Quote: @FSUVike said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ StickyBun said:
I'm all in on whatever, I've said this from Day One, but if Zimmer isn't interested in trying to get a top QB because he's concerned about 'defensive talent' and how a QB would impact that salary cap-wise, the team will only ever be so good. It will be limited. Bridesmaids forever.
Its a freakin' QBs league in the NFL. He can quote all the stats he wants, but the only stat that counts is a complete ass kicking in a NFC Championship game and a 1-2 record in the playoffs. Let's not be the Kansas City Chiefs.
I forget... did the team with the best QB win the Lombardi this year? Or was it the better defense?
You mean that awesome Defense that gave up 33 points? Against virtually no Gronk looks in the first half? Virtually no Cooks at all?
The last two Super Bowl winners have had to eclipse 30 points to win.
Rub routes. Bunch formations. RPO. Tons of good RBs that can reverse cut and go. Maverick OCs that can scheme TEs onto small Slot CBs and RBs like Hunt, Kamara and Clements facing LBs.
And that doesn't even account for the proliferation of PF and PI calls against the Defense. Or how the young coaches are looking at analytics and making bolder calls on 4th, in the Redzone, etx.,
Defenses will adjust. They always have. But the last few years have proven that you need to score consistently to win. I don't think this is the time to plan on winning it all because you expect your Defense to hold really good teams under 21 points.
2 games is not a significant sample size. The average losing score of the last 5 SBs is 20.6 points. The average losing score of the last 10 SBs is 21.6 points. The average losing score of the last 20 SBs is 19.4 points. In the last 10 SB, 2 of the losing teams have been held under 11 points, 2 more under 18 points, 3 more under 26 points, and 3 that would have required more than 26 points (29,32,34). Scoring 21 points would win you the SB 50% of the time, and scoring 26 points would win you the SB 70% of the time for those past 10 years. The further you go back, the less points were scored by the losing team.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ Purplewhizz said:
@ StickyBun said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ StickyBun said:
I'm all in on whatever, I've said this from Day One, but if Zimmer isn't interested in trying to get a top QB because he's concerned about 'defensive talent' and how a QB would impact that salary cap-wise, the team will only ever be so good. It will be limited. Bridesmaids forever.
Its a freakin' QBs league in the NFL. He can quote all the stats he wants, but the only stat that counts is a complete ass kicking in a NFC Championship game and a 1-2 record in the playoffs. Let's not be the Kansas City Chiefs.
But what if he doesn't think Cousins is a "top" QB?
Honestly Geoff, I guess I'll get behind it and hope for the best, what choice do I have? But how can I trust that Zimmer wants the 'top' QB when he's already said he just wants a QB that won't mess with his defensive talent? He wants a game manager, somebody that doesn't create a lot of turnovers. That gets you decent regular seasons but disappointing post seasons. I want a killer mentality. Zimmer talks and thinks like a glorified defensive coordinator, not a HC.
Welcome to Minneapolis, the Kansas City of the North.
I think part of his trouble is he dependence on listening to Parcells. The game has changed a great deal since Parcells coached.
Now when was the last time he said anything about going to Parcells for advice?
Holy shit it's amazing how fast people want to throw Zim under the bus. And for those that don't think his input is valuable in finding a QB, who the hell do you think he watches on film all the time to see how to build his great defenses? He studies QBs and likely has more input on their weaknesses and tendencies than a lot of offensive minds.
I think what he is saying is being taken out of context, if a brady or rogers was the one wanting 30 million then I doubt he is talking about the cap implications, bit it's not, the rumored 30 mill guy isn't even close to them. Same goes for over paying keenum, if he's looking for north of 15 he's nuts as well.
It is freaking crazy. All the people calling for his job a year ago, then hopping on the bandwagon for the excellent 2017 season and now ready to cut bait again.
This guy gets paid to coach and we are internet experts. So I will go with his expertise over the hot takes on here.
Quote: @greediron said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ Purplewhizz said:
@ StickyBun said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ StickyBun said:
I'm all in on whatever, I've said this from Day One, but if Zimmer isn't interested in trying to get a top QB because he's concerned about 'defensive talent' and how a QB would impact that salary cap-wise, the team will only ever be so good. It will be limited. Bridesmaids forever.
Its a freakin' QBs league in the NFL. He can quote all the stats he wants, but the only stat that counts is a complete ass kicking in a NFC Championship game and a 1-2 record in the playoffs. Let's not be the Kansas City Chiefs.
But what if he doesn't think Cousins is a "top" QB?
Honestly Geoff, I guess I'll get behind it and hope for the best, what choice do I have? But how can I trust that Zimmer wants the 'top' QB when he's already said he just wants a QB that won't mess with his defensive talent? He wants a game manager, somebody that doesn't create a lot of turnovers. That gets you decent regular seasons but disappointing post seasons. I want a killer mentality. Zimmer talks and thinks like a glorified defensive coordinator, not a HC.
Welcome to Minneapolis, the Kansas City of the North.
I think part of his trouble is he dependence on listening to Parcells. The game has changed a great deal since Parcells coached.
Now when was the last time he said anything about going to Parcells for advice?
Holy shit it's amazing how fast people want to throw Zim under the bus. And for those that don't think his input is valuable in finding a QB, who the hell do you think he watches on film all the time to see how to build his great defenses? He studies QBs and likely has more input on their weaknesses and tendencies than a lot of offensive minds.
I think what he is saying is being taken out of context, if a brady or rogers was the one wanting 30 million then I doubt he is talking about the cap implications, bit it's not, the rumored 30 mill guy isn't even close to them. Same goes for over paying keenum, if he's looking for north of 15 he's nuts as well.
It is freaking crazy. All the people calling for his job a year ago, then hopping on the bandwagon for the excellent 2017 season and now ready to cut bait again.
This guy gets paid to coach and we are internet experts. So I will go with his expertise over the hot takes on here.
maybe they miss waiting for the tape to get checked.... IMO Zim is the best HC we've had since maybe Burns and the main reason I like Jerry was the fire in his belly but could still find humor in situations. I think Denny did some good things, but I didnt think much of him as a person. Tice was jovial and I loved that a former player got to be a HC, but damn I used to scream at the radio when I would listen to his fireside chats mid week where he would lay out the game plan over the air. Chilly was what he was, needed at the time to change the culture, but not a long term type of guy. I like Zims approach and hope he can be here a long time.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ greediron said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ Purplewhizz said:
@ StickyBun said:
@"Geoff Nichols" said:
@ StickyBun said:
I'm all in on whatever, I've said this from Day One, but if Zimmer isn't interested in trying to get a top QB because he's concerned about 'defensive talent' and how a QB would impact that salary cap-wise, the team will only ever be so good. It will be limited. Bridesmaids forever.
Its a freakin' QBs league in the NFL. He can quote all the stats he wants, but the only stat that counts is a complete ass kicking in a NFC Championship game and a 1-2 record in the playoffs. Let's not be the Kansas City Chiefs.
But what if he doesn't think Cousins is a "top" QB?
Honestly Geoff, I guess I'll get behind it and hope for the best, what choice do I have? But how can I trust that Zimmer wants the 'top' QB when he's already said he just wants a QB that won't mess with his defensive talent? He wants a game manager, somebody that doesn't create a lot of turnovers. That gets you decent regular seasons but disappointing post seasons. I want a killer mentality. Zimmer talks and thinks like a glorified defensive coordinator, not a HC.
Welcome to Minneapolis, the Kansas City of the North.
I think part of his trouble is he dependence on listening to Parcells. The game has changed a great deal since Parcells coached.
Now when was the last time he said anything about going to Parcells for advice?
Holy shit it's amazing how fast people want to throw Zim under the bus. And for those that don't think his input is valuable in finding a QB, who the hell do you think he watches on film all the time to see how to build his great defenses? He studies QBs and likely has more input on their weaknesses and tendencies than a lot of offensive minds.
I think what he is saying is being taken out of context, if a brady or rogers was the one wanting 30 million then I doubt he is talking about the cap implications, bit it's not, the rumored 30 mill guy isn't even close to them. Same goes for over paying keenum, if he's looking for north of 15 he's nuts as well.
It is freaking crazy. All the people calling for his job a year ago, then hopping on the bandwagon for the excellent 2017 season and now ready to cut bait again.
This guy gets paid to coach and we are internet experts. So I will go with his expertise over the hot takes on here.
maybe they miss waiting for the tape to get checked.... IMO Zim is the best HC we've had since maybe Burns and the main reason I like Jerry was the fire in his belly but could still find humor in situations. I think Denny did some good things, but I didnt think much of him as a person. Tice was jovial and I loved that a former player got to be a HC, but damn I used to scream at the radio when I would listen to his fireside chats mid week where he would lay out the game plan over the air. Chilly was what he was, needed at the time to change the culture, but not a long term type of guy. I like Zims approach and hope he can be here a long time.
Yep. He is building a team culture and that was what many of his comments are about. No one player is more important than the team.
So the performance the last 6 quarters of his Number #1 ranked Defense with a historically great 3rd Down success rate deserves a pass because he's clearly a much better coach than anyone Minnesota has had in a while?
The talk yesterday about not improving that Offense too much at the expense of the Defense rankled a lot of us.
And we have every right to be concerned. 38-7. Yet another disastrous performance in a Championship Game. Rather than coming out and saying he now sees the need for balance instead of continuing to funnel 80% of the resources into the Defense he says the exact opposite.
How are we supposed to feel about that? His best Defense as a HC wasn't good enough. The Offense was pathetic. But let's not mess with the status quo?
Sorry. You're both good folk but that was an incredibly tone deaf thing for Mike to say when he's still got a hurting fan base. And alarming since it makes him sound like the Eagles game was an aberration and not something he can learn from.
The defense has to get better to be considered a Championship level D. Clearly the lack of pass rush against good offensive teams in the playoffs were noticible by everyone watching the game. Don't you think Zimmer noticed that also?
Zim knows better than anyone the areas the team needs to improve on; both on offense and defense.
Quote: @FSUVike said:
So the performance the last 6 quarters of his Number #1 ranked Defense with a historically great 3rd Down success rate deserves a pass because he's clearly a much better coach than anyone Minnesota has had in a while?
The talk yesterday about not improving that Offense too much at the expense of the Defense rankled a lot of us.
And we have every right to be concerned. 38-7. Yet another disastrous performance in a Championship Game. Rather than coming out and saying he now sees the need for balance instead of continuing to funnel 80% of the resources into the Defense he says the exact opposite.
How are we supposed to feel about that? His best Defense as a HC wasn't good enough. The Offense was pathetic. But let's not mess with the status quo?
Sorry. You're both good folk but that was an incredibly tone deaf thing for Mike to say when he's still got a hurting fan base. And alarming since it makes him sound like the Eagles game was an aberration and not something he can learn from.
Where are you pulling that out of?
Not wanting to overpay for an average QB? He talked about team, not defense. He said we were good because we were a team, not because of one player. That doesn't mean they aren't going to spend for a QB. He said he wants to find the RIGHT QB, not just pay lots of money for any QB.
Quote: @FSUVike said:
So the performance the last 6 quarters of his Number #1 ranked Defense with a historically great 3rd Down success rate deserves a pass because he's clearly a much better coach than anyone Minnesota has had in a while?
The talk yesterday about not improving that Offense too much at the expense of the Defense rankled a lot of us.
And we have every right to be concerned. 38-7. Yet another disastrous performance in a Championship Game. Rather than coming out and saying he now sees the need for balance instead of continuing to funnel 80% of the resources into the Defense he says the exact opposite.
How are we supposed to feel about that? His best Defense as a HC wasn't good enough. The Offense was pathetic. But let's not mess with the status quo?
Sorry. You're both good folk but that was an incredibly tone deaf thing for Mike to say when he's still got a hurting fan base. And alarming since it makes him sound like the Eagles game was an aberration and not something he can learn from.
i think some want to be angry so they will read into stuff in search of something that will feed their fire. i didnt read it as him not wanting to spend on the O or saying that his only priority is the D, he is saying that the cap is getting tighter and we need to be more prudent with our spending... which I completely agree with. They will get the most bang for their buck regardless of what side of the ball its on. they werent shy last year about spending on the O in both FA and Draft so why the hand wringing now?
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ FSUVike said:
So the performance the last 6 quarters of his Number #1 ranked Defense with a historically great 3rd Down success rate deserves a pass because he's clearly a much better coach than anyone Minnesota has had in a while?
The talk yesterday about not improving that Offense too much at the expense of the Defense rankled a lot of us.
And we have every right to be concerned. 38-7. Yet another disastrous performance in a Championship Game. Rather than coming out and saying he now sees the need for balance instead of continuing to funnel 80% of the resources into the Defense he says the exact opposite.
How are we supposed to feel about that? His best Defense as a HC wasn't good enough. The Offense was pathetic. But let's not mess with the status quo?
Sorry. You're both good folk but that was an incredibly tone deaf thing for Mike to say when he's still got a hurting fan base. And alarming since it makes him sound like the Eagles game was an aberration and not something he can learn from.
i think some want to be angry so they will read into stuff in search of something that will feed their fire. i didnt read it as him not wanting to spend on the O or saying that his only priority is the D, he is saying that the cap is getting tighter and we need to be more prudent with our spending... which I completely agree with. They will get the most bang for their buck regardless of what side of the ball its on. t hey werent shy last year about spending on the O in both FA and Draft so why the hand wringing now?
Yep, they had a plan, targeted certain upgrades and paid well for them. They didn't overspend on names, they overspent on solid additions.
Quote: @greediron said:
@ JimmyinSD said:
@ FSUVike said:
So the performance the last 6 quarters of his Number #1 ranked Defense with a historically great 3rd Down success rate deserves a pass because he's clearly a much better coach than anyone Minnesota has had in a while?
The talk yesterday about not improving that Offense too much at the expense of the Defense rankled a lot of us.
And we have every right to be concerned. 38-7. Yet another disastrous performance in a Championship Game. Rather than coming out and saying he now sees the need for balance instead of continuing to funnel 80% of the resources into the Defense he says the exact opposite.
How are we supposed to feel about that? His best Defense as a HC wasn't good enough. The Offense was pathetic. But let's not mess with the status quo?
Sorry. You're both good folk but that was an incredibly tone deaf thing for Mike to say when he's still got a hurting fan base. And alarming since it makes him sound like the Eagles game was an aberration and not something he can learn from.
i think some want to be angry so they will read into stuff in search of something that will feed their fire. i didnt read it as him not wanting to spend on the O or saying that his only priority is the D, he is saying that the cap is getting tighter and we need to be more prudent with our spending... which I completely agree with. They will get the most bang for their buck regardless of what side of the ball its on. t hey werent shy last year about spending on the O in both FA and Draft so why the hand wringing now?
Yep, they had a plan, targeted certain upgrades and paid well for them. They didn't overspend on names, they overspent on solid additions.
Really? Spielman tried to give Matt Kalil the same money as Reiff except for less years FIRST. We are lucky that Kalil said no.
They had to spend on the offensive line because Spielman decided that he only needed Boone and Berger under contract for 2017 (besides the developmental low paid dudes).
This made the decision to trade for Bradford even more stupid. He was going all-in when he made that trade and it was not with an eye for the future when you look at the state of the line at the time of the trade.
Saying they were not shy about spending on the line last year is simply not looking at the facts. You do not have to be a brain surgeon to know they put themselves in that position through Spielman's stupid planning for the offensive line which began by letting Kalil get that 5th year for 11 mil. And then he passed on Cody Whitehair to take Mackenzie Alexander who is nice but really was a luxury pick. Free agent offensive linemen get paid more than free agent corners so drafting the linemen early (especially when you do not have anyone under contract the next year) would have been a better move. Instead we got Beavers.
The inference that you guys are making that Zimmer was not talking about the defense when he was saying you have to be careful when you sign a QB because you still want to do things at other positions is also unbelievable.
Who are the upcoming free agent? Barr, Kendricks, Hunter, and then Waynes. Diggs is the only one on offense.
It is not hard to figure out which players he was talking about. His defense.
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