Quote: @minny65 said:
For me, most disappointing is Mike Zimmer.
This team showed no heart the whole season....and came out after the bye with even less heart in any big game.
Agreed. He is most responsible.
He did not have his team ready for the Bills, the Bears after two weeks prep time, and then made a drastic move of firing his young OC 14 games into the season to try to do what? I still have no idea.
When does it become the coaches fault? Isn't that where the buck stops?
He knew he wanted to have balance and run more this year and still decided to take Hughes with that first pick and then take one lineman in the 2nd and not take another lineman until the 6th round. In between he took a defensive end/tackle that did nothing, a tight end that may be OK, a kicker who got cut, and then that lineman who did not make the team and then was poached off the PS.
I mean, Zimmer had to know in his head that he wanted to run yet felt perfectly fine with Reiff, Easton, Elflein, Remmers, and presumably Hill before the draft. Easton and Elflein were still recovering from injuries too.
When Easton finally had to go to the IR on Aug 9th, here is what Zimmer said ...
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/24330814/nick-easton-minnesota-vikings-surgery-season-likely-over
"I know everybody's nervous about our offensive line but I like the
mentality of those guys," Zimmer said. "I like how they work. I'm around
them quite a bit. They're going to figure out a way to get it done.
Calm [down]. Tweet that. It's my new saying. We're going to get ["Tweet
that"] on the Mike Zimmer Foundation T-shirts. Tweet that."
We were suppose to calm down about the line because he liked the way they worked. How did that work out?
Not sure how you can blame any players besides the line and not sure you can blame them either because they probably should not have been relied upon as starters.
I am not saying Zimmer should be fired but he needs to stay out of the offense IMHO.
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ minny65 said:
For me, most disappointing is Mike Zimmer.
This team showed no heart the whole season....and came out after the bye with even less heart in any big game.
Agreed. He is most responsible.
He did not have his team ready for the Bills, the Bears after two weeks prep time, and then made a drastic move of firing his young OC 14 games into the season to try to do what? I still have no idea.
When does it become the coaches fault? Isn't that where the buck stops?
He knew he wanted to have balance and run more this year and still decided to take Hughes with that first pick and then take one lineman in the 2nd and not take another lineman until the 6th round. In between he took a defensive end/tackle that did nothing, a tight end that may be OK, a kicker who got cut, and then that lineman who did not make the team and then was poached off the PS.
I mean, Zimmer had to know in his head that he wanted to run yet felt perfectly fine with Reiff, Easton, Elflein, Remmers, and presumably Hill before the draft. Easton and Elflein were still recovering from injuries too.
When Easton finally had to go to the IR on Aug 9th, here is what Zimmer said ...
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/24330814/nick-easton-minnesota-vikings-surgery-season-likely-over
"I know everybody's nervous about our offensive line but I like the
mentality of those guys," Zimmer said. "I like how they work. I'm around
them quite a bit. They're going to figure out a way to get it done.
Calm [down]. Tweet that. It's my new saying. We're going to get ["Tweet
that"] on the Mike Zimmer Foundation T-shirts. Tweet that."
We were suppose to calm down about the line because he liked the way they worked. How did that work out?
Not sure how you can blame any players besides the line and not sure you can blame them either because they probably should not have been relied upon as starters.
I am not saying Zimmer should be fired but he needs to stay out of the offense IMHO.
Agree with most of what you said, but for the last. If a head coach needs to be kept away from one half the team because he has a negative impact on it, he shouldn't be the head coach. He's a defensive coordinator.
I'll say this, but it might not be quite under the definition of the thread, but IMO the O-line will only get so much better with Reiff kept at LT. I think he's a lesser than guy at the position and you need a better athlete, like O'Neill, at that spot. Move Reiff to RT like the Lions tried to do.
I find it hard to believe that anything is off the table as far as considerations to improve this unit.
Quote: @VikingOracle said:
I went with Linval -- he wasn't the same this year.
I got to go with LJ as well, his reason for being is to make it tough to run up the middle on this defense and he couldn't do that, also Richardson wasn't nearly as impactful as I had anticipated. I expected OL issues after all the injuries in preseason, and for that to affect what we could do on offense, but I didn't expect our DLine to be so inconsistent and ineffective.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ VikingOracle said:
I went with Linval -- he wasn't the same this year.
I got to go with LJ as well, his reason for being is to make it tough to run up the middle on this defense and he couldn't do that, also Richardson wasn't nearly as impactful as I had anticipated. I expected OL issues after all the injuries in preseason, and for that to affect what we could do on offense, but I didn't expect our DLine to be so inconsistent and ineffective.
I agree to an extent. Zimmer still is playing him too much IMO. Here are the snaps played this year for the DL ...
Player | Total Snaps | Def Snaps | Def Snap Pct | ST Snaps | ST Snap Pct
99-D.Hunter | 1023 | 877 | 84.4% | 146 | 32.7%
93-S.Richardson | 779 | 718 | 69.1% | 61 | 13.6%
98-L.Joseph | 721 | 669 | 64.4% | 52 | 11.6%
91-S.Weatherly | 652 | 523 | 50.3% | 129 | 28.9%
97-E.Griffen | 635 | 584 | 56.2% | 51 | 11.4%
96-T.Johnson | 368 | 342 | 32.9% | 26 | 5.8%
94-J.Johnson | 295 | 261 | 25.1% | 34 | 7.6%
92-J.Holmes | 58 | 58 | 5.6% | 0 | 0.0%
95-D.Parry | 58 | 50 | 4.8% | 8 | 1.8%
90-T.Bower | 56 | 53 | 5.1% | 3 | 0.7%
... Joseph played 664 snaps last year. He will be 31 next October so I think that they should lessen his snaps and get someone they trust to be his backup and let that person play more.
I guess Jaleel Johnson is the backup but I thought he was a 3 technique coming out of college. Not many scouting reports pegged him as a nose tackle or 1 technique.
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ VikingOracle said:
I went with Linval -- he wasn't the same this year.
I got to go with LJ as well, his reason for being is to make it tough to run up the middle on this defense and he couldn't do that, also Richardson wasn't nearly as impactful as I had anticipated. I expected OL issues after all the injuries in preseason, and for that to affect what we could do on offense, but I didn't expect our DLine to be so inconsistent and ineffective.
I agree to an extent. Zimmer still is playing him too much IMO. Here are the snaps played this year for the DL ...
Player | Total Snaps | Def Snaps | Def Snap Pct | ST Snaps | ST Snap Pct
99-D.Hunter | 1023 | 877 | 84.4% | 146 | 32.7%
93-S.Richardson | 779 | 718 | 69.1% | 61 | 13.6%
98-L.Joseph | 721 | 669 | 64.4% | 52 | 11.6%
91-S.Weatherly | 652 | 523 | 50.3% | 129 | 28.9%
97-E.Griffen | 635 | 584 | 56.2% | 51 | 11.4%
96-T.Johnson | 368 | 342 | 32.9% | 26 | 5.8%
94-J.Johnson | 295 | 261 | 25.1% | 34 | 7.6%
92-J.Holmes | 58 | 58 | 5.6% | 0 | 0.0%
95-D.Parry | 58 | 50 | 4.8% | 8 | 1.8%
90-T.Bower | 56 | 53 | 5.1% | 3 | 0.7%
... Joseph played 664 snaps last year. He will be 31 next October so I think that they should lessen his snaps and get someone they trust to be his backup and let that person play more.
I guess Jaleel Johnson is the backup but I thought he was a 3 technique coming out of college. Not many scouting reports pegged him as a nose tackle or 1 technique.
I think they are paying him to much to use him as a role player, if he is going to be making 10-13 million per year over the next few years, he needs to be able to play a lot of snaps, if he is only going to be out there for half the snaps, he really needs to take a pay cut so we can afford to put a quality player in his place.
Nobody has put it in this thread. XR went from probably the best CB in the leauge to average at best this year. Im not sure how he doesnt have more votes? Last year you could count on half the field being shut down and this allowed Smith to freelance and shift coverages etc. It made the entire team work last year. This year he was a major let down.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ VikingOracle said:
I went with Linval -- he wasn't the same this year.
I got to go with LJ as well, his reason for being is to make it tough to run up the middle on this defense and he couldn't do that, also Richardson wasn't nearly as impactful as I had anticipated. I expected OL issues after all the injuries in preseason, and for that to affect what we could do on offense, but I didn't expect our DLine to be so inconsistent and ineffective.
I agree to an extent. Zimmer still is playing him too much IMO. Here are the snaps played this year for the DL ...
Player | Total Snaps | Def Snaps | Def Snap Pct | ST Snaps | ST Snap Pct
99-D.Hunter | 1023 | 877 | 84.4% | 146 | 32.7%
93-S.Richardson | 779 | 718 | 69.1% | 61 | 13.6%
98-L.Joseph | 721 | 669 | 64.4% | 52 | 11.6%
91-S.Weatherly | 652 | 523 | 50.3% | 129 | 28.9%
97-E.Griffen | 635 | 584 | 56.2% | 51 | 11.4%
96-T.Johnson | 368 | 342 | 32.9% | 26 | 5.8%
94-J.Johnson | 295 | 261 | 25.1% | 34 | 7.6%
92-J.Holmes | 58 | 58 | 5.6% | 0 | 0.0%
95-D.Parry | 58 | 50 | 4.8% | 8 | 1.8%
90-T.Bower | 56 | 53 | 5.1% | 3 | 0.7%
... Joseph played 664 snaps last year. He will be 31 next October so I think that they should lessen his snaps and get someone they trust to be his backup and let that person play more.
I guess Jaleel Johnson is the backup but I thought he was a 3 technique coming out of college. Not many scouting reports pegged him as a nose tackle or 1 technique.
I think they are paying him to much to use him as a role player, if he is going to be making 10-13 million per year over the next few years, he needs to be able to play a lot of snaps, if he is only going to be out there for half the snaps, he really needs to take a pay cut so we can afford to put a quality player in his place.
Agreed. And that is why his contract is structured as it is because most older players with larger deals and declining play get that conversation from the GM about restructuring.
For me, knowing full well they need to address the offensive line, if Dexter Lawrence is there at #18 then from a salary cap perspective and talent perspective he could be a very good addition and the future nose for the Vikings.
Then, I would be super aggressive in the 2nd (i.e., trading up and using future picks if necessary) to go get the first offensive lineman. In the 3rd round I would repeat this formula if necessary.
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