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Thanks for sharing. As you say, it was good insight and a good read. Disagree with the "need to light a fire under Reiff" section, but that is a minor detail.
Gossett did play some Tackle at App state but I think it would be a reach claiming he could challenge for the starting RT spot. He has the power, just not sure he has the lateral quickness to deal with Speed rushers. I think he will be a solid RG prospect.
Quote: @greediron said:
Thanks for sharing. As you say, it was good insight and a good read. Disagree with the "need to light a fire under Reiff" section, but that is a minor detail.
Agree with this...he also said that Reiff had the worst year by far of his career this past season. Well, if that's true, then we can underline with big bold black sharpie how BAD Kalil has been for his whole career, because I sure thought Reiff was a decent upgrade over that slug.
This was the best part of the whole article and kind of sums up my thoughts on the draft...
"Bottom line, this draft does not give a sense of immediate gratification in terms of drafting a number of immediate starters, but the Vikings roster doesn’t have room for many of those anymore.
And that’s a good thing."
The best we could have hoped for was to get a Day 1 starter at RG or RT. Pretty much every other pick was going to strictly be a depth player as a rookie looking at our lineup. I think not having a 4th round pick from the Bradford trade hamstrung our ability to move up in the 2nd to get one of our targets. Honestly, O'Neill isn't a bad consolation prize... he's the most athletic OT in this entire draft and the NFL has plenty of former TEs that are top end starting LTs in the league. If he can get stronger this year and improve his technique, the Vikings may have a steal on their hands. I'm also intrigued by this new kicker... the more I read up on him, he not only has a monstrous leg, but he has a reputation as making big kicks in clutch moments.
Solid draft by the Vikings in my opinion. It's going to be a battle at the bottom end of our roster. There will be some good players cut again this year.
Quote: @prairieghost said:
@ greediron said:
Thanks for sharing. As you say, it was good insight and a good read. Disagree with the "need to light a fire under Reiff" section, but that is a minor detail.
Agree with this...he also said that Reiff had the worst year by far of his career this past season. Well, if that's true, then we can underline with big bold black sharpie how BAD Kalil has been for his whole career, because I sure thought Reiff was a decent upgrade over that slug.
To be fair, he said PFF rated him as having the worst season of his career. And PFF is garbage when it comes to rating the lines. Reiff was worth every penny at that position and really solidified the line with his attitude, work ethic and play.
Quote: @greediron said:
@ prairieghost said:
@ greediron said:
Thanks for sharing. As you say, it was good insight and a good read. Disagree with the "need to light a fire under Reiff" section, but that is a minor detail.
Agree with this...he also said that Reiff had the worst year by far of his career this past season. Well, if that's true, then we can underline with big bold black sharpie how BAD Kalil has been for his whole career, because I sure thought Reiff was a decent upgrade over that slug.
To be fair, he said PFF rated him as having the worst season of his career. And PFF is garbage when it comes to rating the lines. Reiff was worth every penny at that position and really solidified the line with his attitude, work ethic and play.
I am wondering why you think PFF grading lineman is garbage. Is it the article in Sporting news or the reprint at Yahoo news about the NFL lineman bitching? I really hope not. The linemans stance is that only lineman can grade lineman. They are speaking about grading technique and such. PFF isnt grading technique instead they grade RESULTS. They go through more to come up with an accurate grade than anyone else has. If you have a better plce to get lineman’s grades I would like to know.
Athlon Sports does a yearly review. In their review the grade out the top 20 at each position. In their lineman review they list the top 20 Centers, O Tackles and Guards. In 2017 do you know how many Vikings made the list? Zero. Not a single Vikings Offensive lineman is included in the top 20 at their position.
None of this is an absolute answer but It all fits pretty well with the fact that the Vikings offensive line has not been a strength for some time. I am not sure why anyone, especially a Vikings fan would deny it.
Quote: @Poiple said:
@ greediron said:
@ prairieghost said:
@ greediron said:
Thanks for sharing. As you say, it was good insight and a good read. Disagree with the "need to light a fire under Reiff" section, but that is a minor detail.
Agree with this...he also said that Reiff had the worst year by far of his career this past season. Well, if that's true, then we can underline with big bold black sharpie how BAD Kalil has been for his whole career, because I sure thought Reiff was a decent upgrade over that slug.
To be fair, he said PFF rated him as having the worst season of his career. And PFF is garbage when it comes to rating the lines. Reiff was worth every penny at that position and really solidified the line with his attitude, work ethic and play.
I am wondering why you think PFF grading lineman is garbage. Is it the article in Sporting news or the reprint at Yahoo news about the NFL lineman bitching? I really hope not. The linemans stance is that only lineman can grade lineman. They are speaking about grading technique and such. PFF isnt grading technique instead they grade RESULTS. They go through more to come up with an accurate grade than anyone else has. If you have a better plce to get lineman’s grades I would like to know.
Athlon Sports does a yearly review. In their review the grade out the top 20 at each position. In their lineman review they list the top 20 Centers, O Tackles and Guards. In 2017 do you know how many Vikings made the list? Zero. Not a single Vikings Offensive lineman is included in the top 20 at their position.
None of this is an absolute answer but It all fits pretty well with the fact that the Vikings offensive line has not been a strength for some time. I am not sure why anyone, especially a Vikings fan would deny it.
Lol, no it isn't a reprint of an article. It is about what PFF does. They grade results as you say. But with the offense and defensive lines, they don't know enough to grade accurately. They don't know the protections called, whose guy is whose. The lines work as a unit, not a bunch of individuals. It is like with WRs and QBs when there is a communication error. Who was at fault? Pretty much a guess for the guys at PFF. Now take that for every play.
It is pretty obvious when they rank Reiff as having the worst season of his career. Sez who? He struggled at detroit and was let walk. He was a rock for us in the first half of the season. I think as Elf got hurt and missed the Carolina game, then the LG issues started to build, our line struggled as a unit. But wasn't it RR that didn't allow a pressure through the first 6 or so games? Maybe that was according to PFF as well.
PFF is what it is. A tool to gauge how well the players perform. But when grading individuals on a unit like the O-Line, they aren't that accurate.
Quote: @Poiple said:
I am wondering why you think PFF grading lineman is garbage. Is it the article in Sporting news or the reprint at Yahoo news about the NFL lineman bitching? I really hope not. The linemans stance is that only lineman can grade lineman. They are speaking about grading technique and such. PFF isnt grading technique instead they grade RESULTS. They go through more to come up with an accurate grade than anyone else has. If you have a better plce to get lineman’s grades I would like to know.
Athlon Sports does a yearly review. In their review the grade out the top 20 at each position. In their lineman review they list the top 20 Centers, O Tackles and Guards. In 2017 do you know how many Vikings made the list? Zero. Not a single Vikings Offensive lineman is included in the top 20 at their position.
None of this is an absolute answer but It all fits pretty well with the fact that the Vikings offensive line has not been a strength for some time. I am not sure why anyone, especially a Vikings fan would deny it.
So what to make of all this ... considering the Vikings went 13-3 last year with that O line? Some possibilities:
1) the experts' grades are wrong;
2) the OL as a whole is better than the individual OL components;
3) you just do not need a good O line to do really well in the NFL.
I think (3) is clearly wrong. I assume you agree or you would not be so anxious about our O line. So is it (1) or (2)? Or maybe there are other possible explanations for our success last year:
4) the Vikings got really lucky last year despite the lack of a decent O line; or
5) Keenum, Murray, and McKinnon are so good they don't need a good O line to perform at a high level.
Quote: @dadevike said:
@ Poiple said:
I am wondering why you think PFF grading lineman is garbage. Is it the article in Sporting news or the reprint at Yahoo news about the NFL lineman bitching? I really hope not. The linemans stance is that only lineman can grade lineman. They are speaking about grading technique and such. PFF isnt grading technique instead they grade RESULTS. They go through more to come up with an accurate grade than anyone else has. If you have a better plce to get lineman’s grades I would like to know.
Athlon Sports does a yearly review. In their review the grade out the top 20 at each position. In their lineman review they list the top 20 Centers, O Tackles and Guards. In 2017 do you know how many Vikings made the list? Zero. Not a single Vikings Offensive lineman is included in the top 20 at their position.
None of this is an absolute answer but It all fits pretty well with the fact that the Vikings offensive line has not been a strength for some time. I am not sure why anyone, especially a Vikings fan would deny it.
So what to make of all this ... considering the Vikings went 13-3 last year with that O line? Some possibilities:
1) the experts' grades are wrong;
2) the OL as a whole is better than the individual OL components;
3) you just do not need a good O line to do really well in the NFL.
I think (3) is clearly wrong. I assume you agree or you would not be so anxious about our O line. So is it (1) or (2)? Or maybe there are other possible explanations for our success last year:
4) the Vikings got really lucky last year despite the lack of a decent O line; or
5) Keenum, Murray, and McKinnon are so good they don't need a good O line to perform at a high level.
6) O-line isn't a sexy position, so the effort given in grading them isn't what would be required to attain reliable accuracy.
6 b) the complexity of the unit and different schemes makes accurate grading very difficult
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