Quote: @comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
He's a b.s. artist who doesn't know what he's doing. I don't know why KOC hired him. A while back Will Ragatz broke down something Donatell said in a presser as follows:
"In today’s world, there’s so many ways to measure things," defensive coordinator Ed Donatell said on Thursday. "Yards never won or lost a game. The team with more yards usually loses the game — I mean, or it’s close to 50-50. But it’s a way they measure. Stats are fun, man. When you’re real high on something, (you say) ‘Oh, that looks good’ and it makes you feel good. Just going in to examine one area really seldom tells the story."
Fact check: Teams are 119-60-1 this season when they win the yardage battle, and 52-13-1 when they win it by 100 yards or more. Yards typically have a pretty strong correlation with points and overall success.
I know what you're saying, but I also know what he was trying to say, but failed. That yards aren't the only predictor of wins. He's right. I think a lot of folks would be surprised that out of 180 games, the team who won the yardage battle won the game only 119 times.
He's saying basically that teams on the losing end tend to press, and put up a lot of garbage yards.
However, while our defensive ranking (last) and our record (10-3) would seem to support this, it doesn't. With the exception of maybe week one, we haven't blown out anyone. So there are nearly zero garbage yards on our books.
Ed has a fan...that's one! =)
If that's what you got out of my post, you might want to read it again.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
He's a b.s. artist who doesn't know what he's doing. I don't know why KOC hired him. A while back Will Ragatz broke down something Donatell said in a presser as follows:
"In today’s world, there’s so many ways to measure things," defensive coordinator Ed Donatell said on Thursday. "Yards never won or lost a game. The team with more yards usually loses the game — I mean, or it’s close to 50-50. But it’s a way they measure. Stats are fun, man. When you’re real high on something, (you say) ‘Oh, that looks good’ and it makes you feel good. Just going in to examine one area really seldom tells the story."
Fact check: Teams are 119-60-1 this season when they win the yardage battle, and 52-13-1 when they win it by 100 yards or more. Yards typically have a pretty strong correlation with points and overall success.
I know what you're saying, but I also know what he was trying to say, but failed. That yards aren't the only predictor of wins. He's right. I think a lot of folks would be surprised that out of 180 games, the team who won the yardage battle won the game only 119 times.
He's saying basically that teams on the losing end tend to press, and put up a lot of garbage yards.
However, while our defensive ranking (last) and our record (10-3) would seem to support this, it doesn't. With the exception of maybe week one, we haven't blown out anyone. So there are nearly zero garbage yards on our books.
Ed has a fan...that's one! =)
If that's what you got out of my post, you might want to read it again.
At this point, he will probably take what he can get.
Unraveling Vikings defense, worst in the NFL lately, threatening to sink a promising seasonThe area where Vikings defensive players sit inside the locker room at U.S. Bank Stadium was positively giddy after they delivered a thumping to the Green Bay Packers in the season opener.
The revamped defense swarmed Aaron Rodgers like bees that had their hive swatted with a stick. As first impressions go, that performance hit the bull's eye, creating optimism that maybe this convergence of new coordinator, new scheme, new personnel and return of Danielle Hunter would be the remedy for a unit that sabotaged the 2021 season.
Fast forward 12 weeks. That same defense is broken, searching for solutions that might not be viable and threatening to sabotage another season, albeit under different circumstances.
The pass rush has vanished. The secondary is getting torched routinely sitting back in soft zone coverage. The defense is hemorrhaging yards and points by such an alarming degree that head coach Kevin O'Connell managed last week's loss at Detroit as if he has little faith in that side of the ball.
Veteran coordinator Ed Donatell has managed to do the unthinkable: Take a bad defense and fail to improve it despite a concerted effort by the organization to upgrade the talent last offseason.
Donatell's 'D' has no identity or calling card, other than to hope that takeaways save their bacon — not a sustainable strategy.
A season that has surprised even the most optimistic believers has no chance of extending deep into the playoffs with a defense playing this poorly. Anyone who spent time at the team's facility this week could feel the tension.
The Vikings have fielded the NFL's worst defense the past month, and O'Connell was unusually forceful in tone regarding areas he wants addressed. His response about not making changes to his defensive staff or play-calling responsibilities "as of right now" raised eyebrows for its vagueness.
The Vikings have a big problem. But how do they fix it? Or better yet, are they capable of fixing it with only four games remaining before the playoffs?
Donatell's scheme is getting roasted in public criticism, but problems go deeper than just one thing. I've wrestled with this question: is the defensive scheme more to blame, or talent deficiencies in personnel?
Defensive schemes such as the Vikings' 3-4 defense (three down linemen, four linebackers) have zero chance of being successful when there's both an ineffective pass rush and pass coverage that gives receivers ample space to operate.
The time-honored football credo is that rush and coverage work hand in hand. The Vikings are doing neither well.
Asked if the problems stem more from execution or scheme, Donatell said, "I think it's really more execution."
Ownership of the mess falls on his shoulders, though. His defense has become strikingly predictable in its approach and slow to adjust.
Donatell prefers to create quarterback pressure without having to blitz, but when that's not happening, a new strategy and approach are necessary. He noted that he's called a few more blitzes in recent games but added: "We like our four-man rush, and they have been so close so many times."
Close?
There is no middle ground here. A pass rush either disrupts a quarterback, or it doesn't. The Vikings rank 22nd in the league in sacks per pass attempt and 24th in pressures.
Quarterbacks are getting too much time to find receivers, which is being aided by soft coverage in the secondary. Donatell acknowledged that he wants his defensive backs to play tighter in coverage, but then offered this contradiction: "Our players are doing what they're coached to do."
If the coaching staff is worried that more blitzes and a more aggressive approach will leave the defense vulnerable to explosive plays, guess what? That's already a problem.
Donatell noted that it's too late in the season for "drastic" changes. Perhaps, but drastic improvement from the defense is required for the Vikings to be viewed as a credible playoff team.
"I can't guarantee it in five days, six days, seven days, but eventually, we'll be there," Donatell said. "Because we know what we're doing and how to do it."
Now would be a good time to provide some evidence.
https://www.startribune.com/minnesota-vikings-defense-worst-in-nfl-lately-chip-scoggins-ed-donatell/600236269/
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ comet52 said:
He's a b.s. artist who doesn't know what he's doing. I don't know why KOC hired him. A while back Will Ragatz broke down something Donatell said in a presser as follows:
"In today’s world, there’s so many ways to measure things," defensive coordinator Ed Donatell said on Thursday. "Yards never won or lost a game. The team with more yards usually loses the game — I mean, or it’s close to 50-50. But it’s a way they measure. Stats are fun, man. When you’re real high on something, (you say) ‘Oh, that looks good’ and it makes you feel good. Just going in to examine one area really seldom tells the story."
Fact check: Teams are 119-60-1 this season when they win the yardage battle, and 52-13-1 when they win it by 100 yards or more. Yards typically have a pretty strong correlation with points and overall success.
I know what you're saying, but I also know what he was trying to say, but failed. That yards aren't the only predictor of wins. He's right. I think a lot of folks would be surprised that out of 180 games, the team who won the yardage battle won the game only 119 times.
He's saying basically that teams on the losing end tend to press, and put up a lot of garbage yards.
However, while our defensive ranking (last) and our record (10-3) would seem to support this, it doesn't. With the exception of maybe week one, we haven't blown out anyone. So there are nearly zero garbage yards on our books.
Ed has a fan...that's one! =)
If that's what you got out of my post, you might want to read it again.
Naahh...I got all there was to get! :p
Quote: @greediron said:
@ purplefaithful said:
Busted coverages and a weak pass rush have been foremost on the minds of Vikings defensive coaches as they've huddled with coordinator Ed Donatell to solve the team's biggest problem.
Our coverage has been crap. PP had a few good games, but gets beat rather consistently. Dantzler needs to shake off the rust and start playing again. Too bad Evans is out.
As to the rush, I think Z is not healthy. Looking at the way he moves lately, he doesn't seem to have the same burst.
I said it a few weeks ago, P2 is just happy that the other corners are so shitty otherwise he would be getting targeted and exposed a lot more than he is.... but whether its dantzler or any of the others they are so easy to pick apart, especially last week without Harry out there, that they opposing QBs are just given yards by going the other way.
Just listened to Phil Simms on NFL Radio. Stated "Vikings lack the courage to be aggressive on defense" and that it's easy for QB's just to pre read the defense and know exactly where to go with the football because they don't do anything to confuse or pressure the quarterback.
Donatell has to go. This 3-4 has to go.
Quote: @supafreak84 said:
Just listened to Phil Simms on NFL Radio. Stated "Vikings lack the courage to be aggressive on defense" and that it's easy for QB's just to pre read the defense and know exactly where to go with the football because they don't do anything to confuse or pressure the quarterback.
Donatell has to go. This 3-4 has to go.
"Lack the courage" sounds kinda stupid. But maybe he means the Vikings don't trust their corners in man. I actually wonder if they might actually be better in man, especially man with a dog hot after the QB.
I thought this defense was supposed to be about confusion. But even the youngest, greenest QBs in the NFL have torn it apart. I'm not typically a "do something, anything" kinda fan, but Donatell has to do something....anything. One simple change to confuse the QB for at least a series or two might be enough to win today.
If we let Matt Ryan go off on us today, Donatell Ed to come back to work.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ supafreak84 said:
Just listened to Phil Simms on NFL Radio. Stated "Vikings lack the courage to be aggressive on defense" and that it's easy for QB's just to pre read the defense and know exactly where to go with the football because they don't do anything to confuse or pressure the quarterback.
Donatell has to go. This 3-4 has to go.
"Lack the courage" sounds kinda stupid. But maybe he means the Vikings don't trust their corners in man. I actually wonder if they might actually be better in man, especially man with a dog hot after the QB.
I thought this defense was supposed to be about confusion. But even the youngest, greenest QBs in the NFL have torn it apart. I'm not typically a "do something, anything" kinda fan, but Donatell has to do something....anything. One simple change to confuse the QB for at least a series or two might be enough to win today.
If we let Matt Ryan go off on us today, Donatell Ed to come back to work.
I think he was referencing Donatell's unwillingness to be aggressive in fear of giving up the big play. Remember, he likes this "bend but don't break" crap and keeping everything in front of them even at the expense of giving up huge chunks of yards. You just can't play with that mentality in today's NFL. We've seen nothing in the way of creativity on the defensive side of the ball. The scheme has turned Danielle Hunter into an afterthought.
The worst part about it is, most of us saw this comong when they hired Donatell and announced this scheme change. Not sure how KOC didn't...
Can we just go back to playing Minnesota Viking football on defense, which is a dominant four man front where our guys are better then yours and we are going to dictate what happens. Purple people eaters, Williams Wall, Jared Allen, John Randle, Everson Griffen, Ray Edwards, Al Noga, Henry Thomas, Chris Doleman, Keith Millard, etc. Let Pittsburgh and this other niche teams play a 3-4 because that's not what this franchise is known for or built upon and it pains me to see Danielle Hunter ever dropping into coverage. I'd look at anybody from the 49ers defensive staff or Jack Del Rio if Washington makes any changes after the year, to come fix this defense and move back to a 4-3
I don't hate the idea of a hybrid defense, if you can make it work. But between the two, I'd much prefer a 4-3.
Unless Donatell completely flips the script on defense in the next few games, I think he should be sent packing and the Vikings should hire one of the assistants in San Francisco or Dallas.
Interestingly, the Cowboys switched to a 3-4 in 2020, then proceeded to break their franchise record for points allowed. They switched to a kind of hybrid in 2021 and improved. Now, the defense is mostly 4-3 and they're top 5.
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