Quote: @Jor-El said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
Don't forget the name Connor Williams. They like him a lot.
Williams could be one of those "Dan Marino" picks - considered a top 10 player until his last season, then a setback, overanalyzed by scouts, and slipped in the draft to give some team a steal.
Question: if the Vikings picked Williams, who played only LT throughout college, would they move him to RT, or consider moving Reiff to the right side?
They'd put him at right tackle. It's not unusual for college left tackles to start out on the right in the NFL (Tyron Smith, Nate Solder), even if they project long term on the left.
And you don't move Reiff. You'd worsen both positions by doing that. Contrary to what many believe, he actually played better on the left in Detroit. And he had a helluva year last year.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ Jor-El said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
Don't forget the name Connor Williams. They like him a lot.
Williams could be one of those "Dan Marino" picks - considered a top 10 player until his last season, then a setback, overanalyzed by scouts, and slipped in the draft to give some team a steal.
Question: if the Vikings picked Williams, who played only LT throughout college, would they move him to RT, or consider moving Reiff to the right side?
They'd put him at right tackle. It's not unusual for college left tackles to start out on the right in the NFL (Tyron Smith, Nate Solder), even if they project long term on the left.
And you don't move Reiff. You'd worsen both positions by doing that. Contrary to what many believe, he actually played better on the left in Detroit. And he had a helluva year last year.
I do agree about Reiff, and know he was less effective when the Lions moved him to RT. It's more that I see some difficulty in projecting Williams to RT...true, many switch without trouble, but some struggle with it. It would be an easier projection if Williams had ever played on the right or been a swing tackle. But I'm probably just feeling skittish because of the challenges we had moving TJ Clemmings around...
Quote: @Jor-El said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Jor-El said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
Don't forget the name Connor Williams. They like him a lot.
Williams could be one of those "Dan Marino" picks - considered a top 10 player until his last season, then a setback, overanalyzed by scouts, and slipped in the draft to give some team a steal.
Question: if the Vikings picked Williams, who played only LT throughout college, would they move him to RT, or consider moving Reiff to the right side?
They'd put him at right tackle. It's not unusual for college left tackles to start out on the right in the NFL (Tyron Smith, Nate Solder), even if they project long term on the left.
And you don't move Reiff. You'd worsen both positions by doing that. Contrary to what many believe, he actually played better on the left in Detroit. And he had a helluva year last year.
I do agree about Reiff, and know he was less effective when the Lions moved him to RT. It's more that I see some difficulty in projecting Williams to RT...true, many switch without trouble, but some struggle with it. It would be an easier projection if Williams had ever played on the right or been a swing tackle. But I'm probably just feeling skittish because of the challenges we had moving TJ Clemmings around...
I don't think Clemmings' struggles were due to the side he was on. It's just not a big deal unless you switch them mid-career or switch them back and forth.
I don't know this for sure, I would love to find a stat on this, but I would bet that a clear majority of the right tackles starting in the NFL were left tackles in college.
That switching is why I don't know what to make of Hill yet. He was bouncing back and forth from the right side to the left side like a yo-yo. Did he look like a starter? No. But he's young, learning and can't get a solid run at any one position to master it. Seems like a lot of people are done with him already. You're not supposed to think about foot and hand placement during a game. There isn't time to do so. It's just supposed to be there on muscle memory from a bazzilion snaps. But when you start reversing footwork everything every other week, it's hard to establish that memory and things just fall out of sync. If Hill was told, just work on playing RT, we aren't moving you around anymore, I believe he's got the skills to compete. Being a young swing tackle has got to be one of the toughest jobs on the team, IMO.
Quote: @AllBS said:
That switching is why I don't know what to make of Hill yet. He was bouncing back and forth from the right side to the left side like a yo-yo. Did he look like a starter? No. But he's young, learning and can't get a solid run at any one position to master it. Seems like a lot of people are done with him already. You're not supposed to think about foot and hand placement during a game. There isn't time to do so. It's just supposed to be there on muscle memory from a bazzilion snaps. But when you start reversing footwork everything every other week, it's hard to establish that memory and things just fall out of sync. If Hill was told, just work on playing RT, we aren't moving you around anymore, I believe he's got the skills to compete. Being a young swing tackle has got to be one of the toughest jobs on the team, IMO.
Tend to agree that too many are not considering the fact that Hill can still improve. He's still very young. I don't think we should necessarily approach the draft counting on him, but he's a big strong guy with very long arms. I like his chances. This is a critical year for Hill in terms of his contract.
Quote: @AllBS said:
That switching is why I don't know what to make of Hill yet. He was bouncing back and forth from the right side to the left side like a yo-yo. Did he look like a starter? No. But he's young, learning and can't get a solid run at any one position to master it. Seems like a lot of people are done with him already. You're not supposed to think about foot and hand placement during a game. There isn't time to do so. It's just supposed to be there on muscle memory from a bazzilion snaps. But when you start reversing footwork everything every other week, it's hard to establish that memory and things just fall out of sync. If Hill was told, just work on playing RT, we aren't moving you around anymore, I believe he's got the skills to compete. Being a young swing tackle has got to be one of the toughest jobs on the team, IMO.
Hill has been a very good swing tackle and I think they'd prefer to keep him in that spot if they could. Of course he could surprise and compete for a starting spot but its somewhat invaluable to have a player you can plug in on either side of the line if anything happens in a game or during the course of the season.
But I wouldn't count out Hill developing further and becoming a future RT in the league. The transition to the NFL for collegiate lineman is a tough one and takes 2+ years. Plan on him being the swing tackle in 2018 but he may eventually become the RT in 2019 if they don't think there is much drop off and they can financially move on from Remmers.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ Jor-El said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Jor-El said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
Don't forget the name Connor Williams. They like him a lot.
Williams could be one of those "Dan Marino" picks - considered a top 10 player until his last season, then a setback, overanalyzed by scouts, and slipped in the draft to give some team a steal.
Question: if the Vikings picked Williams, who played only LT throughout college, would they move him to RT, or consider moving Reiff to the right side?
They'd put him at right tackle. It's not unusual for college left tackles to start out on the right in the NFL (Tyron Smith, Nate Solder), even if they project long term on the left.
And you don't move Reiff. You'd worsen both positions by doing that. Contrary to what many believe, he actually played better on the left in Detroit. And he had a helluva year last year.
I do agree about Reiff, and know he was less effective when the Lions moved him to RT. It's more that I see some difficulty in projecting Williams to RT...true, many switch without trouble, but some struggle with it. It would be an easier projection if Williams had ever played on the right or been a swing tackle. But I'm probably just feeling skittish because of the challenges we had moving TJ Clemmings around...
I don't think Clemmings' struggles were due to the side he was on. It's just not a big deal unless you switch them mid-career or switch them back and forth.
I don't know this for sure, I would love to find a stat on this, but I would bet that a clear majority of the right tackles starting in the NFL were left tackles in college.
NCAA RT's are either NFL RT's or Guards the majority of the time. NCAA LT's either stay at LT or become RT's the majority of the time.
Clemmings issue was an overall lack of awareness picking up anything other than the man in front of him. He also had severe balance issues that led to him lunging and playing off-balance from the snap.
Hill can still improve but he was gave up the most pressures in the playoff's according to PFF. Our OL really took a step back when they shuffled Remmers to Guard and put Hill in at RT. Of course that indicates that we thought Hill was a better replacement Tackle then we had for a replacement Guard (Isadora etc).
We need to draft a day one starting Guard and keep Remmers at RT and Elflein at Center. The shifting did not work in playoffs either game. Hayward abused Hill in the Saints game. Remmers played RT well all season until the shift.
No, 65, he didn't. He played League Average, which looked ' well' to you because of the horror show from the previous year.
League Average works in the Regular Season. When you get to the Playoffs it will be the most glaring weakness on Offense .
You can find a Guard in the 2nd or 3rd that can be a Day 1 Starter. Just look at Elf. You can also do that at Tackle but it is much harder.
Remmers is nearing 30 and the team is already talking about moving him to RG for a resson. They know he's not the answer.
Having said that, I think there's zero percent chance that McGlinchey falls past 21. Miller is too developmental for me to spend a first on. Even a low first.
So I'm actively rooting for Wynn. Great Guard prospect. And I'm tired of the CB Whisperer needing 1st Round picks at CB. Earn that damned reputation by turning another vet around like Newman and Jones.
That's what will happen, though. It will either be Alexander from Louisville or Oliver from CU. And like Mac and Trae they won't contribute very much in Year 1.
I have a bad feeling about the first round. 
Quote: @FSUVike said:
No, 65, he didn't. He played League Average, which looked ' well' to you because of the horror show from the previous year.
League Average works in the Regular Season. When you get to the Playoffs it will be the most glaring weakness on Offense .
You can find a Guard in the 2nd or 3rd that can be a Day 1 Starter. Just look at Elf. You can also do that at Tackle but it is much harder.
Remmers is nearing 30 and the team is already talking about moving him to RG for a resson. They know he's not the answer.
Having said that, I think there's zero percent chance that McGlinchey falls past 21. Miller is too developmental for me to spend a first on. Even a low first.
So I'm actively rooting for Wynn. Great Guard prospect. And I'm tired of the CB Whisperer needing 1st Round picks at CB. Earn that damned reputation by turning another vet around like Newman and Jones.
That's what will happen, though. It will either be Alexander from Louisville or Oliver from CU. And like Mac and Trae they won't contribute very much in Year 1.
I have a bad feeling about the first round.
Not sure why people insist on calling Zim a CB guru or whisperer or what ever. He is a defensive guru or genius, as far as Newman and jones...they were good players coming out, they just needed the right coaching, system, and enviroment. CB is likely the most demanding posorion in this defense the wsy the league is pass happy and it stands to reason that more emphasis should be put on the position IMO. If that means taking another one high to offset possibly losing Waynes so be it. We really can't afford to be weak at CB in a year when Newman will surely be gone and possibly Waynes as well.
But I'm still pulling for OL OL and LB
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