Postgame vs Browns
The NFL is a crazy game and as we have seen most teams are only separated by a couple big plays a game. You either make them and win, or you don't and lose...and the Vikings just have not come up with enough plays to win these close games. Just a few thoughts:
- We lack playmakers on offense. All the better teams in the league have multiple weapons on offense and the Vikings are just lacking. Tyler Conklin and JK Osborne aren't keeping defensive coordinators up at night and I said it before the season started that the injury to Irv Smith was huge. Combine that with the uneven results along the offensive line to this point and despite our overall ranking offensively, you can see the issues.
- To me we played into the strength of the Browns defensively and that's their defensive line. It seems like we never really even attempted to establish the running game today and their line got after Cousins without the threat of stopping the run.
- I'm still trying to figure out how we are having such an issue stopping the run on defense with the additions of Pierce and Tomlinson in front of Kendricks. I thought this would be the second coming of the Williams wall and its not even close. We went into the Cleveland game 20th against the run and todays effort didn't help. Dalvin Tomlinson has been a complete non factor thus far. Major disappointment.
- Its a results driven league and with the Vikings not getting the job done the clock continues to tick on Zimmer and possibly even Spielman. I don't know what Zimmer is doing on defense. It seems like he was experimenting with a 3-4 front for a while the first couple weeks and he has almost completely abandoned the double A gap blitz that made him a known coaching commodity. He needs to figure out his defense....and do it fast!
DT play and lack of contribution from this years draft class is disheartening.
We have playmakers. It's a matter of consistent o-line play, and yeah, it would be nice to have a deep threat TE. It would also be nice to have a offensive coord. that was seasoned and had more of a game plan than an opening series.
The 2 big free agent pickups to plug the middle are proving to be a waste of money. There was a reason Pierce was let go, and as you mentioned Tomlinson is MIA. We also threw big money at a stiff named Barr, and sorry, but even the Hitman is fading fast. Zimmer will go to the mat for this defense, but it is below average. We only gave up 14 today, but that will prove to be an aberration over the course of the season.
A run first offense with this o-line isn't going to outscore an opponent with our issues on defense.
If Baker Mayfield could hit the broad side of a barn on longer passes this would have been 35-7 not 14-7. This team is what it's record says it is.
@"supafreak84" said:- We lack playmakers on offense. All the better teams in the league have multiple weapons on offense and the Vikings are just lacking. Tyler Conklin and JK Osborne aren't keeping defensive coordinators up at night and I said it before the season started that the injury to Irv Smith was huge.
We should have drafted Hunter Henry (TE) instead of Laquon Treadpoorly (WR) some years ago.
We should have drafted DK Metcalf instead of ISJ 2 years ago.
(I argued strongly for both.... & both of your "issues" would now be resolved :) )
(I gagged at Bradbury and Laquon. Wastes of opportunity. Loved Jefferson/Cleveland last year, ftr)
Thru the first 4 games of 2021, compared to 2020:
In the first 4 games of 2020, K-Rud & ISJ had combined stat lines of 8 catches, 80 yards and 1 TD.
In the first 4 games of 2021, T-Conk has a stat line of 27 catches, 144 yards and 1 TD.
T-Conk is NOT the problem.
In the first 4 games of 2020, Bisi-J had combined stat lines of 5 catches, 84 yards and 0 TD.
In the frist 4 games of 2021, K-Oz has combined stat lines of 17 catches, 219 yards and 1 TD.
K-Oz is NOT the problem.
I will agree that T-Conk and K-Oz may not be keeping D-Cords "up at night"....but neither were K-Rud, ISJ, or Bisi-J.
BUT....the Vikes have TRIPLED production at those two positions, thus far. Losing ISJ is not the problem.
BTW....wanna keep a D-Cord up at night?
J-Jettas, A-T, D-Met, Hunter H, D-Cook.
We've missed too many times at the top of the draft.
@"savannahskol" said:@"supafreak84" said:- We lack playmakers on offense. All the better teams in the league have multiple weapons on offense and the Vikings are just lacking. Tyler Conklin and JK Osborne aren't keeping defensive coordinators up at night and I said it before the season started that the injury to Irv Smith was huge.
We should have drafted Hunter Henry (TE) instead of Laquon Treadpoorly (WR) some years ago.
We should have drafted DK Metcalf instead of ISJ 2 years ago.
(I argued strongly for both.... & both of your "issues" would now be resolved :) )
(I gagged at Bradbury and Laquon. Wastes of opportunity. Loved Jefferson/Cleveland last year, ftr)Thru the first 4 games of 2021, compared to 2020:
In the first 4 games of 2020, K-Rud & ISJ had combined stat lines of 8 catches, 80 yards and 1 TD.
In the first 4 games of 2021, T-Conk has a stat line of 27 catches, 144 yards and 1 TD.
T-Conk is NOT the problem.In the first 4 games of 2020, Bisi-J had combined stat lines of 5 catches, 84 yards and 0 TD.
In the frist 4 games of 2021, K-Oz has combined stat lines of 17 catches, 219 yards and 1 TD.
K-Oz is NOT the problem.I will agree that T-Conk and K-Oz may not be keeping D-Cords "up at night"....but neither were K-Rud, ISJ, or Bisi-J.
BUT....the Vikes have TRIPLED production at those two positions, thus far. Losing ISJ is not the problem.BTW....wanna keep a D-Cord up at night?
J-Jettas, A-T, D-Met, Hunter H, D-Cook.
We've missed too many times at the top of the draft.
The bold is why I am super fed up with the current regime.
@"savannahskol" said:@"supafreak84" said:- We lack playmakers on offense. All the better teams in the league have multiple weapons on offense and the Vikings are just lacking. Tyler Conklin and JK Osborne aren't keeping defensive coordinators up at night and I said it before the season started that the injury to Irv Smith was huge.
We should have drafted Hunter Henry (TE) instead of Laquon Treadpoorly (WR) some years ago.
We should have drafted DK Metcalf instead of ISJ 2 years ago.
(I argued strongly for both.... & both of your "issues" would now be resolved :) )
(I gagged at Bradbury and Laquon. Wastes of opportunity. Loved Jefferson/Cleveland last year, ftr)Thru the first 4 games of 2021, compared to 2020:
In the first 4 games of 2020, K-Rud & ISJ had combined stat lines of 8 catches, 80 yards and 1 TD.
In the first 4 games of 2021, T-Conk has a stat line of 27 catches, 144 yards and 1 TD.
T-Conk is NOT the problem.In the first 4 games of 2020, Bisi-J had combined stat lines of 5 catches, 84 yards and 0 TD.
In the frist 4 games of 2021, K-Oz has combined stat lines of 17 catches, 219 yards and 1 TD.
K-Oz is NOT the problem.I will agree that T-Conk and K-Oz may not be keeping D-Cords "up at night"....but neither were K-Rud, ISJ, or Bisi-J.
BUT....the Vikes have TRIPLED production at those two positions, thus far. Losing ISJ is not the problem.BTW....wanna keep a D-Cord up at night?
J-Jettas, A-T, D-Met, Hunter H, D-Cook.
We've missed too many times at the top of the draft.
Yeah we weren't good through the first four games last year either. ISJ was absolutely being counted on to be a huge part of the offense this season and not having him has been a huge loss. But yes I agree that there have been some draft misses that would have benefitted us today
I’ve been a long time supporter of RS but this year’s roster admittedly has me wavering.
I have a lot of thoughts on the game but to reply directly to OP— I agree Tomlinson has been a huge bust and even more concerning, Harry Smith has been invisible.
Our 2021 draft class isn’t playing. Our 2022 fourth rounder Herndon isn’t doing anything. Mike Hughes is playing a ton for the Chiefs. Our 2020 first rounder Gladney is off the team. Our 2019 (?) first rounder Bradbury is struggling. And we’re 1-3.
Like I said, I like Spielman. But who am I supposed to blame for the problems listed above?
@"pattersaur" said: I’ve been a long time supporter of RS but this year’s roster admittedly has me wavering.I have a lot of thoughts on the game but to reply directly to OP— I agree Tomlinson has been a huge bust and even more concerning, Harry Smith has been invisible.
Our 2021 draft class isn’t playing. Our 2022 fourth rounder Herndon isn’t doing anything. Mike Hughes is playing a ton for the Chiefs. Our 2020 first rounder Gladney is off the team. Our 2019 (?) first rounder Bradbury is struggling. And we’re 1-3.
Like I said, I like Spielman. But who am I supposed to blame for the problems listed above?
some say we are supposed to blame Covid impact, injuries, young roster and coaching turn over (you decide the order).
From my point of view, all rest squarely on Rick and Zimmer.
We have the best RB in the league and one of the best WR duos, not sure how there is any question about not having playmakers. Our QB is too immobile and does not read pressure, which means the OL needs to be perfect on every play. It seems pretty basic that if you were the OC you would design an offense that used a lot of rollouts, short drops and quick hitters. I have no answer as to why we put Cousins in a deep drop every play. Play calling lost this game.
@"mblack" said:@"pattersaur" said: I’ve been a long time supporter of RS but this year’s roster admittedly has me wavering.I have a lot of thoughts on the game but to reply directly to OP— I agree Tomlinson has been a huge bust and even more concerning, Harry Smith has been invisible.
Our 2021 draft class isn’t playing. Our 2022 fourth rounder Herndon isn’t doing anything. Mike Hughes is playing a ton for the Chiefs. Our 2020 first rounder Gladney is off the team. Our 2019 (?) first rounder Bradbury is struggling. And we’re 1-3.
Like I said, I like Spielman. But who am I supposed to blame for the problems listed above?
some say we are supposed to blame Covid impact, injuries, young roster and coaching turn over (you decide the order).
From my point of view, all rest squarely on Rick and Zimmer.
Oh hell to the no. COVID was supposedly part of it last year but they don't get to go to that twice.
What a difference a week makes. Last week people were falling all over themselves in praising KK. This week he’s a bum. The offensive line was finally gelling last week. Now it’s a pice of crap. My thoughts watching the game, jumbled up and in no particular order:
the DL played well until they lost Pierce and just got gassed finally. They made 7 stops on first and goal before allowing their one TD. And they got good pressure on Mayfield. DBs looked bad but we’re saved from getting burned repeatedly by the pressure Mayfield was feeling. The OL looked like crap—on the few occasions they gave KC time to throw he was right on the money. Most intriguing to me was the pissing contest Stephanski and Zim got into. Twice Stephanski went for it on 4 down early in the game. And they weren’t gimmees—4th and 4, 4th and 5. A direct snub at Zimmer’s D. And a slap at the guy who got him fired. So what does Zim do? Goes for it on 4th and 6. Two can play this game. So stupid when he was in field goal range. Just schoolyard egos on display from both. Anyway—is Darrisaw ever going to play? Wyatt? Barr?
The OL cost us the game yesterday. The D isnt what many of had hoped (at least not yet) - but they played well enough for us to win vs Browns.
You hold an NFL team to 14 pts? You're going to win 95% of the time
@"purplefaithful" said: The OL cost us the game yesterday. The D isnt what many of had hoped (at least not yet) - but they played well enough for us to win vs Browns.You hold an NFL team to 14 pts? You're going to win 95% of the time
Yea and when the other team holds you to 7 points you win all the time :)
@"JR44" said: We have the best RB in the league and one of the best WR duos, not sure how there is any question about not having playmakers. Our QB is too immobile and does not read pressure, which means the OL needs to be perfect on every play. It seems pretty basic that if you were the OC you would design an offense that used a lot of rollouts, short drops and quick hitters. I have no answer as to why we put Cousins in a deep drop every play. Play calling lost this game.The better teams in the league all have multiple weapons on offense. I love Cook, Thielen, and Jefferson (of course) but anything after those three are just roster fillers. Kansas City, Tampa, Arizona, Green Bay, and Dallas all have multiple weapons that legitimately cause problems. The Vikings don't have that kind of firepower or depth and it shows. Trying to fill those gaps with the Bisi Johnson's and Dede Westbrooks of the world has not paid dividends. Again, it's why the Irv Smith injury was big because he was supposed to be that rising threat and 3rd option in the passing game that would make teams pay for rolling coverage at Thielen and Jefferson
@"supafreak84" said:I wouldnt say it's an issue of not having weapons. Cook, Mattison, Jefferson, Thielen, and Osborn is a dang good core (losing Irv did stink). Every team you listed there have above average offensive lines with Tampa and Dallas arguably having the best.@"JR44" said: We have the best RB in the league and one of the best WR duos, not sure how there is any question about not having playmakers. Our QB is too immobile and does not read pressure, which means the OL needs to be perfect on every play. It seems pretty basic that if you were the OC you would design an offense that used a lot of rollouts, short drops and quick hitters. I have no answer as to why we put Cousins in a deep drop every play. Play calling lost this game. The better teams in the league all have multiple weapons on offense. I love Cook, Thielen, and Jefferson (of course) but anything after those three are just roster fillers. Kansas City, Tampa, Arizona, Green Bay, and Dallas all have multiple weapons that legitimately cause problems. The Vikings don't have that kind of firepower or depth and it shows. Trying to fill those gaps with the Bisi Johnson's and Dede Westbrooks of the world has not paid dividends. Again, it's why the Irv Smith injury was big because he was supposed to be that rising threat and 3rd option in the passing game that would make teams pay for rolling coverage at Thielen and Jefferson
Irv Smith was all about potential this year and the words like "supposed" to get more attention and was "expected" to take that next step.....let's not act like he was anything but an average TE so far in his short career. If we are going to dig that deep for another excuse for a 1-3 start we are really scrapping the bottom ....IMHO :)
@"JR44" said: We have the best RB in the league and one of the best WR duos, not sure how there is any question about not having playmakers. Our QB is too immobile and does not read pressure, which means the OL needs to be perfect on every play. It seems pretty basic that if you were the OC you would design an offense that used a lot of rollouts, short drops and quick hitters. I have no answer as to why we put Cousins in a deep drop every play. Play calling lost this game.
I can't like this post enough. Seriously, you know we struggle against the pressure, run a fricken slant route. Not every play needs to be 7 step drop or a screen. There is ground in the middle to be worked.
Mayfield was so bad he made the D look alot better than it would have been with league average play from the browns QB.
Edit Post (mod action — author will see a notice)
Warn Poster
Suspend User (3 days)
The user will be suspended for 3 days and will receive an email with the reason and information about how to appeal.