Vikings need to draft offensive linemen

I would say our DT needs are just as high and crucial to the respective units success as OL.   not being stout in the middle leads to way to many unfavorable down and distance situations.  2nd and 5 or less is a killer and we were in those situations far far to often last year.  This team needs to get back to winning on first down to make 2nd and 3rd down much more favorable and they cant do that without a strong DT tandem. 

The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

Did I just stumble on a posting from spring 2019? Or 2018? Or 2017, 16, 15, 14, 13, 12, 11??
An OL "pipeline" has been lacking for a decade. But we're going to pick a DT at 22 and a CB at 25 because "we're a defensive team", a WR in the 2nd and in the 3rd they will add an offensive lineman that Spielman is shocked did not get picked in round 1.

I’m with Jimmy. I think DT is the number 1 need on the team. In particular a disruptive penetrating speed guy. One thing this team has missed is that pocket wrecker. You want to make life difficult for Aaron Rogers, get that guy to fill that spot. I don’t care how good a QB is, the penetrating DT is an absolute nightmare, especially if you have speed and length at the end positions.

Give me a first round of Matos at DE and Blacklock at DT.  Trenches need to be rebuilt, I was bummed we didn’t go after Shelton for $4 million a year as a run stopper.  Matos, Blacklock, Hunter, return of Griff playing in and out, Fedi, Watts, Johnson, Holmes, hopefully we can  develop a player or two out of those 4.

Throw in a OG, OT, WR, CB with picks from rounds 2-4

I think we have our OL plus a Tier 3 FA assembled, I just think the lineup needs to shifted a bit

ONeil-Reiff-Bradburry-Klein-Udoh
or
Reiff-Collins-Bradbury-Klein-ONeil

Elf is a back up G/C
Udoh is a back up T
Samia is a back up G
Tier 3 FA (Leary, Boehm, Garcia)

Addressing either line is definitely the starting point. Grabbing a guy like Haeg opens up the draft a bit.

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

in fairness... no other position has a greater need than OL in terms of number of players on the field at one time,  as well as the impact they can have (good or bad) on the overall play of the rest of their group.   Obviously DL would be next.   I know the draft is 7 rounds,  but honestly I dont really count on much after the 3rd round,  4th has been good to the team for DEs, but 5th and later is such a crap shoot they are really just guessing at that point IMO.   So we have 3 OL drafted in that last 3 years with one being what appears to be a bust in Elf,  a homerun in ONeill,  and the jury is still out on Bradberry.   Still leaves at least 2 holes which we may have covered with Samia,  but again we cant count on that happening so I think we need to be looking in the first 3 picks to add a OT/OG to compete with Reiff, Samia, and a mid level FA that could plug in at OG like Kline did last year.  

and to answer your question... they should be drafting OL in the first 4 rounds every year,  same with DL and QB IMO until the roster is loaded at those 3 spots.  Use the cap savings at those positions by using guys on lower contracts to open up the purse strings for the skill players.  

Going back 2 off-seasons or even to just last off-season, there needs to be an expectation that it takes time to build an O-line. You can't just plug 5 new guys in and start up the engine. 

But I agree they still need to add talent and I don't have any doubt they will. But you can't become so narrowly focused on the O-line you start ignoring the D-line or Secondary. There is a balance or you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul and you're back to having the same issue at a different position group. 

As of today I think you have O'Neill & Bradbury as long-term cornerstones with the former needing a new deal next off-season. So they'll find some cost control at OT this year I'd imagine, its how the Vikings roll. Guard is up for debate. They valued Bradbury as a premium draft pick but they haven't consistently shown that they want to spend premium assets on guards. 

@"Geoff Nichols" said: Going back 2 off-seasons or even to just last off-season, there needs to be an expectation that it takes time to build an O-line. You can't just plug 5 new guys in and start up the engine. 

But I agree they still need to add talent and I don't have any doubt they will. But you can't become so narrowly focused on the O-line you start ignoring the D-line or Secondary. There is a balance or you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul and you're back to having the same issue at a different position group. 

As of today I think you have O'Neill & Bradbury as long-term cornerstones with the former needing a new deal next off-season. So they'll find some cost control at OT this year I'd imagine, its how the Vikings roll. Guard is up for debate. They valued Bradbury as a premium draft pick but they haven't consistently shown that they want to spend premium assets on guards. 

thats kind of why they are where they are at the last couple years... our interior OL play has been horrible and it starts with the play on either side of the C.

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

Considering that you have to have 5 starters... and at least 2 serviceable back-ups... I don't think it is unreasonable to spend put alot of attention into the position, especially since we're weak there.  There's only 1 QB... 1 HB... 2-3 WRs... 1-2 TEs... 2 CBs... 2 Safeties... and 3 (at most) LBs.  We rotate DL.  But we need 5 starters on the OL. 

7 out of 31 = 23%
5 starters out of 22 = 23%

Seems about right.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said: Going back 2 off-seasons or even to just last off-season, there needs to be an expectation that it takes time to build an O-line. You can't just plug 5 new guys in and start up the engine. 

But I agree they still need to add talent and I don't have any doubt they will. But you can't become so narrowly focused on the O-line you start ignoring the D-line or Secondary. There is a balance or you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul and you're back to having the same issue at a different position group. 

As of today I think you have O'Neill & Bradbury as long-term cornerstones with the former needing a new deal next off-season. So they'll find some cost control at OT this year I'd imagine, its how the Vikings roll. Guard is up for debate. They valued Bradbury as a premium draft pick but they haven't consistently shown that they want to spend premium assets on guards. 

thats kind of why they are where they are at the last couple years... our interior OL play has been horrible and it starts with the play on either side of the C.

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said: Going back 2 off-seasons or even to just last off-season, there needs to be an expectation that it takes time to build an O-line. You can't just plug 5 new guys in and start up the engine. 

But I agree they still need to add talent and I don't have any doubt they will. But you can't become so narrowly focused on the O-line you start ignoring the D-line or Secondary. There is a balance or you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul and you're back to having the same issue at a different position group. 

As of today I think you have O'Neill & Bradbury as long-term cornerstones with the former needing a new deal next off-season. So they'll find some cost control at OT this year I'd imagine, its how the Vikings roll. Guard is up for debate. They valued Bradbury as a premium draft pick but they haven't consistently shown that they want to spend premium assets on guards. 

thats kind of why they are where they are at the last couple years... our interior OL play has been horrible and it starts with the play on either side of the C.

A lot of teams take this approach to some success. 49ers are a good example of it. 

I have a difficult time understanding why the Vikes have, rather recently, struggled in keeping 5 quality OL starters.  Looking at some of our better years, we had some tremendous guards and tackles and have had some legendary centers.  But now years of mediocrity and inconsistent play have, IMHO, crippled our seasons and have limited some of our better offensive weapons.  

I understand that having 5 All-Pro linemen is not realistic or affordable, but to Pumpf's point, I hate to see us settle at arguably the most critical point of the offense.  Watching KC getting mauled last year with Elf playing as if on roller skates is frightening.  The Cowboys historic years and more recently the Patriots golden era saw great depth on those O lines.  I long for that consistency with the Vikes.

@"pumpf" said:

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

Considering that you have to have 5 starters... and at least 2 serviceable back-ups... I don't think it is unreasonable to spend put alot of attention into the position, especially since we're weak there.  There's only 1 QB... 1 HB... 2-3 WRs... 1-2 TEs... 2 CBs... 2 Safeties... and 3 (at most) LBs.  We rotate DL.  But we need 5 starters on the OL. 

7 out of 31 = 23%
5 starters out of 22 = 23%

Seems about right.

Vikings need to draft offensive linemen

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

But before 2017, the Vikings drafted 12 OL in 7 years, and only 1, Matt Kalil, was picked in the first 3 rounds. For 5 starting positions, that's extremely low. Some years the team only picked one guy (Willie Beavers 2016, David Yankey 2014). Above all: not a single offensive lineman the Vikings drafted (or any UDFA) prior to 2017 is still on the roster.

It's good that there have been more draft picks recently, but the combination of inattention and poor scouting the Vikings had with OL doesn't get fixed quickly. It's going to take OVERemphasizing it for a few years. The last - I think the only - lineman Spielman picked after the 3rd round who became a starter here was Brandon Fusco, so how confident are we that Samia, Udoh, and maybe some linemen picked with the extra 5th- and 6th-rounders from the Diggs trade will make any difference?

@"Jor-El" said:

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

But before 2017, the Vikings drafted 12 OL in 7 years, and only 1, Matt Kalil, was picked in the first 3 rounds. For 5 starting positions, that's extremely low. Some years the team only picked one guy (Willie Beavers 2016, David Yankey 2014). Above all: not a single offensive lineman the Vikings drafted (or any UDFA) prior to 2017 is still on the roster.

It's good that there have been more draft picks recently, but the combination of inattention and poor scouting the Vikings had with OL doesn't get fixed quickly. It's going to take OVERemphasizing it for a few years. The last - I think the only - lineman Spielman picked after the 3rd round who became a starter here was Brandon Fusco, so how confident are we that Samia, Udoh, and maybe some linemen picked with the extra 5th- and 6th-rounders from the Diggs trade will make any difference?

@"FSUVike" said:

@"Jor-El" said:

@"silverjoel" said: The Vikings have drafted 7 OL in the last 3 years (7 out of 31 picks, more than any position group), including one with one of their top two picks each year.  They've also brought in like five OL by FA or trade (I'm guessing again the most).  What more do you want them to do?  They'll probably draft another three this year and bring in at least one FA, is that going to be enough?

But before 2017, the Vikings drafted 12 OL in 7 years, and only 1, Matt Kalil, was picked in the first 3 rounds. For 5 starting positions, that's extremely low. Some years the team only picked one guy (Willie Beavers 2016, David Yankey 2014). Above all: not a single offensive lineman the Vikings drafted (or any UDFA) prior to 2017 is still on the roster.

It's good that there have been more draft picks recently, but the combination of inattention and poor scouting the Vikings had with OL doesn't get fixed quickly. It's going to take OVERemphasizing it for a few years. The last - I think the only - lineman Spielman picked after the 3rd round who became a starter here was Brandon Fusco, so how confident are we that Samia, Udoh, and maybe some linemen picked with the extra 5th- and 6th-rounders from the Diggs trade will make any difference?

Gonna push back on last year's picks. Rick Dennison and Gary Kubiak had input on those picks, same as with Bradbury. And signing Kline and Dozier.

And though not a huge sample size. Samia and Udoh players the entire 16th game, against the big bads from Chicago. 

They are clearly not of the same ilk as Clemmings or Yankey/Beaver.

Man it would be great if somehow Udoh could be the swing tackle this year. Not sure if he's there yet.