Quote: @VikingOracle said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ VikingOracle said:
@ MaroonBells said:
Penix electing not the play in the Senior Bowl today. Seems odd he would want to "rest his case" on a poor title game followed by an underwhelming week in Mobile.
https://twitter.com/ProFootballTalk/stat...15566?s=20
Actually don't blame him at all. I can't see him fall past the middle of the second round but if plays poorly in the Senior Bowl or, heaven forbid, gets injured and he loses millions of dollars. And as mentioned by Sticky, I think there is a lot of differences of opinion regarding the practices. I think his interviews will be more important than his practices (new receivers, new schemes/plays).
Understood, but you know as well as I do there are going to be those in the NFL who question his courage, leadership, commitment, pick a word, after this decision. If it's about a potential injury, then that's just another reminder of the four season ending injuries in his past.
I like Penix, probably more than most, but I know how people think.
How do you feel about all the draft eligible players who skipped their school's bowl game (such as Jayden Daniels, Drake Maye, Joe Alt, Laiatu Latu and Caleb Williams)? That, to me, is far more damning than skipping an all-star game where you are not working with your teammates or coaches. Though I agree that skipping the all star game buys into the Penix narrative.
It's not about me. I really couldn't care less. But I do think his decision, like the bowl game decisions you mention, will rub some in the NFL the wrong way.
It's just surprising to me he would make that decision, considering that his last two public appearances (the title game and his week in mobile) were less than flattering. The game was an opportunity to remove a bit of that bad taste and he elected to sit.
Quote: @VikeMike52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Looks like he might've secured that 7th QB slot and there's probably not as much separating tier 2 from tier 3 now, with Nix and Penix maybe moving down a bit, and Rattler and Pratt moving up. JJM's the big unknown. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Oh and btw, both Ponder and Mond were Senior Bowl MVPs.
I think McCarthy will end up as QB4 and may get drafted a lot higher than many think. Personally I think him behind Kirk for a year or two would be perfect.
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Matt Barkley 2.0
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ VikeMike52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Looks like he might've secured that 7th QB slot and there's probably not as much separating tier 2 from tier 3 now, with Nix and Penix maybe moving down a bit, and Rattler and Pratt moving up. JJM's the big unknown. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Oh and btw, both Ponder and Mond were Senior Bowl MVPs.
I think McCarthy will end up as QB4 and may get drafted a lot higher than many think. Personally I think him behind Kirk for a year or two would be perfect.
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
I'm with you, although I think we'll have a better idea after the Combine. We know Jeremiah is plugged in with the scouting community and he had McCarthy 27th in his initial top 50...so that's probably a pretty good gauge knowing he will likely make up some ground at the Combine. I'm imagining by the end of the process he'll be viewed as a mid first round pick...so if we took him at #11, so be it
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ VikeMike52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Looks like he might've secured that 7th QB slot and there's probably not as much separating tier 2 from tier 3 now, with Nix and Penix maybe moving down a bit, and Rattler and Pratt moving up. JJM's the big unknown. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Oh and btw, both Ponder and Mond were Senior Bowl MVPs.
I think McCarthy will end up as QB4 and may get drafted a lot higher than many think. Personally I think him behind Kirk for a year or two would be perfect.
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
I'm with you, although I think we'll have a better idea after the Combine. We know Jeremiah is plugged in with the scouting community and he had McCarthy 27th in his initial top 50...so that's probably a pretty good gauge knowing he will likely make up some ground at the Combine . I'm imagining by the end of the process he'll be viewed as a mid first round pick...so if we took him at #11, so be it
He is probably the biggest QB unknown this early on.
My belief is if the Vikings dont take him @ 11, someone will around that 16 slot. I just dont see him dropping to end of rd 1 or top of day 2.
But hell, Rogers dropped all the way to the end of Rd 1 - so anything is possible.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ VikeMike52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Looks like he might've secured that 7th QB slot and there's probably not as much separating tier 2 from tier 3 now, with Nix and Penix maybe moving down a bit, and Rattler and Pratt moving up. JJM's the big unknown. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Oh and btw, both Ponder and Mond were Senior Bowl MVPs.
I think McCarthy will end up as QB4 and may get drafted a lot higher than many think. Personally I think him behind Kirk for a year or two would be perfect.
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
I'm with you, although I think we'll have a better idea after the Combine. We know Jeremiah is plugged in with the scouting community and he had McCarthy 27th in his initial top 50...so that's probably a pretty good gauge knowing he will likely make up some ground at the Combine . I'm imagining by the end of the process he'll be viewed as a mid first round pick...so if we took him at #11, so be it
He is probably the biggest QB unknown this early on.
My belief is if the Vikings dont take him @ 11, someone will around that 16 slot. I just dont see him dropping to end of rd 1 or top of day 2.
But hell, Rogers dropped all the way to the end of Rd 1 - so anything is possible.
The way I see it, if the Vikings were willing to sell the farm to move up last year, and may actually be willing to do it again this year, they should be willing to move from 42 to the middle 1st for their guy.
I know the trade chart points are nebulous and don't cleanly translate into draft picks. However, according to the chart, it would cost about 1,000 points to move up from 11 to the top 3. It would cost about half that to move from 42 to, say, 16.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
I would not move up for JJM - and I'm a JJM fan. As someone else here said, he has too many unknowns. But he is young, has a good arm, is a good athlete (can run and throw on the run), is very competitive, his teammates love him, etc. So I don't have a problem taking him at 11 or trading down and risk losing out on JJM, Nix, and Penix, especially if we can pick up a first round pick in 2025. I feel that way in part because next year's QB draft should be as good as this one for us (Caleb Williams is not in the cards for us so it does not matter if there is no Caleb in next year's draft.) Next year we will likely see Sanders, Milroe, Beck, Ward, Ewers, Leonard, Allar, ... They will have one more year to develop and we will have 2 first round picks to use to move up for a first tier QB.
I see the Vikings having a lot of options at 11. Move up to take a first tier QB (may not be possible); take a QB at 11 if there is one there you really like; take a top Edge or CB at 11; trade back a little and still take one of the 2d tier QBs while picking up a significant draft pick; or trade to the back of the first and pick up another 1st in '25.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ purplefaithful said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ VikeMike52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
Spencer Rattler out there trying to be seen. He's an enigma: a 5 star QB out of high school, some thought might be a generational pick in the Draft after his 2020 season, he's never reached that high since then. He's got a big arm, is mobile and can throw on the run or in the pocket. Short at 6' 0". He locks into initial reads and looks, the cerebral part of the game challenges him. Had a nice 2023 but scouts think that might be his ceiling.
Looks like he might've secured that 7th QB slot and there's probably not as much separating tier 2 from tier 3 now, with Nix and Penix maybe moving down a bit, and Rattler and Pratt moving up. JJM's the big unknown. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Oh and btw, both Ponder and Mond were Senior Bowl MVPs.
I think McCarthy will end up as QB4 and may get drafted a lot higher than many think. Personally I think him behind Kirk for a year or two would be perfect.
I'm moving more into that direction as well. Question is, then, where do you take McCarthy? Do you have to move up? Stay at 11? Trade back? Round two? A Bridgewater-like move up?
I just have no clue where his stock is right now.
I'm with you, although I think we'll have a better idea after the Combine. We know Jeremiah is plugged in with the scouting community and he had McCarthy 27th in his initial top 50...so that's probably a pretty good gauge knowing he will likely make up some ground at the Combine . I'm imagining by the end of the process he'll be viewed as a mid first round pick...so if we took him at #11, so be it
He is probably the biggest QB unknown this early on.
My belief is if the Vikings dont take him @ 11, someone will around that 16 slot. I just dont see him dropping to end of rd 1 or top of day 2.
But hell, Rogers dropped all the way to the end of Rd 1 - so anything is possible.
The way I see it, if the Vikings were willing to sell the farm to move up last year, and may actually be willing to do it again this year, they should be willing to move from 42 to the middle 1st for their guy.
I know the trade chart points are nebulous and don't cleanly translate into draft picks. However, according to the chart, it would cost about 1,000 points to move up from 11 to the top 3. It would cost about half that to move from 42 to, say, 16.
You want to talk about a dream offseason, if we could land a top front 7 player on defense AND McCarthy, who backs up Cousins on a moderate extension...absolute homerun IMO. This franchise needs something to get excited about this offseason and this would fit the bill
And on JJ, the reason I like him so much is he has a lot of precursors which would lead you to believe he will be successful. He's a winner and has started a ton of games, lots of big ones. Athletic, accurate, and high upside. I care less and less about the "statistics" of which, I think he was tasked to run the offense given to him and he obviously did it well.
To me, dare I say it, but he is a little Montana-esque from his build and overall makeup. I'm really looking forward to seeing the draft process play out for him
Tier 1 in this QB draft are in no particular order:
1. Caleb Williams
2. Drake Maye
3. Bo Nix
4. Jayden Daniels
5. JJ McCarthy
Tier 2:
1. Penix - Tier 1 if not for the injury history. I’d be surprised if he goes in round 1. Someone can always fall in love with him and fear he’ll be taken, but I suspect the injury history is going to really impact where he goes. His performance in the championship game did him no favors either. I would have strongly advised him to play a couple of series in the senior bowl like Nix. I think it was a huge mistake on his part. Bo Nix went out on a flee flicker and put it in stride on the money about 62 air yards out. His stats wouldn’t have mattered. He answered a question and showed he has upper echelon NFL arm strength. Penix had an opportunity to do something similar and in my opinion blew it.
2. Rattler
3rd Tier:
I’ve reviewed a couple of guys so far and they are borderline undraftable.
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