Vikings Getting Calls On Kyle Rudolph

why did I wake up this morning?

Let him go, he deserves that chance and frankly he, like Harry will always be a Viking

I can't imagine they'd get much for him, but every pick helps. 

he certainly deserves to hear the teams and have a say.  In a season like this  at this point in his career he's earned his shot to go oiut on his own terms.

I'm torn. Harrison and Rudy (and to a lesser extent Barr) are guys that have been here for a long time and been great on and off the field. I wish for them to experience success, but I'm saddened that it likely won't be here. Ugh. What a shit show of a year.

Rudy makes a lot of sense. He'll be 31 in a couple of weeks, he's got a big contract, an emerging player behind him, and he's still worth something. 

I think we have to ask ourselves how big of a rebuild are we
looking at?  Are we going to try and be
competitive next year and stretch the window of the players we have or do we
need to dump salaries to make room for another run?  I think we could be playoff competitive with
minor changes, but I just don’t see us being SB competitive.

I think we have to draft Cousins replacement this draft.  If Zimmers history holds true, we’ll probably
never get this good of a draft pick again. 
I think we’ll have to start getting rid of the midlevel performers
getting paid a bunch.  Barr has to be cut
for cap relief.  Rudolph with needs to be
restructured to something like $6M a year or moved.  Harris is too good for us to pay a second
safety.  Reiff?  I think Cleveland was a mistake, not because
he sucks or anything, but because he doesn’t really upgrade the unit, he’s just
cap relief.  Now that we have him, we
need to figure out if he can play tackle. 
I just really don’t want to go into the offseason with 3 question marks
on the OLine if we cut Reiff without seeing Cleveland at OT or potentially
seeing Reiff at G.  (and it’ll probably
help us on the Tank for … campaign) and taking a step backwards on OLine really
hamstrings our next year or two considering Rick is on the slow plan of
replacing all our lineman, one per year with rookies not meant to start for a
year.

I’m waffling on Cousins. 
I don’t think he’s the guy, but Rick screwed up his extension so bad
that getting rid of him is so painful.  I
can see both sides of cutting him immediately and waiting a bit to cut him.

@"medaille" said: I think we have to ask ourselves how big of a rebuild are we looking at?  Are we going to try and be competitive next year and stretch the window of the players we have or do we need to dump salaries to make room for another run?  I think we could be playoff competitive with minor changes, but I just don’t see us being SB competitive.

I think we have to draft Cousins replacement this draft.  If Zimmers history holds true, we’ll probably
never get this good of a draft pick again. 
I think we’ll have to start getting rid of the midlevel performers
getting paid a bunch.  Barr has to be cut
for cap relief.  Rudolph with needs to be
restructured to something like $6M a year or moved.  Harris is too good for us to pay a second
safety.  Reiff?  I think Cleveland was a mistake, not because
he sucks or anything, but because he doesn’t really upgrade the unit, he’s just
cap relief.  Now that we have him, we
need to figure out if he can play tackle. 
I just really don’t want to go into the offseason with 3 question marks
on the OLine if we cut Reiff without seeing Cleveland at OT or potentially
seeing Reiff at G.  (and it’ll probably
help us on the Tank for … campaign) and taking a step backwards on OLine really
hamstrings our next year or two considering Rick is on the slow plan of
replacing all our lineman, one per year with rookies not meant to start for a
year.

I’m waffling on Cousins. 
I don’t think he’s the guy, but Rick screwed up his extension so bad
that getting rid of him is so painful.  I
can see both sides of cutting him immediately and waiting a bit to cut him.

if you were to ask me your question..... my answer is simple,  are we a fanbase that is hungry for a playoff appearance or starving for a superbowl?  granted you cant get a SB without the playoffs,  but we all know that there are teams that are just not going to get it done,  i felt that way last year and was frustrated once again to get to the waters edge and know that we didnt have the boat to get across that big water.  I knew this year was a throw away clear back in late march with the offseason  we had and the prospect of having to start a bunch of new players at to many key positions.

IMO any vet that is 30 or over at the start of next season needs to be approached about moving on,  and they need to get it honestly,  this is a team that is shooting for 2022,  if they want to stay they will be asked to make sacrifices,  if they want to go they will be given every effort to make sure they end up in a place that will work for them.  i am tired of the little patch jobs,  lets build a new team from the ground up... or the lines out.

I think our approach now has a lot to do with what management thinks about Zimmer. They did not fire him Monday, so I think he's here until the end of the season. BUT - I do think they may have already decided whether he will return in 2021. If they have decided on a "Big" rebuild, I don't think he'll stick around, and I could picture him staying to see his team through this bad season and then retire.

• Barr: if we cut him this offseason, we get something like a $10M cap hit. I see him as a restructure target. He has vastly underperformed his salary. If Zimmer stays, he will likely want to keep Barr, a favorite, here. If not, I wouldn't be surprised to see a new staff try him at rush OLB in a 3-4 defense. I'm not sure he can be a great pass rusher even in that scheme but it does seem like people around the NFL have believed that would be his best fit.
• Smith: I think he stays if Zimmer is going to be back. But I think his fate is also dependent on Ant Harris. If they can trade Harris, would they want to lose both safeties? Who would start - Metellus and ?? I also don't think Smith would bring much in trade. How would people feel if one of the best DBs in the history of this team leaves for a 5th-round pick??
  
• Ant Harris: He will be a free agent and likely to leave. But other teams will consider him a 10-game rental, so again, I bet he would bring just a modest pick. If he leaves after this season and signs a big contract, we might get a better comp pick for him than what we get in trade.

Two things I would like to see the Vikings do:1. Move Brian O'Neill to LT. See if he can play there. That may mean trading Reiff or moving him to OG or somewhere for the rest of this season. And try Oli Udoh at RT.
2. Start Irv Smith full-time. Again, if they can move Rudolph, do so, but elevate Smith regardless.

Rudolph is massively overrated.  He is good for about 40 to 50 catches per year, 500 yards, and 5 or 6 TDs on average.  He is off the a very slow start this year and may stat pad later in meaningless games.  In 2012 he was a Pro Bowl replacement and in 2017 he was a replacement again.  Never voted originally.

Spielman really messed up the TE situation in 2019.

You don't spend a 2nd round pick on a TE and then give your current TE a sizable raise.  Well, most teams don't.  The Eagles signed Ertz to a 5 year 42.5 mil extension in Jan of 2016.  They drafted Dallas Goedert in the 2nd round of 2018.  The Rams drafted Gerald Everett in the 2nd round in 2017.  They gave Tyler Higbee a 4 year 29 mil extension in Sept of 2019.  

The Vikings drafted Smith in the 2nd round of 2019 and then gave Rudolph a 4 year 36 mil extension in June of 2019.  Incredibly stupid.

What other team spends a high draft pick on a TE and then immediately gives their current TE a sizable raise?  Freaking unbelievable.

@"MarkSP18" said: Rudolph is massively overrated.  He is good for about 40 to 50 catches per year, 500 yards, and 5 or 6 TDs on average.  He is off the a very slow start this year and may stat pad later in meaningless games.  In 2012 he was a Pro Bowl replacement and in 2017 he was a replacement again.  Never voted originally.

Spielman really messed up the TE situation in 2019.

You don't spend a 2nd round pick on a TE and then give your current TE a sizable raise.  Well, most teams don't.  The Eagles signed Ertz to a 5 year 42.5 mil extension in Jan of 2016.  They drafted Dallas Goedert in the 2nd round of 2018.  The Rams drafted Gerald Everett in the 2nd round in 2017.  They gave Tyler Higbee a 4 year 29 mil extension in Sept of 2019.  

The Vikings drafted Smith in the 2nd round of 2019 and then gave Rudolph a 4 year 36 mil extension in June of 2019.  Incredibly stupid.

What other team spends a high draft pick on a TE and then immediately gives their current TE a sizable raise?  Freaking unbelievable.

Teams that intend on making a 2 TE set a major part of their offense.

love Rudy and Smith.  Tough to see them traded

@"PSBLAKE" said: love Rudy and Smith.  Tough to see them traded

Me too...

We've all watched enough football to know they'd be most impactful (and rewarded as players) playing on a contender at this point in their careers.

This year is all about next year and beyond. They wont be part of that. 

I am looking for more than playoffs. I want to get to the big game. Take those calls and get some picks. 

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"MarkSP18" said: Rudolph is massively overrated.  He is good for about 40 to 50 catches per year, 500 yards, and 5 or 6 TDs on average.  He is off the a very slow start this year and may stat pad later in meaningless games.  In 2012 he was a Pro Bowl replacement and in 2017 he was a replacement again.  Never voted originally.

Spielman really messed up the TE situation in 2019.

You don't spend a 2nd round pick on a TE and then give your current TE a sizable raise.  Well, most teams don't.  The Eagles signed Ertz to a 5 year 42.5 mil extension in Jan of 2016.  They drafted Dallas Goedert in the 2nd round of 2018.  The Rams drafted Gerald Everett in the 2nd round in 2017.  They gave Tyler Higbee a 4 year 29 mil extension in Sept of 2019.  

The Vikings drafted Smith in the 2nd round of 2019 and then gave Rudolph a 4 year 36 mil extension in June of 2019.  Incredibly stupid.

What other team spends a high draft pick on a TE and then immediately gives their current TE a sizable raise?  Freaking unbelievable.

Teams that intend on making a 2 TE set a major part of their offense.

@MarkSP18 said: It was a bad extension and they'll eventually eat some dead cap space for the mediocre production they get from Rudolph.

Nothing mediocre about his ability to catch. Did you not see his one handed grab against the Saints to give the Vikings a playoff win in the back off the end zone when he was fully covered?

It's not Rudy's fault he doesn't get the targets he once did.

I'm not sure about the dead cap money comment either,... because I think Rudy has a few teams interested in him if the Vikings want to unload him for a late round pick.

What is his trade value? I think it will be based on supply and demand. In a perfect world, Spielman will work a couple of team for the best draft pick right up to the trade deadline.  

RS will get an offer for a 3rd from one team and a 4th from another then he will say how about a 5th and 6th instead.  

@"Carl Knowles" said: @MarkSP18 said: It was a bad extension and they'll eventually eat some dead cap space for the mediocre production they get from Rudolph. Nothing mediocre about his ability to catch. Did you not see his one handed grab against the Saints to give the Vikings a playoff win in the back off the end zone when he was fully covered?

It's not Rudy's fault he doesn't get the targets he once did.

I'm not sure about the dead cap money comment either,... because I think Rudy has a few teams interested in him if the Vikings want to unload him for a late round pick.

What is his trade value? I think it will be based on supply and demand. In a perfect world, Spielman will work a couple of team for the best draft pick right up to the trade deadline.  

That is the thing that blinds people.  Rudy does have good hands and is capable of pulling off one amazing catch a year.

But just like with defenders getting interceptions (Harris comes to mind), people get enamored with the one thing and do not see the whole package.

If the Vikings trade him now or after the season, they will take a 4.35 mil dead money cap hit.  They would save 5.1 mil though.

They prorated his signing bonus over 5 seasons (1.45 mil per season) and he would have 3 seasons left on his deal. 

He wont see the entire deal as he turns 31 in a couple of weeks.

The fact is that there are no other teams in the NFL that drafted TE in the 2nd round and then IMMEDIATELY gave their current TE a sizable extension.

Only one team employed this strategy.

the Vikings have to shed Salary period.  They might as well get something for it.  

@"MarkSP18" said:

@"Carl Knowles" said: @MarkSP18 said: It was a bad extension and they'll eventually eat some dead cap space for the mediocre production they get from Rudolph. Nothing mediocre about his ability to catch. Did you not see his one handed grab against the Saints to give the Vikings a playoff win in the back off the end zone when he was fully covered?

It's not Rudy's fault he doesn't get the targets he once did.

I'm not sure about the dead cap money comment either,... because I think Rudy has a few teams interested in him if the Vikings want to unload him for a late round pick.

What is his trade value? I think it will be based on supply and demand. In a perfect world, Spielman will work a couple of team for the best draft pick right up to the trade deadline.  

That is the thing that blinds people.  Rudy does have good hands and is capable of pulling off one amazing catch a year.

But just like with defenders getting interceptions (Harris comes to mind), people get enamored with the one thing and do not see the whole package.

If the Vikings trade him now or after the season, they will take a 4.35 mil dead money cap hit.  They would save 5.1 mil though.

They prorated his signing bonus over 5 seasons (1.45 mil per season) and he would have 3 seasons left on his deal. 

He wont see the entire deal as he turns 31 in a couple of weeks.

The fact is that there are no other teams in the NFL that drafted TE in the 2nd round and then IMMEDIATELY gave their current TE a sizable extension.

Only one team employed this strategy.