Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ Vikergirl said:
This is the make or break year for Captain Kirk. The OL is still a work in progress but he has to step up. He has to own his part by making some better decisions. He has to throw the ball away when necessary and get the ball out faster. If he wants a longer deal, the time is now to show what he can do. He had great stats, but he has to do more. The first half of the season was different than the second half of the season. If they somehow cobble together an average OL, it will be better. Plus he has time under his belt in the system. Hopefully the defense shows up too. But he needs to sustain the energy and not turtle up.
Does He? New OC... likley another new system for our O.
I think there will be some variation but they will keep some of the things that worked. Regardless it's his second year, he has built connections with his teammates and coaches, that should help him. If not, then he only has 1 year after that. Either way, he has to continue to grow and show his worth. I don't see the harm in adding a QB somehow but Captain Kirk is at the helm until further notice.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
I dont think the decision to go QB in the middle part of the draft is made by how they feel about Cousins, this should be dictated by how they feel about Sloter IMO... I the coaches dont think our project QB is going to pan out... they need to get a new project QB in the mix now.
Another option is instead of having a shitty backup like Siemian,
have two development guys going at the same time.
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I am not as convinced that cousins won't be resigned. Last seasons oline issues were not on him so imo until that is resolved it's really up in the air. I will say if they truly dont think Sloter has a future beyond scout team reps then they need to start thinking QB in even the 2nd or 3rd rounds so if they do move on from KC they have a young guy with a couple years of mentoring under his belt ready to step in instead of these journeyman retreads they try to squeeze a year out of here and there.
As of today if the Vikings had to make a decision on Cousins I would put my money on the front office opting to not resign him. Internally he hasn't been exactly what they thought. Doesn't mean that year two won't be better and change the narrative.
I'm as dumb about these things as the next guy... but I've got an opinion and a keyboard, so here goes:
I blame Zimmer. I have scant evidence to prove it, but I believe he tells his QBs to "not make mistakes"- and he drills that into them so hard (that's what she said) that they are afraid to throw to any receiver beyond the LOS who *might* be covered. Cousins got worse as the year went on. Why is that? I think it's that- when he made some mistakes (which he did)- he got reprimanded for it by Zimmer. Cousins, being a "dutiful" person, did what he was told: he stopped taking chances.
Of course, Zimmer would never admit that... just like he'd never admit that his big mouth is hurting our kickers (who are not mentally tough enough to be treated the way they are). He gets all his toys for his defense... and then expects his OC / QB to make beef wellington out of cow pies. Take the muzzle off of Cousins, let him do his thing. And THEN- if he fails- you've got one year to get his replacement ready.
Quote: @pumpf said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I am not as convinced that cousins won't be resigned. Last seasons oline issues were not on him so imo until that is resolved it's really up in the air. I will say if they truly dont think Sloter has a future beyond scout team reps then they need to start thinking QB in even the 2nd or 3rd rounds so if they do move on from KC they have a young guy with a couple years of mentoring under his belt ready to step in instead of these journeyman retreads they try to squeeze a year out of here and there.
As of today if the Vikings had to make a decision on Cousins I would put my money on the front office opting to not resign him. Internally he hasn't been exactly what they thought. Doesn't mean that year two won't be better and change the narrative.
I'm as dumb about these things as the next guy... but I've got an opinion and a keybso here goes:
I blame Zimmer. I have scant evidence to prove it, but I believe he tells his QBs to "not make mistakes"- and he drills that into them so hard (that's what she said) that they are afraid to throw to any receiver beyond the LOS who *might* be covered. Cousins got worse as the year went on. Why is that? I think it's that- when he made some mistakes (which he did)- he got reprimanded for it by Zimmer. Cousins, being a "dutiful" person, did what he was told: he stopped taking chances.
Of course, Zimmer would never admit that... just like he'd never admit that his big mouth is hurting our kickers (who are not mentally tough enough to be treated the way they are). He gets all his toys for his defense... and then expects his OC / QB to make beef wellington out of cow pies. Take the muzzle off of Cousins, let him do his thing. And THEN- if he fails- you've got one year to get his replacement ready.
My gut says there's absolutely some truth in this...One of Zimmer's blind spots has been how poorly the coaching, strategy and staff has been on the offensive side of the ball.
With Kubiak and crew in Eagan? I think there's finally enough "kahuna's and cred" to tell Mike to bug off and let us handle this side of things. In a respectful manner of course.
Quote: @Ralphie said:
@ HappyViking said:
@ Ralphie said:
I just wish elite QB's came with a flashing light on their heads that would make them easier to identify come scouting, combine, pro-days, etc.
It's easy to say team X needs to get a QB years ago. True, but looking at the draft classes for the past decade or so, how many "elite" QB's were there? By definition elite means rare. For every Rodgers how many Couch's, Manziel's, Carr's, Russell's, Harrington's, et al have come...stunk it up...and left the stage. I know everybody wants the next Mahomes and he'll probably have a good NFL career, but I don't think the Patriots were calling Brady elite when they drafted him. In Eli's case he's only won 2 Super Bowls so he should have been kicked to the curb years ago?
That the Vikes, even with Cousins entering year 2 of his deal, needs to prepare for "that day" is undeniable. But many QB's become very good NFL QB's by looking, listening and preparing for the day when they hand over the clipboard for the pigskin.
Day one starters are great and exciting...but very, very, very rare. Even Rodgers had to pay his dues before he hit the field. Maybe Sloter is that guy...maybe not. Thinking some guy in the 3rd round this year is going to be Johnny U might be a bit premature. Ask Josh Rosen.
I thought Rick finally had "his" guy when we drafted Teddy. What if the Vikes would've signed Teddy instead of spending $30Mil on Cousins? We were 8-7-1 last season with the "second best QB in Viking's history" stats Cousins gave us. I wonder if the win/loss record would've been much different with Teddy at Qb ? I do know our cap situation would be a hell of a lot better with Teddy at the helm, and we could still be looking for the next young QB to take over.
Did the Vikings spend all this money on Cousins only to find out he's not worth it after one season? It's quite possible, and RS had to be held accountable.
Happy, I was one of the many fans who thought that fateful August day in 2016 was dunbar for Teddy. That injury was something no GM could bank on. The die was cast and the team moved on with several other opting in these past 2 1/2 years that now seems infinitely longer.
Could Teddy have replicated Kirk's record? Maybe, but hindsight is always clearer...and cheaper. But just as Kirk was getting pounded thanks to our porous OL, it's just as likely Teddy could be in a wheelchair now.
The one thing we know about Teddy is he can run and move around in the pocket. We found out that Cousins scrambling and pocket awareness aren't his strong suits. Personally I don't think Teddy would've gotten killed any worse than Kirk did.
If it sounds like I'm down on Cousins, it's because it's true; I am. Yeah, if we surround him with the best OL, RBs, TEs, and WRs, he can be good enough to win. I wonder how many other NFL QBs could be plugged into that position and do well. My guess would be about 60% of them or more.
Look what Foles and Keenam did when they had blocking and nice playmakers helping them. I'm rooting for Cousins to play well, but I'll believe this team is a playoff contender when I see it.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
@ pumpf said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I am not as convinced that cousins won't be resigned. Last seasons oline issues were not on him so imo until that is resolved it's really up in the air. I will say if they truly dont think Sloter has a future beyond scout team reps then they need to start thinking QB in even the 2nd or 3rd rounds so if they do move on from KC they have a young guy with a couple years of mentoring under his belt ready to step in instead of these journeyman retreads they try to squeeze a year out of here and there.
As of today if the Vikings had to make a decision on Cousins I would put my money on the front office opting to not resign him. Internally he hasn't been exactly what they thought. Doesn't mean that year two won't be better and change the narrative.
I'm as dumb about these things as the next guy... but I've got an opinion and a keybso here goes:
I blame Zimmer. I have scant evidence to prove it, but I believe he tells his QBs to "not make mistakes"- and he drills that into them so hard (that's what she said) that they are afraid to throw to any receiver beyond the LOS who *might* be covered. Cousins got worse as the year went on. Why is that? I think it's that- when he made some mistakes (which he did)- he got reprimanded for it by Zimmer. Cousins, being a "dutiful" person, did what he was told: he stopped taking chances.
Of course, Zimmer would never admit that... just like he'd never admit that his big mouth is hurting our kickers (who are not mentally tough enough to be treated the way they are). He gets all his toys for his defense... and then expects his OC / QB to make beef wellington out of cow pies. Take the muzzle off of Cousins, let him do his thing. And THEN- if he fails- you've got one year to get his replacement ready.
My gut says there's absolutely some truth in this...One of Zimmer's blind spots has been how poorly the coaching, strategy and staff has been on the offensive side of the ball.
With Kubiak and crew in Eagan? I think there's finally enough "kahuna's and cred" to tell Mike to bug off and let us handle this side of things. In a respectful manner of course.
I think that is important. In the beginning, he kind of backed off the offense. When Norv came along, he waited before he got involved. I think he has to find a balance. Same goes for the defense. It's now or never for him to get that right.
I'd love for us to trade for Rosen or take a QB, but I do not think MN will do it.
RS and Zim know (or should know) this year is make or break. They will do everything they can to be good THIS year, and I don't blame them for that one bit. Plus, like someone already said, any potential new GM/Coach combo will want their own QB most likely. Not a 3rd rounder who the old regime was grooming.
I also still have faith that with a better O-line, KC can lead us to the playoffs and beyond.
So while I'd be excited to see us bring in a younger, more mobile QB, I don't see it happening.
Quote: @medaille said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I dont think the decision to go QB in the middle part of the draft is made by how they feel about Cousins, this should be dictated by how they feel about Sloter IMO... I the coaches dont think our project QB is going to pan out... they need to get a new project QB in the mix now.
Another option is instead of having a shitty backup like Siemian,
have two development guys going at the same time.
absolutely this... i am all for spending a high to mid round pick every year if necessary to have 3 quality QB option at various stages of development. IMO we should have 1. a quality starter 2. a guy with 2 years on the team that should be ready to move into the starters role if the need arises for what ever reason, and 3. a rookie that is coming in to get groomed to take over the #2 role in a year or 2 if either of the 1 or 2s move on/retire/ get injured/ start sucking/ get greedy....what ever the case may be. Our QB approach has only been marginally better than our approach to fixing the OL.
Quote: @medaille said:
@ ArizonaViking said:
The Vikings have got more pressing needs this year than a quarterback. Why bring in a rookie quarterback just to watch him get killed on the field?
? You bring in a rookie QB, so he can learn behind Cousins and take over when he's ready. No one would bring in a rookie QB to start day 1.
Exactly. Where did I say draft a rookie and start him, lol
Quote: @"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
I am not as convinced that cousins won't be resigned. Last seasons oline issues were not on him so imo until that is resolved it's really up in the air. I will say if they truly dont think Sloter has a future beyond scout team reps then they need to start thinking QB in even the 2nd or 3rd rounds so if they do move on from KC they have a young guy with a couple years of mentoring under his belt ready to step in instead of these journeyman retreads they try to squeeze a year out of here and there.
As of today if the Vikings had to make a decision on Cousins I would put my money on the front office opting to not resign him. Internally he hasn't been exactly what they thought. Doesn't mean that year two won't be better and change the narrative.
Agreed and hence the reason I started this thread. But I'll go one step further: I think its 100 percent solidified after this season in their minds (the front office) that Cousins won't be resigned. A Cousins-style QB is not the future of the NFL.
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