Quote: @TBro said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
I don't disagree he is a good deep threat, but the knock you continually see on him is that his game is very limited, especially in the short to intermediate passing game where separation and contested catches are critical. I would have no problem taking him if we trade down to the end of the 1st or early 2nd, but I think there will be better value elsewhere if we stay at 23.
I'm ok with that as we have Jefferson and Hockensen to work the short to intermediate passing game. What this offense desperately needs is someone that can take the top off a defense because we don't have anybody like that on the roster and it keeps defenses honest from double or triple teaming Jefferson. His speed translates on tape and I think he isn't just a one trick pony, although that's a pretty damn cool trick
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
I don't disagree he is a good deep threat, but the knock you continually see on him is that his game is very limited, especially in the short to intermediate passing game where separation and contested catches are critical. I would have no problem taking him if we trade down to the end of the 1st or early 2nd, but I think there will be better value elsewhere if we stay at 23.
I'm ok with that as we have Jefferson and Hockensen to work the short to intermediate passing game. What this offense desperately needs is someone that can take the top off a defense because we don't have anybody like that on the roster and it keeps defenses honest from double or triple teaming Jefferson. His speed translates on tape and I think he isn't just a one trick pony, although that's a pretty damn cool trick
I think a lot of these receivers outside of Smith-Njigba will get pushed to the 2nd round which is why a trade down for us and getting a 2nd would be desirable. I agree that we need a deep threat and Hyatt would definitely do that for this offense. If anyone could get more out of him that what we saw at TN it's McCardell. I like Flowers overall ability as a matchup nightmare. He can play inside or out. I would be happy with either one being added to the team.
Quote: @TBro said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
I don't disagree he is a good deep threat, but the knock you continually see on him is that his game is very limited, especially in the short to intermediate passing game where separation and contested catches are critical. I would have no problem taking him if we trade down to the end of the 1st or early 2nd, but I think there will be better value elsewhere if we stay at 23.
I'm ok with that as we have Jefferson and Hockensen to work the short to intermediate passing game. What this offense desperately needs is someone that can take the top off a defense because we don't have anybody like that on the roster and it keeps defenses honest from double or triple teaming Jefferson. His speed translates on tape and I think he isn't just a one trick pony, although that's a pretty damn cool trick
I think a lot of these receivers outside of Smith-Njigba will get pushed to the 2nd round which is why a trade down for us and getting a 2nd would be desirable. I agree that we need a deep threat and Hyatt would definitely do that for this offense. If anyone could get more out of him that what we saw at TN it's McCardell. I like Flowers overall ability as a matchup nightmare. He can play inside or out. I would be happy with either one being added to the team.
I agree and think a lot of these guys in most normal drafts would be considered second round prospects with Smith-Njigba and Hyatt being the exceptions. I think of the two Hyatt would be the better fit for what we need. I just know as things sit now, if the Vikings went into next season without another legit threat at receiver, this team is going to be in trouble
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
I get a Tavon Austin vibe when I watch him. Ideally I would prefer a bigger body at the position and I also thought slot guy based on stature. He is certainly explosive and has some deep speed, which the Vikings need in abundance. I also watched him against Notre Dame this year and he didnt do anything in a 44-0 drubbing. Another thing that bothered me when looking at his stats, which I check on everyone because I want to know who they produced against, was a 2 catch 35 yard performace against UConn. Like really, UConn? He's probably more of a second round prospect in normal years, but he'll get pushed up due to a lack of quality at the position.
It's really a tough call with the WR's this year. I still heavily favor Hyatt out of the bunch, but the rest is pick your flavor and what fits your offense best.
Thanks for bringing up Austin because that’s exactly why I love Flowers. Because he’s not Austin. Austin came to WV as a running back and became a RB/Slot receiver/gadget player in their offense.
Flowers was an outside receiver at BC. 75% of his routes were from the outside. This is why he compares more to players like AB, Lockett, Steve Smith, Tyreek and Waddle than to the RonDales and WanDales of the world.
He's got to work on his hands, but Flowers is my pick for best WR from this class.
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
https://youtu.be/aWiAHQuMLZI
The speed is ridiculous, but the reason he's being overlooked is because of his bust factor. It's high. He'll need a good receivers coach (Keenan McCardell is one) who can teach him how to be a complete receiver. He's so far away from that right now. Might take a couple years, but he has upside if you're patient I think.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
Zay has the fire and attitude to be a very good NFL WRer. Feisty. Same as Diggs and JJ. But the dude is small. Probably not as big a deal with the offensive rules in today's NFL than in the past.
The narrative that typically follows smaller receivers is that they're limited to the slot, where they can use their quickness and YAC more effectively. While Flowers can do that, he's first and foremost an outside receiver.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
I get a Tavon Austin vibe when I watch him. Ideally I would prefer a bigger body at the position and I also thought slot guy based on stature. He is certainly explosive and has some deep speed, which the Vikings need in abundance. I also watched him against Notre Dame this year and he didnt do anything in a 44-0 drubbing. Another thing that bothered me when looking at his stats, which I check on everyone because I want to know who they produced against, was a 2 catch 35 yard performace against UConn. Like really, UConn? He's probably more of a second round prospect in normal years, but he'll get pushed up due to a lack of quality at the position.
It's really a tough call with the WR's this year. I still heavily favor Hyatt out of the bunch, but the rest is pick your flavor and what fits your offense best.
Thanks for bringing up Austin because that’s exactly why I love Flowers. Because he’s not Austin. Austin came to WV as a running back and became a RB/Slot receiver/gadget player in their offense.
Flowers was an outside receiver at BC. 75% of his routes were from the outside. This is why he compares more to players like AB, Lockett, Steve Smith, Tyreek and Waddle than to the RonDales and WanDales of the world.
He's got to work on his hands, but Flowers is my pick for best WR from this class.
The stature and short area burst reminds me of Austin, who put up huge stats at WV working all over the field. I'd be okay taking Flowers though because we need an explosive playmaker at receiver, just a little leery taking a guy that small (5'9"/180). I'd take him over Addison and probably even Smith-Njigba for his big play capability.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
https://youtu.be/aWiAHQuMLZI
The speed is ridiculous, but the reason he's being overlooked is because of his bust factor. It's high. He'll need a good receivers coach (Keenan McCardell is one) who can teach him how to be a complete receiver. He's so far away from that right now. Might take a couple years, but he has upside if you're patient I think.
I don't think his bust factor is any higher than any other receiver in this draft and the speed is ridiculous. We need speed at the WR position and to keep defenses honest from doubling JJ. The good thing about Hyatt is he's a true junior coming out so there's certainly upside. He'll come in immediately and be a factor as a deep threat and the kid is a worker. That's why I have him as my top WR in this draft and he would be the absolute perfect complement to Jefferson. Speed checks out, size checks out, production against SEC competition checks out.
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
https://youtu.be/aWiAHQuMLZI
The speed is ridiculous, but the reason he's being overlooked is because of his bust factor. It's high. He'll need a good receivers coach (Keenan McCardell is one) who can teach him how to be a complete receiver. He's so far away from that right now. Might take a couple years, but he has upside if you're patient I think.
I don't think his bust factor is any higher than any other receiver in this draft and the speed is ridiculous. We need speed at the WR position and to keep defenses honest from doubling JJ. The good thing about Hyatt is he's a true junior coming out so there's certainly upside. He'll come in immediately and be a factor as a deep threat and the kid is a worker. That's why I have him as my top WR in this draft and he would be the absolute perfect complement to Jefferson. Speed checks out, size checks out, production against SEC competition checks out.
We could use his speed, but he scares the hell out of me. Needs to learn how to run a full route tree. That's going to take some time. Faced press in just 17 snaps. Against press he has just 1 single catch. As I said before, they said Moss would crumble in press, but he didn't, so there's no reason Hyatt can't learn some release packages. But as skinny as Moss was, he was 30 lbs heavier than Hyatt. Hyatt's 6-0, 176 lbs. You're worried about Flowers' size, when Hyatt has a bigger size problem IMO.
What's more, I've seen so many of these speed only receivers bust in the NFL. John Ross, Corey Coleman, Will Fuller, Kevin White, Breshad Perriman, Philip Dorsett, AJ Jenkins, Troy Williamson, Mike Wallace, Stephen Hill, Will Fuller, Ruggs...Deja Vu, because we had this same argument about Jameson Williams last year.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
@ TBro said:
Of all the receivers with a first round grade that could be available at 23, I think Flowers has the best chance of being an impact player on this offense. Smith-Njigba will be long gone, and the others continue to fall down the board at rapid speed. His versatility is unquestioned. You can line him up anywhere. If you are convinced he can take the pounding, I would have no problem if they took him at 23. Personally, I'm still hoping for a trade down so we can add more picks. Too many holes to fill not to move down if we get a good offer. I'm not sold on Hooker as a QBOTF. Great athlete, but he is a major project.
I'm taking Jalin Hyatt. There is not a better deep threat in this draft and he went for 207 yards with 5 TD's against Alabama this year as well as blowing up the rest of the SEC. I have no idea why he is getting overlooked in comparison to some of these other receivers. I think it's ridiculous. I could make an argument there would not be a better fit or more impactful player at #23.
https://youtu.be/aWiAHQuMLZI
The speed is ridiculous, but the reason he's being overlooked is because of his bust factor. It's high. He'll need a good receivers coach (Keenan McCardell is one) who can teach him how to be a complete receiver. He's so far away from that right now. Might take a couple years, but he has upside if you're patient I think.
I don't think his bust factor is any higher than any other receiver in this draft and the speed is ridiculous. We need speed at the WR position and to keep defenses honest from doubling JJ. The good thing about Hyatt is he's a true junior coming out so there's certainly upside. He'll come in immediately and be a factor as a deep threat and the kid is a worker. That's why I have him as my top WR in this draft and he would be the absolute perfect complement to Jefferson. Speed checks out, size checks out, production against SEC competition checks out.
We could use his speed, but he scares the hell out of me. Needs to learn how to run a full route tree. That's going to take some time. Faced press in just 17 snaps. Against press he has just 1 single catch. As I said before, they said Moss would crumble in press, but he didn't, so there's no reason Hyatt can't learn some release packages. But as skinny as Moss was, he was 30 lbs heavier than Hyatt. Hyatt's 6-0, 176 lbs. You're worried about Flowers' size, when Hyatt has a bigger size problem IMO.
What's more, I've seen so many of these speed only receivers bust in the NFL. John Ross, Corey Coleman, Will Fuller, Kevin White, Breshad Perriman, Philip Dorsett, AJ Jenkins, Troy Williamson, Mike Wallace, Stephen Hill, Will Fuller, Ruggs...Deja Vu, because we had this same argument about Jameson Williams last year.
Does anyone have an updated Top 30 Visit list for the Vikings? The only WR's I've seen confirmed are Addison and Johnston. No way I'm drafting Hyatt at 23 or even with a trade down without having him in for a private workout to address all the issues you bring up. If the receivers continue to slide down in the first, I would much rather take Addison or Flowers at 23. I know Supafreak84 loves him, but I still have him as a day 2 pick for me. The other potential first rounders that have confirmed visits are Emanuel Forbes, Schmitz, Brian Branch, and Keion White.
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