll be an attractive position.

@"StickyBun" said:

@"MaroonBells" said: If you had told me this summer, after 2020's godawful pressure and protection numbers, that in November the Vikings would...

...lead the NFL in sacks AND lead the NFL in fewest sacks given up, I would've said, "Great! So we're undefeated, then?" 

https://twitter.com/DustBaker/status/1458682456111042560

Yep. And honestly, this guy is to blame. He's squandered a season with promise:

Some new HC is going to have a GOOD team to work with. I would think it'll be an attractive position.

I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

Preeeeeeeeeach

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

I think he is a good head coach in many ways.  Players like playing for him, he seems to genuinely care.  The downfall in this era is that with the current rules, defense is just not that important.  Any successful offensive coordinator immediately gets hired elsewhere.  That is Zimmers biggest issue.  The talent that has come and gone on the offensive side.

@"greediron" said:

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

I think he is a good head coach in many ways.  Players like playing for him, he seems to genuinely care.  The downfall in this era is that with the current rules, defense is just not that important.  Any successful offensive coordinator immediately gets hired elsewhere.  That is Zimmers biggest issue.  The talent that has come and gone on the offensive side.

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

I think he is a good head coach in many ways.  Players like playing for him, he seems to genuinely care.  The downfall in this era is that with the current rules, defense is just not that important.  Any successful offensive coordinator immediately gets hired elsewhere.  That is Zimmers biggest issue.  The talent that has come and gone on the offensive side.

Greed, I will give you props as you stick to your guns on Zimmer and his boys on defense. The issue in the NFL, mainly on the defensive side of things is loyalty will kill ya. It's an offensive game and Zim still tries to control games by owning the clock and stopping teams on 3rd down. Good coach, just not a good head coach anymore...probably a really cool guy to hang out with though.

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

I think he is a good head coach in many ways.  Players like playing for him, he seems to genuinely care.  The downfall in this era is that with the current rules, defense is just not that important.  Any successful offensive coordinator immediately gets hired elsewhere.  That is Zimmers biggest issue.  The talent that has come and gone on the offensive side.

Greed, I will give you props as you stick to your guns on Zimmer and his boys on defense. The issue in the NFL, mainly on the defensive side of things is loyalty will kill ya. It's an offensive game and Zim still tries to control games by owning the clock and stopping teams on 3rd down. Good coach, just not a good head coach anymore...probably a really cool guy to hang out with though.

I  said nothing about that, but go ahead and beat that drum.  My point was because our HC was a defensive guy, our offense has had talent come and go about every year.

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"StickyBun" said: I don't think Z is a bad person or even necessarily a bad coach: but he has weaknesses as a HEAD coach. He has weaknesses about how to attack and strategize in today's NFL. He's had a learning curve as THE man with the Vikings and the team should be better than this from various standpoints with Z being here as long as he has. Now is the time for a change. It's obvious. I know he desperately wants to win and I respect that. But its time to turn the page. 

I think he is a good head coach in many ways.  Players like playing for him, he seems to genuinely care.  The downfall in this era is that with the current rules, defense is just not that important.  Any successful offensive coordinator immediately gets hired elsewhere.  That is Zimmers biggest issue.  The talent that has come and gone on the offensive side.

Greed, I will give you props as you stick to your guns on Zimmer and his boys on defense. The issue in the NFL, mainly on the defensive side of things is loyalty will kill ya. It's an offensive game and Zim still tries to control games by owning the clock and stopping teams on 3rd down. Good coach, just not a good head coach anymore...probably a really cool guy to hang out with though.

I  said nothing about that, but go ahead and beat that drum.  My point was because our HC was a defensive guy, our offense has had talent come and go about every year.

Right. I wasnt criticizing you, was pointing out that I see you support Zimmer and some of his long term guys quite a bit. Nothing wrong about it, we just differ on their value which is fine. It does suck seeing the offensive coaches leave so much but because of playcalling this year you almost wonder if they feel like they are being micro-managed by Zimmer? Purely speculating on that