KOC: "JJM wearing us out", got work with 1st team offense

[MaroonBells]

It was a tough spot for Green. Letting Cunningham go would have caused riots in the Twin Cities streets with the season they had in '98. Randal's arm brought 100% fear to defenses because it maximized Moss's deep abilities and hence the offense was completely wide open. No way Johnson would have had the year that Cunningham did.

I disagree. You adjust the offense to the QB. It would've been a different offense, but maybe no less effective. Remember, before he was hurt, Johnson threw 4 TDs in the opener against Tampa, two of which come on deep passes to Randy. 

Even though I wanted them to go back to Brad, it's not hard to understand why the Vikings stuck with RC even after Johnson returned to health. You go with the hot hand. But there was always a feeling of instability, at least with me. And I think that showed up a bit in the NFCC when RC melted down before the half.

[StickierBuns]

I disagree. You adjust the offense to the QB. It would've been a different offense, but maybe no less effective. Remember, before he was hurt, Johnson threw 4 TDs in the opener against Tampa, two of which come on deep passes to Randy. 

Even though I wanted them to go back to Brad, it's not hard to understand why the Vikings stuck with RC even after Johnson returned to health. You go with the hot hand. But there was always a feeling of instability, at least with me. And I think that showed up a bit in the NFCC when RC melted down before the half.

It was one game with Johnson.....and on one TD to Moss, the first one, he badly under threw it. To say the offense would be just as effective with Brad's noodle arm is something I couldn't disagree with more.

[hogjowlsjohnny]

I agree with this. I think you try to extend him. Vikings would probably try to keep it to two years and hope he goes for it. He might, considering the odds of him failing in another offense would be high, given his history. It gives JJ two more years in the oven, which probably sounds nuts to people. But as you point out, Love sat for three seasons, as did Rodgers. And if McCarthy proves just too good to keep on the bench, you could always trade Darnold before his final season for some serious draft capital. 

The upside is that you'd get more than enough time to figure out exactly what you have in McCarthy. The downside, of course, is you put a big squeeze on that QB-on-a-rookie-deal cap fantasy.

The Vikings won't really know if Darnold is worth extending until late in the season or playoffs. If he balls out and is worth extending, his agent won't go for a two year deal when he could get big money and a long term contract from another QB needy team, by going to free agency. It's likely the Vikings would be out bid in free agency unless JJM flames out.
I suspect Darnold will be Darnold and JJM will end up starting after the bye. Perhaps not ideal but seems realistic.

[StickierBuns]

Per #Vikings HC Kevin O'Connell via
@SKORNorth
, there's no specific date, game, or time ticking down as to when J.J. McCarthy will take over as QB1 ?

O'Connell also noted how important he is to the organization and how well he's performed this offseason.

“There's no clock in the corner of the room that is ticking down to a specific date, or game, or things like that. It's about our team, but also [J.J. McCarthy] is very important to me and very important to our organization, and my experiences tell me for a lot of reasons that our plan for him is in place for a reason and we feel really good about it."

[MaroonBells]

The Vikings won't really know if Darnold is worth extending until late in the season or playoffs. If he balls out and is worth extending, his agent won't go for a two year deal when he could get big money and a long term contract from another QB needy team, by going to free agency. It's likely the Vikings would be out bid in free agency unless JJM flames out.
I suspect Darnold will be Darnold and JJM will end up starting after the bye. Perhaps not ideal but seems realistic.

Therein lies the rub. Take a short-term deal and continue with the offense that saved your career? Or take the big money and long-term contract and risk becoming Bad Sam again? I think you're probably right tho. He'd see the trade winds blowing in Minnesota and take the money, thinking Bad Sam is gone forever and Fixed Sam can now play well in any offense.

[StickierBuns]

Therein lies the rub. Take a short-term deal and continue with the offense that saved your career? Or take the big money and long-term contract and risk becoming Bad Sam again? I think you're probably right tho. He'd see the trade winds blowing in Minnesota and take the money, thinking Bad Sam is gone forever and Fixed Sam can now play well in any offense.

Kevin Seifert
@SeifertESPN
·
9m
J.J. McCarthy did not get much time with Justin Jefferson at mini-camp last week -- "I think I might have thrown one ball to him," he said -- but important to note the Vikings put McCarthy's locker right next to Jefferson's. "It's nice to get those off-the-field interactions."

Kevin Seifert
@SeifertESPN
·
9m
J.J. McCarthy on this spring: "I always try to be better tomorrow than I am today. Of course, growth is not a straight line. It goes up, it goes down, it goes up, it goes down. But I'm trying to maintain that trajectory of going up and up. I feel like I'm on that."
Kevin Seifert
@SeifertESPN
·
8m
McCarthy on accepting the dips in that trajectory: "You have to. They're inevitable. Failure is inevitable in sports. You've just go to learn from them and learn from those little dips and not be attached to them emotionally. That's what I've been working on."

[DeepFreeze05]

Not quite the same. I agree it was a mistake to keep Cunningham over Johnson. And I was very vocal about that at the time. But unlike JJM, Johnson was already a proven QB, who I believe would've done pretty much the same thing as Randall did in '98 if he had stayed healthy. What's more, Cunningham was 36 years old. Darnold just turned 27 on Wednesday. 

No idea what Denny was thinking on that one. But I do know that my stance on playing BJ over RC was extremely unpopular. Viking fans and media had googly eyes over Randall in '98.

Staying healthy was an issue for Johnson during that time. In 1996, he had the season ending neck injury. In 1997, Week 2, sprained ankle. Week 9, relief of an injured Cunningham, first play third quarter, breaks his thumb.

To get a first, a future second, and a third-round pick on a player with multiple injuries in two years, plus rumors about loss in velocity due to the neck injury, I don't think it was a bad trade at the time. I believe the loss of six year offensive coordinator Brian Billick may have had more of an impact to that 1999 team.

[purplefaithful]

Staying healthy was an issue for Johnson during that time. In 1996, he had the season ending neck injury. In 1997, Week 2, sprained ankle. Week 9, relief of an injured Cunningham, first play third quarter, breaks his thumb.

To get a first, a future second, and a third-round pick on a player with multiple injuries in two years, plus rumors about loss in velocity due to the neck injury, I don't think it was a bad trade at the time. I believe the loss of six year offensive coordinator Brian Billick may have had more of an impact to that 1999 team.

6 year offensive coordinator...

Man you dont hear that much anymore 

[hogjowlsjohnny]

Staying healthy was an issue for Johnson during that time. In 1996, he had the season ending neck injury. In 1997, Week 2, sprained ankle. Week 9, relief of an injured Cunningham, first play third quarter, breaks his thumb.

To get a first, a future second, and a third-round pick on a player with multiple injuries in two years, plus rumors about loss in velocity due to the neck injury, I don't think it was a bad trade at the time. I believe the loss of six year offensive coordinator Brian Billick may have had more of an impact to that 1999 team.

Absolutely, he had no strength in his throwing arm after the neck injury. But he came back with his original strength before they traded him. He was a great QB with a sharp mind and great accuracy.
Brian Billick was the the most creative OC the Vikings ever had. Next would be Jerry Burns and then Pat Shurmer.
Interesting how some gifted coordinators make good head coaches and some don't. Of course the GM and personnel play a role in that success or failure.