John DeFilippo on Vikings' quarterback situation: 'We're going to get it fixed'

[Guest]

@StickyBun said:

@greediron said:

“The thing you look at is does your quarterback win football games?

One of the best supporting facts for Teddy as well. 

lol, c'mon now. Hilarious. This would mean Keenum a hell of a lot more than Bridgewater.

Why?  Cuz Teddy didn't win?  We won the NFCN with both QBs.  Case won a playoff game, Teddy had us in position to win.  Case had a better record, but also had a much better team.

The only one the "winning" leaves out of the discussion is Sam.

[Guest]

@greediron said:

@kmillard said:

@greediron said:

@StickyBun said:
Flip on Bridgewater: {crickets}

Actually, I have no idea what they'll do...and I think its interesting that there is no real rumor about which direction they'll go. We still have weeks to go yet before free agency, lol. Sigh.

I take it as he has no real experience with or against Teddy.  At least recently.

Two things I find interesting.

“No. 2, while I wouldn’t say I’m tough on the players I am demanding of
the players, but at the same time they know I care for them as people.
Those two things go along to being able to get your point across.”

Sounds like Zimmer.

“The thing you look at is does your quarterback win football games?

One of the best supporting facts for Teddy as well. 

 I don't remember Teddy putting the team on his back and winning games with his arm. Unless handing off to AD is considered a pass. 

Best thing about Teddy was his GUMP.  He was best at delivering when the game was on the line.  In 2 short years, he had 4 game winning drives according to PFF
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/p...r=BridTe00

Another case of stats lying: are we really going to count that overtime Jets pass to Jarius Wright as a game winner? It was almost a lateral for crying out loud. He threw the ball 3 yards BEHIND the line of scrimmage. 

I can see the agendas are out in full force. Keenum has flaws, Bradford has injury risk concerns and Teddy is certainly flawed. I don't know what the right choice is but lets not act like TB has been some kind of miracle worker.

[Guest]

@StickyBun said:

@greediron said:

@kmillard said:

@greediron said:

@StickyBun said:
Flip on Bridgewater: {crickets}

Actually, I have no idea what they'll do...and I think its interesting that there is no real rumor about which direction they'll go. We still have weeks to go yet before free agency, lol. Sigh.

I take it as he has no real experience with or against Teddy.  At least recently.

Two things I find interesting.

“No. 2, while I wouldn’t say I’m tough on the players I am demanding of
the players, but at the same time they know I care for them as people.
Those two things go along to being able to get your point across.”

Sounds like Zimmer.

“The thing you look at is does your quarterback win football games?

One of the best supporting facts for Teddy as well. 

 I don't remember Teddy putting the team on his back and winning games with his arm. Unless handing off to AD is considered a pass. 

Best thing about Teddy was his GUMP.  He was best at delivering when the game was on the line.  In 2 short years, he had 4 game winning drives according to PFF
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/p...r=BridTe00

Another case of stats lying: are we really going to count that overtime Jets pass to Jarius Wright as a game winner? It was almost a lateral for crying out loud. He threw the ball 3 yards BEHIND the line of scrimmage. 

I can see the agendas are out in full force. Keenum has flaws, Bradford has injury risk concerns and Teddy is certainly flawed. I don't know what the right choice is but lets not act like TB has been some kind of miracle worker.

All stats can be tortured.  Are you going to say Case was never bailed out by his WRs?  Did you subtract the catch and run TD by Thielen against the Rams?  Did you compensate for dropped INTs? 

Case was amazing this year.  Can he replicate it?  That is the question.

Teddy was GUMP, that is pretty well established.  When Norv let him throw it late in games or even late in the first half, Teddy was money.  Can he reestablish himself and regain that form?  That is his question.

[Guest]

@MaroonBells said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@MarkSP18 said:
In other words, Kirk Cousins.

Nothing in that suggests Kirk Cousins. We'll see, the Vikings interest at this point is overblown by the media due to the perceived fit. Not to take the wind out of your sails but I wouldn't get my hopes up on Kirk until the Vikings make a final determination on the tag. 

Flip can't talk about Cousins, can he? Isn't that tampering? I also wonder if he's been advised not to talk about Teddy as well because of the tolling issue. If the Vikings are taking the position that the NFL will toll Teddy's contract, then there is no decision to make about him. He's under contract and not one of the QBs we have to "decide" about. But talking about that in the media would be a sure fire-starter.  

He probably got reamed out for mentioning him to PA last week on the radio. So that could factor into this a little bit. 

[Guest]

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@MaroonBells said:

@"Geoff Nichols" said:

@MarkSP18 said:
In other words, Kirk Cousins.

Nothing in that suggests Kirk Cousins. We'll see, the Vikings interest at this point is overblown by the media due to the perceived fit. Not to take the wind out of your sails but I wouldn't get my hopes up on Kirk until the Vikings make a final determination on the tag. 

Flip can't talk about Cousins, can he? Isn't that tampering? I also wonder if he's been advised not to talk about Teddy as well because of the tolling issue. If the Vikings are taking the position that the NFL will toll Teddy's contract, then there is no decision to make about him. He's under contract and not one of the QBs we have to "decide" about. But talking about that in the media would be a sure fire-starter.  

He probably got reamed out for mentioning him to PA last week on the radio. So that could factor into this a little bit. 

I know PA sure sounded like he was nervous about it when he was talking about it yesterday.  he also sounded a little pissed at his buddy florio for making an issue out of it.

[Guest]

@purplefaithful said:

@Ilovebigtd's said:
case keenum re signing here will be the biggest mistake in viking history 

You must be too young to remember Ponder, Troy Williamson, Erasmus James, Darrin Nelson or drafting Derrick Alexander over Warren Sapp...

Draft picks are different. Draft is a crap shoot for all teams. Heck, if you hit on HALF your picks in the 1st three rounds, you're doing pretty well.  

This QB decision is different. We know who they are. We know the pluses and minuses of each. So I tend to agree with the kid who loves his big TDs. If we get this wrong, we're in trouble. Especially if we get it wrong BIG. And the biggest potential "wrong" IMO would be to sign Keenum long term. Think about it. Teddy can't command a long term contract. Neither can Sam. Keenum, because of a 13-3 season, is going to get a multi-year deal from someone.  And that team is going to bank its future on the idea that the NFL's most sought after OC and the NFL's best contested-catch receivers had nothing to do with disguising his arm and accuracy issues, and that this undrafted QB on his 5th team is suddenly Kurt Warner and not Matt Cassel...or Marc Bulger...or Jake Delhomme. 

[Guest]

@lakeerievike said:

@Ilovebigtd's said:
case keenum re signing here will be the biggest mistake in viking history 

Why do you feel this way?  Seriously.  I don't see why you can write a guy off just because he's been a backup in the past.  Players take time to develop.  Look at Waynes.  Everyone was ready to write him off in 2016, but last season he found himself.  I see Case the same way.  His college performance was really good in my opinion, then he got kicked around on some teams that had sub-par coaching or bigger named starters.

2013 - He was behind Schaub
2014 - He was signed off the Rams PS, came in after Fitzpatrick broke his leg and won those two games
2015 - He went to the Rams for a 7th round pick to back up Nick Foles.  He came in for the benched Foles late in the season.  Against the Ravens he suffered a concussion but in following weeks beat several teams and completed the season with a winning percentage, despite playing for their idiot coach.
2016 - Saw some great games and a couple bad ones.  Considering he played for Fisher, I give him a pass.   If not for a bad game against the Giants, his TD to INT ratio would have been much better.
2017 - We all know how well he did.  Was he perfect in his delivery?  No, but He played behind an new offensive line which, when it counted, battled major injuries.   That line was composed of Reiff, Remmers, Elflein (injured during game), Berger, and Hill.  

Keenum has played a grand total of 41 games, that's not even 3 full seasons.  He's not Tom Brady or Drew Brees, but he has heart and has proven that he can sling it.  

Have a look at this


I mean this guys numbers aren't that bad.  More TD/GM than Tyrod Taylor and Alex Smith (What did he just sign for?), best passer rating of any above.  He's a starting QB and with a little more help on the offensive line and maybe some additional weapons and coaching, we really don't know how blessed we could be.

I believe the NFL is a what have you done for me lately employer.  Teddy hasn't done a thing and those legs are still toothpicks.  Bradford's injury woes aren't going away.  Do you want to spend everything to get Cousins?  Teams have won with less, look at Dilfer and Gannon's careers.  This team is ready NOW.  Case has chemistry with the team.  Let's continue to build around him and coach him up even more.   

The risk with Case is that everyone is worried that his play
is not sustainable.  I’m not sure that
using his only good year and comparing it to these other guys extended careers,
and then proclaiming that only recent stats matter relieves that concern.  If we’re only looking at current year stats,
Alex Smith’s stats are notably better than Keenums.  If we’re looking at the long view, you can
just look at Carr who by most accounts was a superior prospect to Case and had
two seasons of very solid play only to have a down season this year and his
team suffered because of it.


I don’t believe that you give contracts over what players
have done, but rather what you think they’re likely to do over the next couple seasons.  Often times, the two line up, but not always.

[Guest]

@MaroonBells said:

@purplefaithful said:

@Ilovebigtd's said:
case keenum re signing here will be the biggest mistake in viking history 

You must be too young to remember Ponder, Troy Williamson, Erasmus James, Darrin Nelson or drafting Derrick Alexander over Warren Sapp...

Draft picks are different. Draft is a crap shoot for all teams. Heck, if you hit on HALF your picks in the 1st three rounds, you're doing pretty well.  

This QB decision is different. We know who they are. We know the pluses and minuses of each. So I tend to agree with the kid who loves his big TDs. If we get this wrong, we're in trouble. Especially if we get it wrong BIG. And the biggest potential "wrong" IMO would be to sign Keenum long term. Think about it. Teddy can't command a long term contract. Neither can Sam. Keenum, because of a 13-3 season, is going to get a multi-year deal from someone.  And that team is going to bank its future on the idea that the NFL's most sought after OC and the NFL's best contested-catch receivers had nothing to do with disguising his arm and accuracy issues, and that this undrafted QB on his 5th team is suddenly Kurt Warner and not Matt Cassel...or Marc Bulger...or Jake Delhomme. 

I still say that signing Case to a multi year deal will never even come close to gutting the franchise for Walker... I honestly think that ranks up there with some of the worst management decisions of all times in anything, sports or other.... think hindenberg, donner party, etc.  :p

I dont think Case would really hurt the team,  i just dont think he will elevate the team like some of the other options will do at various prices.

[Guest]

@greediron said:

@StickyBun said:

@greediron said:

@kmillard said:

@greediron said:

@StickyBun said:
Flip on Bridgewater: {crickets}

Actually, I have no idea what they'll do...and I think its interesting that there is no real rumor about which direction they'll go. We still have weeks to go yet before free agency, lol. Sigh.

I take it as he has no real experience with or against Teddy.  At least recently.

Two things I find interesting.

“No. 2, while I wouldn’t say I’m tough on the players I am demanding of
the players, but at the same time they know I care for them as people.
Those two things go along to being able to get your point across.”

Sounds like Zimmer.

“The thing you look at is does your quarterback win football games?

One of the best supporting facts for Teddy as well. 

 I don't remember Teddy putting the team on his back and winning games with his arm. Unless handing off to AD is considered a pass. 

Best thing about Teddy was his GUMP.  He was best at delivering when the game was on the line.  In 2 short years, he had 4 game winning drives according to PFF
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/p...r=BridTe00

Another case of stats lying: are we really going to count that overtime Jets pass to Jarius Wright as a game winner? It was almost a lateral for crying out loud. He threw the ball 3 yards BEHIND the line of scrimmage. 

I can see the agendas are out in full force. Keenum has flaws, Bradford has injury risk concerns and Teddy is certainly flawed. I don't know what the right choice is but lets not act like TB has been some kind of miracle worker.

All stats can be tortured.  Are you going to say Case was never bailed out by his WRs?  Did you subtract the catch and run TD by Thielen against the Rams?  Did you compensate for dropped INTs? 

Case was amazing this year.  Can he replicate it?  That is the question.

Teddy was GUMP, that is pretty well established.  When Norv let him throw it late in games or even late in the first half, Teddy was money.  Can he reestablish himself and regain that form?  That is his question.

Teddy wasn't GUMP. What does that even mean really (I know what it literally means)? Teddy doesn't get nervous, I can see that. But he's got 28 TDs and 22 INTs total in his career. He's been accurate. He's young and hasn't played in that many games. I totally understand that he might have some decent upside that remains untapped. I also will give you the offense he was in was SO Peterson heavy. But its been a long time since he's played and it easy to forget the question marks on him, including his deep ball which was atrocious. 

Sigh, it will be interesting. The more I think about each of the 3, the more I find myself really wondering how good any of them will be. 

[Guest]

@JimmyinSD said:

@MaroonBells said:

@purplefaithful said:

@Ilovebigtd's said:
case keenum re signing here will be the biggest mistake in viking history 

You must be too young to remember Ponder, Troy Williamson, Erasmus James, Darrin Nelson or drafting Derrick Alexander over Warren Sapp...

Draft picks are different. Draft is a crap shoot for all teams. Heck, if you hit on HALF your picks in the 1st three rounds, you're doing pretty well.  

This QB decision is different. We know who they are. We know the pluses and minuses of each. So I tend to agree with the kid who loves his big TDs. If we get this wrong, we're in trouble. Especially if we get it wrong BIG. And the biggest potential "wrong" IMO would be to sign Keenum long term. Think about it. Teddy can't command a long term contract. Neither can Sam. Keenum, because of a 13-3 season, is going to get a multi-year deal from someone.  And that team is going to bank its future on the idea that the NFL's most sought after OC and the NFL's best contested-catch receivers had nothing to do with disguising his arm and accuracy issues, and that this undrafted QB on his 5th team is suddenly Kurt Warner and not Matt Cassel...or Marc Bulger...or Jake Delhomme. 

I still say that signing Case to a multi year deal will never even come close to gutting the franchise for Walker... I honestly think that ranks up there with some of the worst management decisions of all times in anything, sports or other.... think hindenberg, donner party, etc.  :p

I dont think Case would really hurt the team,  i just dont think he will elevate the team like some of the other options will do at various prices.

Depends on the contract. No, nothing will beat the Herschel fiasco. That was the biggest blunder not just in Vikings history, but in all of sports history. 

I'm OK tagging Case in a prove-it move. I wouldn't even bitch too much if we signed him to an easy-out Glennon-like contract. What I'm talking about is a batshit crazy contract like...

Jake Delhomme
Panthers sign Delhomme to a 5 year, 42M extension (at the time a HUGE contract). He's cut the following year. But the Panthers keep paying. 

Matt Cassel
Chiefs gave up a 2nd rounder and gave backup, and supporting-cast "herring" Matt Cassel a 6-year, 62M contract. Had 1 good year and 3 terrible years in KC. Now on his 4th stint as a backup. 

Marc Bulger
Rams gave Bulger a 6-year, $62M contract with 27M guaranteed in 2007. Started out OK with remnants of the "greatest show on turf," but as his supporting cast crumbled, so did he. He was replaced a year later.