4 all those who want to trade Kirk Cousins to SF (a rumor, no legs), for a 1st & | VikeFans.com

I swear, the Kirk Hate Club is a pack of Madden munchkins that live in a 'plug in a different player every game!" reality.

He produces a ton, could do much more with even average o-line play, and has actually afforded consistency where we'd had a revolving door. I'll never get the naysayers.

I don't know to me it seemed like something to talk about in the off season. I don't see him going anywhere. There are still a lot of issues to address. Time will tell how it shakes out.

Wow I forgot about Kelly Holcomb!  yeah Kirk is steady and reliable and is basically Alex Smith and our fan base is begging for a guy like Mahomes.  I want a Superbowl win not sure Kirk can get us there I hope so.

I look at it this way.  If Kirk is the reason you win a SB, you pay him one way; if the Vikes can win a SB with Kirk as QB, you pay him another way.  He is paid as the former, not the latter.  So his salary hinders the team reaching the SB. 

i like KC, but if he and 2 firsts get me Watson, i run to sign that deal 

@"Bullazin" said: i like KC, but if he and 2 firsts get me Watson, i run to sign that deal 

Doesn't Kirk have a no-trade clause that lets him veto any trade? So why would he go to Houston after escaping Washington three years ago? I think that could be a big factor in any Watson trade talks that involve the other team's starter. For instance, would Stafford have agreed to go to Houston? If he had the trade veto power, I really doubt it.

If a team wants to acquire Watson but already has a QB with a significant salary, they need to get that QB to agree to be part of the trade. I would cross Minnesota, San Francisco, Atlanta, and Pittsburgh off the list because all their starting QBs are too expensive to co-exist with Watson and too smart to go to Houston.

@"Jor-El" said:

@"Bullazin" said: i like KC, but if he and 2 firsts get me Watson, i run to sign that deal 

Doesn't Kirk have a no-trade clause that lets him veto any trade? So why would he go to Houston after escaping Washington three years ago? I think that could be a big factor in any Watson trade talks that involve the other team's starter. For instance, would Stafford have agreed to go to Houston? If he had the trade veto power, I really doubt it.

If a team wants to acquire Watson but already has a QB with a significant salary, they need to get that QB to agree to be part of the trade. I would cross Minnesota, San Francisco, Atlanta, and Pittsburgh off the list because all their starting QBs are too expensive to co-exist with Watson and too smart to go to Houston.

I'm not convinced KC + 2 1sts = Watson...I think the loot would have to be much more than that (i.e. include Hunter etc.)

Vikings might have to be part of a 3 way with SF somehow involved. Either way, it would be prohibitive - but Watson would immediately be the face of this franchise. Much more so than Cousins ever will be (unless he wins a SB or gets em to one). 

That said, I like KC. He's got his klunkers, tends to run streaky. But I believe a finger of indictment needs to be pointed at the Vikings front office, for giving him one really piss poor pass-blocking OL to play behind. 

@"Hawkvike25" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"Bullazin" said: i like KC, but if he and 2 firsts get me Watson, i run to sign that deal 

Doesn't Kirk have a no-trade clause that lets him veto any trade? So why would he go to Houston after escaping Washington three years ago? I think that could be a big factor in any Watson trade talks that involve the other team's starter. For instance, would Stafford have agreed to go to Houston? If he had the trade veto power, I really doubt it.

If a team wants to acquire Watson but already has a QB with a significant salary, they need to get that QB to agree to be part of the trade. I would cross Minnesota, San Francisco, Atlanta, and Pittsburgh off the list because all their starting QBs are too expensive to co-exist with Watson and too smart to go to Houston.

He did, but I'm fairly certain the no-trade clause was eliminated with the most recent extension

Awful point, do you stay in a just okay relationship, because all your others were bad?  Also, I would argue that we had better seasons with Keenum and Teddy than we ever had with Kirk, they both were able to do something that Kirk has not, which is to elevate the play of those around him and win a division. 

This same logic could be applied to Stafford and all of the other QBs the Lions have had.

And yet he just got traded and everyone in the media is praising the move...

Almost like there's 2 sides to these discussions and both viewpoints have some merit.

@"JR44" said: Awful point, do you stay in a just okay relationship, because all your others were bad?  Also, I would argue that we had better seasons with Keenum and Teddy than we ever had with Kirk, they both were able to do something that Kirk has not, which is to elevate the play of those around him and win a division. 

I'm not buying this.  With KC at QB, the Vikes did win a nice playoff game in NO.  I do believe if the Vikings D was as good this year as when Teddy or Keenam played, the Vikings probably would've rivaled or beaten GB for the NFC North title. I think the main problem with KC is the timing of his arrival.  The rest of the team unexpectedly got worse in a hurry, so the Vikings aren't winning more even with the QB upgrade.  I just don't think the Vikes can rebuild quickly enough to benefit from having a high priced QB like KC on the roster.

@"purplefaithful" said: Vikings might have to be part of a 3 way with SF somehow involved. 

Sounds kinky.

@"JR44" said: Awful point, do you stay in a just okay relationship, because all your others were bad?  

Isn't that one of the common arguments for retaining Mike Zimmer?

Regardless of whether or not the Vikings trade Cousins, they have to have some kind of plan to navigate that $45M cap hit in 2022 that they created for themselves.

Extending him again when he will be 35 years old in 2023 is really not something I would do or recommend.  We are talking Matt Ryan.

The questions are can Cousins play at this level at age 35, will he continue to avoid injury (knock on wood), how much will it cost, and does it make a ton of sense?

The draft next year at QB is weak.  The players being mentioned may not come out and many are small physically.

They could add two void years to Cousins deal to lower his cap hit in 2022 and take dead money hits in 2023 & 2024.

But that still does not address who would be next at QB.  

I would hate for them to wait until 2023 to try and find a QB.

That is who we ended up with Ponder.

@"comet52" said:

@"purplefaithful" said: Vikings might have to be part of a 3 way with SF somehow involved. 

Sounds kinky.

@"MarkSP18" said: Regardless of whether or not the Vikings trade Cousins, they have to have some kind of plan to navigate that $45M cap hit in 2022 that they created for themselves.

Extending him again when he will be 35 years old in 2023 is really not something I would do or recommend.  We are talking Matt Ryan.

The questions are can Cousins play at this level at age 35, will he continue to avoid injury (knock on wood), how much will it cost, and does it make a ton of sense?

The draft next year at QB is weak.  The players being mentioned may not come out and many are small physically.

They could add two void years to Cousins deal to lower his cap hit in 2022 and take dead money hits in 2023 & 2024.

But that still does not address who would be next at QB.  

I would hate for them to wait until 2023 to try and find a QB.

That is who we ended up with Ponder.

I agree with you. These are all very compelling reasons why drafting a young QB or looking for other options make sense. I hope the Vikings do that.
The reason they probably won't are also compelling. The QBs available are either 1- mostly unattainable and unknown (the top rookies) or 2- worse than Kirk.

The only exception to these is Deshaun Watson, and he will be EXPENSIVE. Plus, there's no guarantee the Texans would want Kirk back in return. They probably wouldn't. So that then becomes really hard to work something out.
For these reasons the Vikings are stuck with Kirk unless something falls into their laps. We just have to hope both Kirk and the team keep getting better I guess, and then maybe his extension in 2 years will be more palatable when it happens.

@"MarkSP18" said: Regardless of whether or not the Vikings trade Cousins, they have to have some kind of plan to navigate that $45M cap hit in 2022 that they created for themselves.

Extending him again when he will be 35 years old in 2023 is really not something I would do or recommend.  We are talking Matt Ryan.

The questions are can Cousins play at this level at age 35, will he continue to avoid injury (knock on wood), how much will it cost, and does it make a ton of sense?

The draft next year at QB is weak.  The players being mentioned may not come out and many are small physically.

They could add two void years to Cousins deal to lower his cap hit in 2022 and take dead money hits in 2023 & 2024.

But that still does not address who would be next at QB.  

I would hate for them to wait until 2023 to try and find a QB.

That is who we ended up with Ponder.

Agreed. I think drafting a QBOF in THIS draft is a major need. It'll allow us to move on from KC after 2022. I'd be willing to draft a QB at No. 78 if the Vikes thought that player could replace KC in 2023.

@"Knucklehead" said:

@"MarkSP18" said: Regardless of whether or not the Vikings trade Cousins, they have to have some kind of plan to navigate that $45M cap hit in 2022 that they created for themselves.

Extending him again when he will be 35 years old in 2023 is really not something I would do or recommend.  We are talking Matt Ryan.

The questions are can Cousins play at this level at age 35, will he continue to avoid injury (knock on wood), how much will it cost, and does it make a ton of sense?

The draft next year at QB is weak.  The players being mentioned may not come out and many are small physically.

They could add two void years to Cousins deal to lower his cap hit in 2022 and take dead money hits in 2023 & 2024.

But that still does not address who would be next at QB.  

I would hate for them to wait until 2023 to try and find a QB.

That is who we ended up with Ponder.

Agreed. I think drafting a QBOF in THIS draft is a major need. It'll allow us to move on from KC after 2022. I'd be willing to draft a QB at No. 78 if the Vikes thought that player could replace KC in 2023.

@"pattersaur" said:

@"MarkSP18" said: Regardless of whether or not the Vikings trade Cousins, they have to have some kind of plan to navigate that $45M cap hit in 2022 that they created for themselves.

Extending him again when he will be 35 years old in 2023 is really not something I would do or recommend.  We are talking Matt Ryan.

The questions are can Cousins play at this level at age 35, will he continue to avoid injury (knock on wood), how much will it cost, and does it make a ton of sense?

The draft next year at QB is weak.  The players being mentioned may not come out and many are small physically.

They could add two void years to Cousins deal to lower his cap hit in 2022 and take dead money hits in 2023 & 2024.

But that still does not address who would be next at QB.  

I would hate for them to wait until 2023 to try and find a QB.

That is who we ended up with Ponder.

I agree with you. These are all very compelling reasons why drafting a young QB or looking for other options make sense. I hope the Vikings do that.
The reason they probably won't are also compelling. The QBs available are either 1- mostly unattainable and unknown (the top rookies) or 2- worse than Kirk.

The only exception to these is Deshaun Watson, and he will be EXPENSIVE. Plus, there's no guarantee the Texans would want Kirk back in return. They probably wouldn't. So that then becomes really hard to work something out.
For these reasons the Vikings are stuck with Kirk unless something falls into their laps. We just have to hope both Kirk and the team keep getting better I guess, and then maybe his extension in 2 years will be more palatable when it happens.