Posts: 8
Threads: 8
Joined: Jul 2017
Reputation:
0
No offense to anyone who has a different opinion. I mean we are all Vikings fans and we will win and lose together no matter what we think.
But what is wrong with the defense?
Coaching seems to be the superficial answer to the question. And I agree that coaching could be the answer. But is it all of the answer?
Is it scheme?
I would have to say there is a strong argument against that, considering this team had an extremely inept defense last year with a different coach in a different scheme, with many of the same players. This point can be debated all you want, but neither defense was close to being a championship defense.
It would be nice if it were simply coaching or scheme, but it isn't just that. It's coaching, scheme, and a lack of talent. It's pretty hard to watch the defenses remaining in the playoffs and not recognize the Vikings lack of talent on defense.
Kwesi and KOC needs to figure out how to get a defense in place that is top 10 or 15, or it won't matter how good KOC is at offensive football.
I see a lot of posters who think we have talent on defense, but not the right coaching or scheme. I'm not one of them.
This is just my opinion and I don't know shit, but I would like to know your opinion.
I’ll start FWIW -
I was fortunate enough to have two days coaching training with Scott Peters and a program he called “Tip of the Spear”. We brought him in to work with our HS linemen.
I also had my son who was younger in the groups / getting trained in his program.
He now coaches for the Browns, who now, arguably have the best O line in the NFL.
Everything starts up front.
Great lineman on EITHER side, knows the techniques on the opposite side of the ball.
As an OL coach, we are going to hold on every play, but if my hands are inside your frame, my elbows in, and I keep my pads parallel to my opponent, I wont get called...
but I digress...
Alignment, Assignment & personnel, and HEART
Personally I prefer a 4-3. HOWEVER - schematically, against some teams you need to go 3-4 & assign a rover or spy (QBs who are run threats) Ideally, DE’s contain / set the edge / on pass, close the pocket. The front four need to be responsible for their gap, and they must have speed, hands / feet and technique and a “repertore” in order to be effective - Fatty on Fatty doesnt work in the pro’s, if your youre not fast, and tenacious then take a seat. Dont engage - crossbar down, blow high hand up, but get the OL hands OFF, and RUN.
LBs personally I value instinct - and again closing speed, play downhill, and know where the ball is going before it goes there. LBs and DBs need to TACKLE, not hit., let me be clear. TACKLE. Helmet to the hip, wrap and take down. I am so sick of watching guys try and “deliver a shot” and the ball carrier skips merrily away.
DBs need quick hips, cant get beat deep, and should be selfLESS, stay on your mans hip, know that WRs arms will go up late, so get your head around early. One arm is longer than two- so - knock that shit down, instead of trying for an INT. (selfless v.selfish).
ATTACK - DONT react to what the offense is doing, dictate how your defense will play each down. Twist, stunt, creative blitz packages, rush 2 / drop 2, safety / corner blitz. If the QB becomes more concerned with what look the D is showing, it takes them out of THEIR game plan.
find players that go 90 mph with their hair on fire. I value technique, speed, motor, instinct and tenacity over how many reps on the bench press, or their deadlift numbers. The combine to me is a circus. Watch film, and remember that many of the qualities you look for in a player are not always measured by a time or weight.
Quote: @jargomcfargo said:
No offense to anyone who has a different opinion. I mean we are all Vikings fans and we will win and lose together no matter what we think.
But what is wrong with the defense?
Coaching seems to be the superficial answer to the question. And I agree that coaching could be the answer. But is it all of the answer?
Is it scheme?
I would have to say there is a strong argument against that, considering this team had an extremely inept defense last year with a different coach in a different scheme, with many of the same players. This point can be debated all you want, but neither defense was close to being a championship defense.
It would be nice if it were simply coaching or scheme, but it isn't just that. It's coaching, scheme, and a lack of talent. It's pretty hard to watch the defenses remaining in the playoffs and not recognize the Vikings lack of talent on defense.
Kwesi and KOC needs to figure out how to get a defense in place that is top 10 or 15, or it won't matter how good KOC is at offensive football.
I see a lot of posters who think we have talent on defense, but not the right coaching or scheme. I'm not one of them.
This is just my opinion and I don't know shit, but I would like to know your opinion.
It's a mix of talent, scheme, coaching, and execution. It was mentioned several times by National Media watching the Vikings vs. the Giants that we had players missing assignments, out of position, some playing zone while others were playing man on the same play, etc. The lack of talent has been building up for several years with poor drafts on the defensive side of the ball. Combine that with bad coaching, bad scheme, and poor execution and you have what have. Dysfunction.
Quote: @jargomcfargo said:
No offense to anyone who has a different opinion. I mean we are all Vikings fans and we will win and lose together no matter what we think.
But what is wrong with the defense?
Coaching seems to be the superficial answer to the question. And I agree that coaching could be the answer. But is it all of the answer?
Is it scheme?
I would have to say there is a strong argument against that, considering this team had an extremely inept defense last year with a different coach in a different scheme, with many of the same players. This point can be debated all you want, but neither defense was close to being a championship defense.
It would be nice if it were simply coaching or scheme, but it isn't just that. It's coaching, scheme, and a lack of talent. It's pretty hard to watch the defenses remaining in the playoffs and not recognize the Vikings lack of talent on defense.
Kwesi and KOC needs to figure out how to get a defense in place that is top 10 or 15, or it won't matter how good KOC is at offensive football.
I see a lot of posters who think we have talent on defense, but not the right coaching or scheme. I'm not one of them.
This is just my opinion and I don't know shit, but I would like to know your opinion.
Watch this. If a youtuber can figure it out over cocktails youre damn right the nfl coaches knew what was going on. Its players, but _onatell was BAD.
https://youtu.be/IAj_6eum1Kw
Quote: @AGRforever said:
youtu.be/IAj_6eum1Kw
Thanks for posting this.
I really found the Giants game sobering as you could see pre-snap that the defense seemed unsure about assignments. It was really depressing.
It is making me think that losing Barr may have been much more harmful than I previously thought. Barr used to receive the defensive signals and act as the QB for the defense. I thought for sure that Harry would take on and succeed at this role but it really felt, in game 18 of the season, that there was no real QB on defense making everyone line up property. Now, watching this video, reinforced that view.
While we're talking D coordinators, will someone go and get me a Micah Parsons for our D please?
Quote: @VikingOracle said:
@ AGRforever said:
youtu.be/IAj_6eum1Kw
Thanks for posting this.
I really found the Giants game sobering as you could see pre-snap that the defense seemed unsure about assignments. It was really depressing.
It is making me think that losing Barr may have been much more harmful than I previously thought. Barr used to receive the defensive signals and act as the QB for the defense. I thought for sure that Harry would take on and succeed at this role but it really felt, in game 18 of the season, that there was no real QB on defense making everyone line up property. Now, watching this video, reinforced that view.
As good as EK was at his job, he doesn't seem like the right guy for the green dot. Too emotional.
As to the OP, the last 2 years of Zimmer's D was lack of talent at CB. And then it became a buy-in problem because of Zim's personality when things started to go south.
I thought early on this year was still a CB issue, but even with everyone back in the playoffs, our DC made no adjustments, had zero game plan.
Quote: @AGRforever said:
youtu.be/IAj_6eum1Kw
If I'm KOC, this is what I want from my DC interviews. A presentation showing what every offense in the NFL seemed to already know about our defense. That it was "hilariously bad" and a piece of cake to slice up for even the worst QBs. That Donatell's defense didn't just put our league-average players in a position to fail, but also our very good players. And then, of course, what he's going to do to fix it.
What's ridiculous in this video is that much of this film is taken late in the year, meaning we did absolutely nothing to fix a problem everyone recognized early on.
I think for me, the most fundamental problem is that the
coaches couldn’t get the players to understand what they were supposed to do on
any given play and get them playing fast.
There were far too many blown coverages and mistakes happening. The second biggest problem was the
scheme. I think our scheme was hamstrung
by our inability to execute properly, so instead of doing something that would
be more effective if executed properly, I think we chose to be more vanilla. The problem with being more vanilla is that
offenses can take advantage of that and their playcalling gets much better
because they know what you’re doing. Furthermore,
I think even if you’re vanilla, you should have enough base plays with enough
variety that the defense can confuse the offense and get stops sometimes. Lastly, we’re clearly short on talent in the
defense. I think we have more talent
than what we showed this year, to the point that we should have been able to
field a semi-functional defense, but we really do need to get better at all 3
levels.
|
