Failure to develop...

I'd say it's been a mix of bad luck (Loadholt, Harris), poor development (Samia, Elflein, Clemmings) and bad drafting (Beavers). 

This new group of Bradbury, O'Neill and Cleveland is showing a lot of promise. Add one more in the draft and this could be the line that makes us forget all the bad ones.

We should have given Mike Tice a lifetime OL contract.  There is one thing that meathead is good at, and that is developing OL

@"Skodin" said: We should have given Mike Tice a lifetime OL contract.  There is one thing that meathead is good at, and that is developing OL

He'd probably be better than what we've had. But looking back I now sometimes wonder if he was as good as we all thought. Cory Withrow comes to mind. Tice kept raving about him and so that sort of became one of his success stories....except when it came time to be a starter, he didn't amount to much.

@"MaroonBells" said:

@"Skodin" said: We should have given Mike Tice a lifetime OL contract.  There is one thing that meathead is good at, and that is developing OL

He'd probably be better than what we've had. But looking back I now sometimes wonder if he was as good as we all thought. Cory Withrow comes to mind. Tice kept raving about him and so that sort of became one of his success stories....except when it came time to be a starter, he didn't amount to much.

You can only work with what you are given. I think it's more of a problem with player selection than development.

@"MaroonBells" said: I'd say it's been a mix of bad luck (Loadholt, Harris), poor development (Samia, Elflein, Clemmings) and bad drafting (Beavers). 

This new group of Bradbury, O'Neill and Cleveland is showing a lot of promise. Add one more in the draft and this could be the line that makes us forget all the bad ones.

I think it's mostly development issues. Bad luck, meaning injuries - they happen. It's not as if we have lost multiple early-round players before they could play much. Loadholt played 6 good years, Harris came out of nowhere and we were lucky to have a good year from him.

The staff has managed some players badly after injuries. Sullivan and Fusco were released before they had a chance to completely recover and could have played longer here.  They also moved Fusco from RG to LG and he couldn't adjust (but started back at RG for the Falcons a year later). 

They ruined Clemmings by moving him around. This staff has acted like players (Fusco, Clemmings, Sirles, Elflein) should be able to play multiple positions, and that's nice for career backups like Joe Berger but they ended up with lines full of backup-quality players.

Bad drafting? I'm as critical of Spielman as anyone, but my complaint re OL is that we didn't invest enough early picks, until recently anyway. Were any of these "bad picks" for the round they were chosen: David Yankey (5th), Tyrus Thompson (6th), Austin Shepherd (7th), Danny Isidora (5th), Colby Gossett (6th)? They were all OK for raw development prospects on Day 3. None developed, but has this team done a worse job developing late picks for OL than they have for DL or DBs picked late? 

Regarding the "new group", I sure hope you are right. But a year ago, Pat Elflein was part of that group and he failed. Bradbury...man, he looked like a great pick, and I'm not giving up yet, but has he progressed well? Is the staff developing him?  Is Cleveland a good OG or just looked good compared to Elflein? There's a lot yet to answer.

I wonder if having so many OCs and developing young lineman has contributed to the issue.  Norv and Shumer are the only ones that have lasted more than a year.  

Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

@"BarrNone55" said: Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

Yeah forgot about his loss, that was big.

Tony Sparano 

@"BarrNone55" said: Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

Because Patterson has developed.......oh, never mind, you already know what I'm going to say.

Nope, can't stop myself. Jalyn Holmes, Jaleel Johnson, Scott Crichton, Datone Jones, Ifeadi Odenigbo, Stephen Weatherly, Ade Aruna, Tashawn Bower, Armon Watts. Hmm. 2 backups.

Oh, right -- Danielle Hunter!! Man, this defensive coaching staff is going to milk him forever.

Barr - you've convinced me: Spielman is a good GM. He drafts well. Zimmer and his staff are making these good draft picks go to waste. I think player development on this team is woeful, and not just in the OL.

Fire away.

@"Jor-El" said:

@"BarrNone55" said: Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

Because Patterson has developed.......oh, never mind, you already know what I'm going to say.

Nope, can't stop myself. Jalyn Holmes, Jaleel Johnson, Scott Crichton, Datone Jones, Ifeadi Odenigbo, Stephen Weatherly, Ade Aruna, Tashawn Bower, Armon Watts. Hmm. 2 backups.

Oh, right -- Danielle Hunter!! Man, this defensive coaching staff is going to milk him forever.

Barr - you've convinced me: Spielman is a good GM. He drafts well. Zimmer and his staff are making these good draft picks go to waste. I think player development on this team is woeful, and not just in the OL.

Fire away.

@"greediron" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"BarrNone55" said: Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

Because Patterson has developed.......oh, never mind, you already know what I'm going to say.

Nope, can't stop myself. Jalyn Holmes, Jaleel Johnson, Scott Crichton, Datone Jones, Ifeadi Odenigbo, Stephen Weatherly, Ade Aruna, Tashawn Bower, Armon Watts. Hmm. 2 backups.

Oh, right -- Danielle Hunter!! Man, this defensive coaching staff is going to milk him forever.

Barr - you've convinced me: Spielman is a good GM. He drafts well. Zimmer and his staff are making these good draft picks go to waste. I think player development on this team is woeful, and not just in the OL.

Fire away.

you might want to go back a few more years for Patterson.

I do not think the Vikings current regime knows what a good interior lineman looks like.

Their disdain for size and power is a mystery.

It is amazing when you consider that Kork operates very well when he does not have pressure up the middle.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-ranking-quarterbacks-pressure-2019-season

5. KIRK COUSINS, MINNESOTA VIKINGS-42.4 difference in PFF passing grade when pressured, 36% pressure rateIt is no secret that the Vikings have had their fair share of struggles along the offensive line. Their plan to circumvent that last season was a heavy dose of play action and plays that got Cousins outside of the pocket on designed rollouts. Cousins had some success with that gameplan, but pressure still caused him trouble. His clean-pocket passing grade was tied for first in the NFL with Russell Wilson and Ryan Tannehill among qualifying quarterbacks, but his pressured passing grade of 51.0 ranked 16th among 32 qualifying quarterbacks.

@"Jor-El" said:

@"greediron" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"BarrNone55" said: Losing Soprano killed the development of the OL. Need to find the Dre equivalent.

Because Patterson has developed.......oh, never mind, you already know what I'm going to say.

Nope, can't stop myself. Jalyn Holmes, Jaleel Johnson, Scott Crichton, Datone Jones, Ifeadi Odenigbo, Stephen Weatherly, Ade Aruna, Tashawn Bower, Armon Watts. Hmm. 2 backups.

Oh, right -- Danielle Hunter!! Man, this defensive coaching staff is going to milk him forever.

Barr - you've convinced me: Spielman is a good GM. He drafts well. Zimmer and his staff are making these good draft picks go to waste. I think player development on this team is woeful, and not just in the OL.

Fire away.

you might want to go back a few more years for Patterson.

Does he get credit for turning Robison and Griffen into competent NFL players?? Or was he doing great things at UTEP and Florida International that should override his results since 2014?