Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings have made the playoffs one time in four years while paying a QB top dollar.
No matter who gets the blame, the strategy has failed miserably.
Continuing down the same path is the definition of insanity.
Something has to change if we truly expect different results.
Yep. Pretty much this. I like Cousins, but the 'swing for the fences' with his contract did not pan out. Shame on Zimmer and Spielman if they weren't in total agreement on signing Cousins. I applauded the risk and going for it, but this $35 million guaranteed for next season is a joke and really short-sighted. A strategic error. I just don't see a team taking Cousins off the Vikings' hands first of all and secondly, if it DOES happen, it will be to the great advantage of the team that trades FOR him. And if I were Cousins, I'd tell the team to pound sand: I ain't renegotiating shit. Cousins will be 34 years old before next season starts.
The Vikings can eat 10-15 million of that 35 he is due next year, that should ensure that they have multiple suitors for him and that should push up the compensation. Yes they give up 15 million in cap space, but they would save 20 million and possibly add a decent first round pick I wouldnt see it as a high first rounder as teams that are just wanting to add a QB to put them over the top arent usually drafting in the top 10.. but who knows? If we didnt offer to eat about half his salary then IMO that would really drive down the suitors and the return would likely drop to a late day 2 pick IMO.
Did I mention what the front office decided to do last year at corner?
Mike Hughes (5 starts), Holton Hill (1 start), Kris Boyd, and rookies was their conscious decision.
They get paid millions to make these decision too.
We all know how the corners fared in 2020.
I do not see how that decision along with the continual interior offensive line decisions keep the dudes safely in their jobs.
The frustrating thing about all of this is both sides are right and have merit.
Kirk has great stats, but we aren’t winning.
Rick has great picks, but we aren’t winning.
So is it ALL Zimmer’s fault then? It really might be. But unfortunately it seems like this team’s problems run deeper than that. Plus, when a company gets a new CEO the new guy doesn’t keep things status quo. Widespread changes are typically in order.
Lastly, I’d remind everyone the NFL is entertainment. If the fanbase at large is no longer entertained by Kirk and the team, then changes will get made as they should.
Quote: @JustinTime18™ said:
Jaguars owner Shad Khan has signaled his intentions to retain Baalke as the team's general manager despite experiencing a truly woeful season, according to multiple reports. Jaguars fans have predictably responded in rather dramatic fashion by taking to social media to voice their great displeasure with this development, and reports continue to emerge that Jaguars faithful plan to dress up in clown gear to their Week 18 home finale against the Indianapolis Colts in an attempt to make their voices heard. They really hate this guy.
Should Khan choose to give in to the mounting pressure by re-thinking his stance on Baalke, it could potentially open up the door for Harbaugh to consider Jacksonville as his next destination. Rookie quarterback Trevor Lawrence has admittedly struggled through his debut campaign, but still represents a franchise signal-caller worth developing and working alongside. Harbaugh was extremely aware of Lawrence's talents throughout his tear at Clemson, and may be tempted to join Lawrence at the pro ranks should the situation work itself out in a manner he deems appropriate.
I'd give Baalke a free pass. Not sure why?
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings have made the playoffs one time in four years while paying a QB top dollar.
No matter who gets the blame, the strategy has failed miserably.
Continuing down the same path is the definition of insanity.
Something has to change if we truly expect different results.
Yep. Pretty much this. I like Cousins, but the 'swing for the fences' with his contract did not pan out. Shame on Zimmer and Spielman if they weren't in total agreement on signing Cousins. I applauded the risk and going for it, but this $35 million guaranteed for next season is a joke and really short-sighted. A strategic error. I just don't see a team taking Cousins off the Vikings' hands first of all and secondly, if it DOES happen, it will be to the great advantage of the team that trades FOR him. And if I were Cousins, I'd tell the team to pound sand: I ain't renegotiating shit. Cousins will be 34 years old before next season starts.
Here is what I expect will happen and Brez is too smart to let a 45M cap hit stay on the books. Let's just get that out the way now.
I think the team will (or should) add two void years to his deal and convert 15M of his salary into a bonus that gets spread out over 3 years. They do not need his permission either.
... this will lower his cap hit by 10M in 2022 and the team will eat 10M in 2023 but by then, the cap should be close to 220M if not a bit more.
It also makes it easier to trade him.
After the Vikings do this salary cap maneuver, Cousins will be owed 25M for 2022. That makes him more attractive to other teams if they are only thinking about a one year rental.
on the QB, WR, and RB and then fail to provide adequate protection, then the strategy has failed.
Good insight that I hope can be done.
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings have made the playoffs one time in four years while paying a QB top dollar.
No matter who gets the blame, the strategy has failed miserably.
Continuing down the same path is the definition of insanity.
Something has to change if we truly expect different results.
Yep. Pretty much this. I like Cousins, but the 'swing for the fences' with his contract did not pan out. Shame on Zimmer and Spielman if they weren't in total agreement on signing Cousins. I applauded the risk and going for it, but this $35 million guaranteed for next season is a joke and really short-sighted. A strategic error. I just don't see a team taking Cousins off the Vikings' hands first of all and secondly, if it DOES happen, it will be to the great advantage of the team that trades FOR him. And if I were Cousins, I'd tell the team to pound sand: I ain't renegotiating shit. Cousins will be 34 years old before next season starts.
The Vikings can eat 10-15 million of that 35 he is due next year, that should ensure that they have multiple suitors for him and that should push up the compensation. Yes they give up 15 million in cap space, but they would save 20 million and possibly add a decent first round pick I wouldnt see it as a high first rounder as teams that are just wanting to add a QB to put them over the top arent usually drafting in the top 10.. but who knows? If we didnt offer to eat about half his salary then IMO that would really drive down the suitors and the return would likely drop to a late day 2 pick IMO.
And what happens if you have no takers?
Quote: @minny65 said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings have made the playoffs one time in four years while paying a QB top dollar.
No matter who gets the blame, the strategy has failed miserably.
Continuing down the same path is the definition of insanity.
Something has to change if we truly expect different results.
Yep. Pretty much this. I like Cousins, but the 'swing for the fences' with his contract did not pan out. Shame on Zimmer and Spielman if they weren't in total agreement on signing Cousins. I applauded the risk and going for it, but this $35 million guaranteed for next season is a joke and really short-sighted. A strategic error. I just don't see a team taking Cousins off the Vikings' hands first of all and secondly, if it DOES happen, it will be to the great advantage of the team that trades FOR him. And if I were Cousins, I'd tell the team to pound sand: I ain't renegotiating shit. Cousins will be 34 years old before next season starts.
Here is what I expect will happen and Brez is too smart to let a 45M cap hit stay on the books. Let's just get that out the way now.
I think the team will (or should) add two void years to his deal and convert 15M of his salary into a bonus that gets spread out over 3 years. They do not need his permission either.
... this will lower his cap hit by 10M in 2022 and the team will eat 10M in 2023 but by then, the cap should be close to 220M if not a bit more.
It also makes it easier to trade him.
After the Vikings do this salary cap maneuver, Cousins will be owed 25M for 2022. That makes him more attractive to other teams if they are only thinking about a one year rental.
on the QB, WR, and RB and then fail to provide adequate protection, then the strategy has failed.
Good insight that I hope can be done.
I pasted a chat I had via twitter with a former agent from last year and he wrote a timely story today about Cousins (unprompted by me).
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-vikings-face-kirk-cousins-conundrum-as-cap-strapped-franchise-prepares-for-tumultuous-offseason/
Cousins wouldn't have much incentive to restructure his contract to create 2022 cap room given his lame duck status. Although the Vikings have automatic salary conversion rights in Cousins' contract, those can't be exercised when voiding/dummy contract years need to be added to generate space, like in this case since 2022 is his contract year. Cousins' consent is required.
When I tweeted him last year the implication was that the team could add void years without his permission. I am guessing that was in 2021 since he had two years left on his deal. Now, he is entering his last year of his deal and they cannot do it automatically.
Still, why wouldn't he help out the team in their efforts to create cap space? He'll still get his 35M. He'll be a free agent in 2023 too because the franchise tag is out.
We shall find out about Cousins IF the Vikings try to add some void years.
My guess?
They are going to trade him.
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings have made the playoffs one time in four years while paying a QB top dollar.
No matter who gets the blame, the strategy has failed miserably.
Continuing down the same path is the definition of insanity.
Something has to change if we truly expect different results.
Yep. Pretty much this. I like Cousins, but the 'swing for the fences' with his contract did not pan out. Shame on Zimmer and Spielman if they weren't in total agreement on signing Cousins. I applauded the risk and going for it, but this $35 million guaranteed for next season is a joke and really short-sighted. A strategic error. I just don't see a team taking Cousins off the Vikings' hands first of all and secondly, if it DOES happen, it will be to the great advantage of the team that trades FOR him. And if I were Cousins, I'd tell the team to pound sand: I ain't renegotiating shit. Cousins will be 34 years old before next season starts.
Here is what I expect will happen and Brez is too smart to let a 45M cap hit stay on the books. Let's just get that out the way now.
I think the team will (or should) add two void years to his deal and convert 15M of his salary into a bonus that gets spread out over 3 years. They do not need his permission either.
![[Image: r9kf5kujjsqf.png]](https://vikefans.com/vfforums/uploads/editor/26/r9kf5kujjsqf.png)
... this will lower his cap hit by 10M in 2022 and the team will eat 10M in 2023 but by then, the cap should be close to 220M if not a bit more.
It also makes it easier to trade him.
After the Vikings do this salary cap maneuver, Cousins will be owed 25M for 2022. That makes him more attractive to other teams if they are only thinking about a one year rental.
I thought it was a good idea to sign him in 2018 and thought the extension was premature.
Here is a prime example of why Spielman confuses the heck out of me ...
The Vikings faced the 49ers in the 2019 NFC Divisional Playoff game. The 49ers sacked Cousins 6 times, hit him another 9 times, and who knows how many other times they pressured him. They held the Vikings to 21 yards rushing on 10 carries.
What does our GM do in the immediate offseason to rectify this problem? He decides that Pat Elflein would be fine AFTER moving him from left guard to right guard. He decided Dakota Dozier was fine on the other side.
In the draft, he waited until the end of the 7th round to select Kyle Hinton. He did draft Ezra Cleveland in the 2nd round and they moved him to guard even though he had never played there before. He only played because Elflein got hurt. The results were predictable.
The Chiefs saw Pat Mahomes get killed in the Super Bowl last year and immediately did this ...
Trade for Orlando Brown to play left tackle.
Sign the top guard in free agency Joe Thuney.
Sign Kyle Long out of retirement (he has been hurt all year).
Sign center/guard Austin Blythe.
Re-sign Mike Remmers.
Draft center Creed Humphrey in the 2nd round.
Draft guard Trey Smith in the 6th round.
... notice any difference?
When you spend the money he spent on the QB, WR, and RB and then fail to provide adequate protection, then the strategy has failed.
You forgot the BOOM at the end...
Spielman's had some great draft picks, but has some questionable trades that haven't paid off... he has a concerning amount of first round busts piling up... he continually trades back on Day 3 to acquire depth that hasn't materialized with any consistency... and he hasn't done a good job of fixing the team's biggest weaknesses despite all the FA signings and draft capital expended.
We can argue all night long about who to blame for the team's struggles... but at the end of the day, the HC and GM need to be in agreement on how to construct their roster and I don't think it's been that way since we signed Cousins. The results speak for themselves.
Both have contributed to an underwhelming 4 years despite having a pretty good QB. It's time for a fresh look.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ JustinTime18™ said:
You tell me.
What's the single most pointed to issue, make that perceived issue, on the team.
What's the single most proposed solution?
The board is not unique in this fallacy. But, it's pretty much unfounded.
I guess I remember Norm Snead, Todd Boumen, Gus Ferrotte, Spergeon Wynn, Shawn Salisberry, Brooks Bollinger and all the other POS QBs we endured.
Remember my post listing all of the Lions QBs from 20 years ago? That was an ugly, ugly streak of incompetence that lasted 40 years, including such superstars as Danielson, Kramer, Harrington, Batch, Hipple, Danielson, Peete, Kramer, Ware, Chuck Long, etc. And this was a team frequently picking in the top 10.
Well, here we are 20 years later and the Lions were finally able to find that QB in Matthew Stafford. And what do they do? They trade him!! It's so fucking stupid it defies description. Not every QB is going to be Tom Brady or Patrick Mahomes, but once you have one you can win with, you're done. Build the team around him. He's not your problem.
But for the Vikings, it's even stupider. There are 3 QBs in NFL history who have thrown for over 30,000 yards and 200 TDs in their first 115 games. Peyton Manning, Dan Marino and Kirk Cousins. QBs with at least 20 games with 300 passing yards, 3 TDs and a passer rating over 110? One: Kirk Cousins (after this season, Rodgers may have joined him).
Oh but some want to dump that guy and fire the guy who drafted JJ, Dalvin, Hunter, Harry, Barr, Kendricks, O'Neill, Darrisaw, Griffen, ISJ...and jump on the Lions plan. Speaking of which, the amount of GMs in Detroit since 2000? Six. Cleveland, ten. Raiders, five. Jets, six. Oh, but unlike those teams, the Vikings are just going to pull their Super Bowl winning GM out of a hat and, defying all the draft odds (Jones, Haskins, Mayfield, Rosen, Darnold, Trubisky, Goff, Wentz, Lynch, Winston, Mariota, Manziel, Manuel, RGIII, Weeden, Locker, Gabbert, Ponder, Locker, Tebow, Sanchez, Freeman, Russel, Quinn, Young, Leinart--all 1st rounders) draft their Super Bowl winning QB right along with him.
Focus on the PROBLEM and don't fix things that aren't broken. Fire the goddamn guy who found a half dozen ways to lose a game and this is probably a playoff team next year. Overreact and we could be staring at several years before we're competitive again.
I'll just echo JiT18..
Nathaniel Hackett to interview with Jaguars during Packers' bye week.
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![[Image: kxrzypB1_bigger.jpg]](https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1190271806684446720/kxrzypB1_bigger.jpg)
