Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ PurpleCrush said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
Vikings Home Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: New Orleans Saints and Tampa Bay Buccaneers
AFC West: Kansas City Chiefs and Los Angeles Chargers
NFC West: San Francisco 49ers
Vikings Road Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: Atlanta Falcons and Carolina Panthers
AFC West: Denver Broncos and Las Vegas Raiders
NFC East: Philadelphia Eagles
AFC North: Cincinnati Bengals
12-5
Pfffft. Pessimist.
I know...I know what you're thinking....
4X Pro Bowl QB Cousins returning to the same offense for the first time since 2016. The line returning all five starters for the first time in over a decade, a receiving corp that includes the best receiver in football, a 1st rounder in Addison, a damn good WR3 in KJO and one of the NFL's best receiving TEs in TJ Hockenson...not to mention a defense that replaces Mr. Ed with the Secretary of Defense Brian Flores, upgrades Peterson with Murphy, adds Marcus Davenport, a 1st rounder (Cine), a 2nd rounder (Booth), two 3rds (Asamoah, Blackmon) and two 4ths (Evans, Ward) to what we fielded last year.....and we're going to win FEWER games this year?
Cousins for MVP and Super Bowl here we come then, right!?
I hope you are right, but the reality is its virtually impossible to repeat the good fortune we had last season in pulling off some impossible one score games. We were also largely injury free to our key players last season and I wouldnt count on that happening again. Yes we've made some hopeful improvements, but do you not think Philly, Dallas, San Francisco, Seattle, the Giants, and even the Lions (who you could argue was the better team last year) also made substantial roster improvements? Bears are going to be a lot better. I just have a feeling it's going to be tough sledding for the Vikings this year and somewhere around .500 feels realistic to me. I know though....just me being pessimistic and not giving Cousins credit for the MVP candidate he is.
I don't expect us to repeat last year. I hope we don't. I don't see a dozen close games and record breaking comebacks. But nor do I expect to suffer 4 blowout losses. I think the '23 team will be more even-keeled with better defense and a better running game. We may not win 13 games, but it should be a more sound team going into the playoffs.
All those teams you mention is a classic case of the grass being greener in the other guy's yard. I think Philly looks good but volatile. Detroit certainly improved their roster. But let's not forget that the only team with a worse defense than ours was Detroit. Everyone loves the 49ers, but seem to gloss over the fact that they got nothing from the draft and lost 8 starters to free agency. Dallas, Seattle, the Giants? Meh. I think the Vikings are right in that mix. One team you don't mention that I expect to be better is the Saints. Guessing the Bears thing was a joke?
No it's the classic case of those teams being better than us last season and having also made significant roster upgrades and moves themselves. So where does that leave the Vikings in the shuffle? Have we done enough to overtake some of these teams who were better than us last season? Seattle, Detroit and the Giants certainly had better drafts. The 49ers signed who many considered the top free agent available this year in Javon Hargrave and have arguably the most loaded roster in the league. I agree with you on the Saints and brought them up in another post. The Bears have completely reshaped their roster and will be much better, not a playoff team, but better. Dallas didn't get worse.
I still think we may have the worst defensive line in the league and we are counting on Brian Flores, who has never been a DC before, to come in and work miracles with this unit is a tall order. Hoping the injury prone secondary can stay healthy. Our linebackers are undersized and I think behind that line are going to struggle stopping the run. The plights of Zadarius Smith and Dalvin Cook are yet to be determined still. I firmly believe getting rid of Cook would be a mistake and makes our offense much less potent. Hoping for the best obviously but a 9-8 type season feels about right all things considered.
https://twitter.com/MikeClayNFL/status/1...65798?s=20
The outside guys are good, although we don't know what we are getting from Davenport. 15 games played last season...1/2 a sack. He's also played in a 4 man front his whole career and how will he adjust to playing OLB in a 3-4? He has upside, but as of now he's a huge question mark.
My comment was referencing our 3 down lineman. We just don't have any difference makers unless Roy surprises. I suspect we will once again have trouble collapsing the pocket and I think we will struggle to stop the run more this season. Hope I'm wrong, but it's an assumption based on personnel.
The three players up front in a 3-4 aren't typically household names. Check out the best 3-4 defenses in the NFL the last several years. If you've heard of more than half of them I'd be surprised.
It's really amazing when you look at the top defenses in the league, just how many are 4-3 teams. The top six statistical defenses last season were all 4-3 teams including all four in the conference finals. I absolutely hate seeing a historically dominant 4-3 franchise like the Vikings trying to make the switch. I want four superior defensive lineman kicking your lines ass all game long.
But when I do think of successful 3-4 teams historically, you think of the Steelers with Cam Heyward, the Patriots with Richard Seymour, or more recently the Rams with Aaron Donald. I think you need an interior disruptor to collapse the pocket and cause havoc. We are trotting out Phillips and Dean Lowry, who I listened to a Packers fan yesterday lambaste on NFL Radio as "just some dude who isn't good at anything" and they were happy he was gone. I thought it could be argued defensive line was our biggest draft need, so unless we are counting on a 5th round rookie to come in and provide some juice, we didn't do a whole lot in an effort to upgrade that group
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ PurpleCrush said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
Vikings Home Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: New Orleans Saints and Tampa Bay Buccaneers
AFC West: Kansas City Chiefs and Los Angeles Chargers
NFC West: San Francisco 49ers
Vikings Road Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: Atlanta Falcons and Carolina Panthers
AFC West: Denver Broncos and Las Vegas Raiders
NFC East: Philadelphia Eagles
AFC North: Cincinnati Bengals
12-5
Pfffft. Pessimist.
I know...I know what you're thinking....
4X Pro Bowl QB Cousins returning to the same offense for the first time since 2016. The line returning all five starters for the first time in over a decade, a receiving corp that includes the best receiver in football, a 1st rounder in Addison, a damn good WR3 in KJO and one of the NFL's best receiving TEs in TJ Hockenson...not to mention a defense that replaces Mr. Ed with the Secretary of Defense Brian Flores, upgrades Peterson with Murphy, adds Marcus Davenport, a 1st rounder (Cine), a 2nd rounder (Booth), two 3rds (Asamoah, Blackmon) and two 4ths (Evans, Ward) to what we fielded last year.....and we're going to win FEWER games this year?
Cousins for MVP and Super Bowl here we come then, right!?
I hope you are right, but the reality is its virtually impossible to repeat the good fortune we had last season in pulling off some impossible one score games. We were also largely injury free to our key players last season and I wouldnt count on that happening again. Yes we've made some hopeful improvements, but do you not think Philly, Dallas, San Francisco, Seattle, the Giants, and even the Lions (who you could argue was the better team last year) also made substantial roster improvements? Bears are going to be a lot better. I just have a feeling it's going to be tough sledding for the Vikings this year and somewhere around .500 feels realistic to me. I know though....just me being pessimistic and not giving Cousins credit for the MVP candidate he is.
I don't expect us to repeat last year. I hope we don't. I don't see a dozen close games and record breaking comebacks. But nor do I expect to suffer 4 blowout losses. I think the '23 team will be more even-keeled with better defense and a better running game. We may not win 13 games, but it should be a more sound team going into the playoffs.
All those teams you mention is a classic case of the grass being greener in the other guy's yard. I think Philly looks good but volatile. Detroit certainly improved their roster. But let's not forget that the only team with a worse defense than ours was Detroit. Everyone loves the 49ers, but seem to gloss over the fact that they got nothing from the draft and lost 8 starters to free agency. Dallas, Seattle, the Giants? Meh. I think the Vikings are right in that mix. One team you don't mention that I expect to be better is the Saints. Guessing the Bears thing was a joke?
No it's the classic case of those teams being better than us last season and having also made significant roster upgrades and moves themselves. So where does that leave the Vikings in the shuffle? Have we done enough to overtake some of these teams who were better than us last season? Seattle, Detroit and the Giants certainly had better drafts. The 49ers signed who many considered the top free agent available this year in Javon Hargrave and have arguably the most loaded roster in the league. I agree with you on the Saints and brought them up in another post. The Bears have completely reshaped their roster and will be much better, not a playoff team, but better. Dallas didn't get worse.
I still think we may have the worst defensive line in the league and we are counting on Brian Flores, who has never been a DC before, to come in and work miracles with this unit is a tall order. Hoping the injury prone secondary can stay healthy. Our linebackers are undersized and I think behind that line are going to struggle stopping the run. The plights of Zadarius Smith and Dalvin Cook are yet to be determined still. I firmly believe getting rid of Cook would be a mistake and makes our offense much less potent. Hoping for the best obviously but a 9-8 type season feels about right all things considered.
https://twitter.com/MikeClayNFL/status/1...65798?s=20
The outside guys are good, although we don't know what we are getting from Davenport. 15 games played last season...1/2 a sack. He's also played in a 4 man front his whole career and how will he adjust to playing OLB in a 3-4? He has upside, but as of now he's a huge question mark.
My comment was referencing our 3 down lineman. We just don't have any difference makers unless Roy surprises. I suspect we will once again have trouble collapsing the pocket and I think we will struggle to stop the run more this season. Hope I'm wrong, but it's an assumption based on personnel.
The three players up front in a 3-4 aren't typically household names. Check out the best 3-4 defenses in the NFL the last several years. If you've heard of more than half of them I'd be surprised.
It's really amazing when you look at the top defenses in the league, just how many are 4-3 teams. The top six statistical defenses last season were all 4-3 teams including all four in the conference finals. I absolutely hate seeing a historically dominant 4-3 franchise like the Vikings trying to make the switch. I want four superior defensive lineman kicking your lines ass all game long.
But when I do think of successful 3-4 teams historically, you think of the Steelers with Cam Heyward, the Patriots with Richard Seymour, or more recently the Rams with Aaron Donald. I think you need an interior disruptor to collapse the pocket and cause havoc. We are trotting out Phillips and Dean Lowry, who I listened to a Packers fan yesterday lambaste on NFL Radio as "just some dude who isn't good at anything" and they were happy he was gone. I thought it could be argued defensive line was our biggest draft need, so unless we are counting on a 5th round rookie to come in and provide some juice, we didn't do a whole lot in an effort to upgrade that group
Agree with you on Lowry and the 3-4. The Cowboys switched to a 3-4, sucked and immediately switched back to a 4-3 and improved quite a bit. But I like Phillips and I think Tonga is a better than average nose and has some upside to be even better than that. Here are Clay's IDL rankings...
https://twitter.com/MikeClayNFL/status/1...22531?s=20
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ PurpleCrush said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Kentis said:
Vikings Home Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: New Orleans Saints and Tampa Bay Buccaneers
AFC West: Kansas City Chiefs and Los Angeles Chargers
NFC West: San Francisco 49ers
Vikings Road Opponents:
NFC North: Chicago Bears, Detroit Lions and Green Bay Packers
NFC South: Atlanta Falcons and Carolina Panthers
AFC West: Denver Broncos and Las Vegas Raiders
NFC East: Philadelphia Eagles
AFC North: Cincinnati Bengals
12-5
Pfffft. Pessimist.
I know...I know what you're thinking....
4X Pro Bowl QB Cousins returning to the same offense for the first time since 2016. The line returning all five starters for the first time in over a decade, a receiving corp that includes the best receiver in football, a 1st rounder in Addison, a damn good WR3 in KJO and one of the NFL's best receiving TEs in TJ Hockenson...not to mention a defense that replaces Mr. Ed with the Secretary of Defense Brian Flores, upgrades Peterson with Murphy, adds Marcus Davenport, a 1st rounder (Cine), a 2nd rounder (Booth), two 3rds (Asamoah, Blackmon) and two 4ths (Evans, Ward) to what we fielded last year.....and we're going to win FEWER games this year?
Cousins for MVP and Super Bowl here we come then, right!?
I hope you are right, but the reality is its virtually impossible to repeat the good fortune we had last season in pulling off some impossible one score games. We were also largely injury free to our key players last season and I wouldnt count on that happening again. Yes we've made some hopeful improvements, but do you not think Philly, Dallas, San Francisco, Seattle, the Giants, and even the Lions (who you could argue was the better team last year) also made substantial roster improvements? Bears are going to be a lot better. I just have a feeling it's going to be tough sledding for the Vikings this year and somewhere around .500 feels realistic to me. I know though....just me being pessimistic and not giving Cousins credit for the MVP candidate he is.
I don't expect us to repeat last year. I hope we don't. I don't see a dozen close games and record breaking comebacks. But nor do I expect to suffer 4 blowout losses. I think the '23 team will be more even-keeled with better defense and a better running game. We may not win 13 games, but it should be a more sound team going into the playoffs.
All those teams you mention is a classic case of the grass being greener in the other guy's yard. I think Philly looks good but volatile. Detroit certainly improved their roster. But let's not forget that the only team with a worse defense than ours was Detroit. Everyone loves the 49ers, but seem to gloss over the fact that they got nothing from the draft and lost 8 starters to free agency. Dallas, Seattle, the Giants? Meh. I think the Vikings are right in that mix. One team you don't mention that I expect to be better is the Saints. Guessing the Bears thing was a joke?
It's really amazing when you look at the top defenses in the league, just how many are 4-3 teams. The top six statistical defenses last season were all 4-3 teams including all four in the conference finals. I absolutely hate seeing a historically dominant 4-3 franchise like the Vikings trying to make the switch. I want four superior defensive lineman kicking your lines ass all game long.
But when I do think of successful 3-4 teams historically, you think of the Steelers with Cam Heyward, the Patriots with Richard Seymour, or more recently the Rams with Aaron Donald. I think you need an interior disruptor to collapse the pocket and cause havoc. We are trotting out Phillips and Dean Lowry, who I listened to a Packers fan yesterday lambaste on NFL Radio as "just some dude who isn't good at anything" and they were happy he was gone. I thought it could be argued defensive line was our biggest draft need, so unless we are counting on a 5th round rookie to come in and provide some juice, we didn't do a whole lot in an effort to upgrade that group
Agree with you on Lowry and the 3-4. The Cowboys switched to a 3-4, sucked and immediately switched back to a 4-3 and improved quite a bit. But I like Phillips and I think Tonga is a better than average nose and has some upside to be even better than that. Here are Clay's IDL rankings...
https://twitter.com/MikeClayNFL/status/1...22531?s=20
Interesting list. Not sure what he bases it off of, but he has that Eagles group criminally low.
I think Phillips is a decent run stopper but doesn't offer much in the way of collapsing the pocket or getting after the quarterback. The defense was a total shit show last year as we all know, but something that stood out to me was our d-line getting knocked off the ball regularly and we did nothing in the way of penetrating or TFL's. I honestly don't think teams took advantage of running on us like they normally would because the pass defense was literally pitch and catch. 3rd and 6, we'd play off coverage 8 yards deep. I think I looked it up once, but we were towards the top of the league in allowing teams to convert on 3rd downs. This defense needs to get so much better and I think it starts up front. Not sure we did enough there
I read today that the Vikings haven’t drafted a defensive lineman in the 1st or 2nd round since 2013, Sharrif Floyd & before that 2005, Erasmus James. Ridiculous…
Quote: @Kentis said:
I read today that the Vikings haven’t drafted a defensive lineman in the 1st or 2nd round since 2013, Sharrif Floyd & before that 2005, Erasmus James. Ridiculous…
I think that's mostly because the Vikings were able to hit on several middle rounders at DL: Griffen (4th), Hunter (3rd), Robison (4th) and supplement them with top free agents like Linval and Tomlinson. If those middle rounders had not turned out, it's likely we would've drafted more DL in those years.
Quote:
Agree with you on Lowry and the 3-4. The Cowboys switched to a 3-4, sucked and immediately switched back to a 4-3 and improved quite a bit. But I like Phillips and I think Tonga is a better than average nose and has some upside to be even better than that. Here are Clay's IDL rankings...
https://twitter.com/MikeClayNFL/status/1...22531?s=20
Interesting list. Not sure what he bases it off of, but he has that Eagles group criminally low.
I think Phillips is a decent run stopper but doesn't offer much in the way of collapsing the pocket or getting after the quarterback. The defense was a total shit show last year as we all know, but something that stood out to me was our d-line getting knocked off the ball regularly and we did nothing in the way of penetrating or TFL's. I honestly don't think teams took advantage of running on us like they normally would because the pass defense was literally pitch and catch. 3rd and 6, we'd play off coverage 8 yards deep. I think I looked it up once, but we were towards the top of the league in allowing teams to convert on 3rd downs. This defense needs to get so much better and I think it starts up front. Not sure we did enough there
Agree that the Eagles seem low, but that is a paper DL right now. Fletcher Cox is 32 and is nowhere near what he once was. I think he'll be better in '23, but Jordan Davis didn't exactly set the world on fire last year as a part-time rotational player. And while Jalen Carter might be the most talented player from the draft, he also has an enormous bust factor. And I'm not talking about the car crash. When your reputation says you have a terrible work ethic, what do you do to repair that for the NFL? Well, it's not show up at your Pro Day overweight and so out of shape you can't finish the drills. Good luck with that, Eagles.
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