Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Quote: @StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
Quote: @pattersaur said:
I'm guessing the Broncos want Drew Lock to win the job, and I'm also guessing he won't.
I dont think there is a QB on the roster who wins the job. It's going to be who sucks the least
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @ Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
I don't think Cousins sucks, I just think he has more bad games than the upper tier QBs which can be the difference between making the playoffs and sitting at home in January.
I don't care where his year end stats put him in the QB rankings... he was brought in to put this team (and the roster we had coming off an NFCCG) over the top. Three years later, we have one playoff appearance (and a very satisfying playoff victory over the Saints) to show for it. Looks an awful lot like his time in Washington (lots of stats but light on wins).
If the Vikings don't make the playoffs this year, I don't think we'll see another extension for Cousins.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
I feel similarly, but I also want to see how he comes out of the gate this season. He was undeniably part of the problem early last season, albeit a problem that was team-wide.
If he steps forward this season, has November form early on, the offense could out-perform the 98ers.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @ Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
I don't think Cousins sucks, I just think he has more bad games than the upper tier QBs which can be the difference between making the playoffs and sitting at home in January.
I don't care where his year end stats put him in the QB rankings... he was brought in to put this team (and the roster we had coming off an NFCCG) over the top. Three years later, we have one playoff appearance (and a very satisfying playoff victory over the Saints) to show for it. Looks an awful lot like his time in Washington (lots of stats but light on wins).
If the Vikings don't make the playoffs this year, I don't think we'll see another extension for Cousins.
I think that Cousins having an o-line in the bottom quarter of the league during his time on the team matters a good bit, especially when the middle of the line has been such a glaring weakness. Show me another QB that survives constant A-gap pressure...because I can't name one.
The team has had glaring weaknesses to overcome forever, and that's maybe the heart of the "curse": always keeping a few bullets in the gun to shoot ourselves in the foot. In the case of Cousins, he helped us beat Brees in his house during the playoffs, but SF was able to run right through our lines on both sides of the ball.
Last season, that aspect was even worse.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @ Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
I don't think Cousins sucks, I just think he has more bad games than the upper tier QBs which can be the difference between making the playoffs and sitting at home in January.
I don't care where his year end stats put him in the QB rankings... he was brought in to put this team (and the roster we had coming off an NFCCG) over the top. Three years later, we have one playoff appearance (and a very satisfying playoff victory over the Saints) to show for it. Looks an awful lot like his time in Washington (lots of stats but light on wins).
If the Vikings don't make the playoffs this year, I don't think we'll see another extension for Cousins.
For me it still depends on how it all happens. I would agree with you if you could point to Cousins as a part of the reason we didn't make the playoffs. And if we don't, chances are we can find something to blame on the QB.
But there's also the chance the Cousins puts up ridiculous numbers, wins several games for us, wins MVP and we miss the playoffs due to injuries or something.
Just not a fan of declaring a "if/then" scenario before we know the context.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ Wetlander said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @ Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
I don't think Cousins sucks, I just think he has more bad games than the upper tier QBs which can be the difference between making the playoffs and sitting at home in January.
I don't care where his year end stats put him in the QB rankings... he was brought in to put this team (and the roster we had coming off an NFCCG) over the top. Three years later, we have one playoff appearance (and a very satisfying playoff victory over the Saints) to show for it. Looks an awful lot like his time in Washington (lots of stats but light on wins).
If the Vikings don't make the playoffs this year, I don't think we'll see another extension for Cousins.
For me it still depends on how it all happens. I would agree with you if you could point to Cousins as a part of the reason we didn't make the playoffs. And if we don't, chances are we can find something to blame on the QB.
But there's also the chance the Cousins puts up ridiculous numbers, wins several games for us, wins MVP and we miss the playoffs due to injuries or something.
Just not a fan of declaring a "if/then" scenario before we know the context.
You are doing the same thing saying IF Cousins puts up ridiculous numbers, then we should extend him regardless of what happens. The problem with this thinking is Cousins isn't Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, or Russell Wilson. If we make him the focal point of our offense, it probably means a) we are losing or trailing more games than not b) we aren't giving Dalvin the ball enough and/or c) our defense is playing like 2020 instead of the top tier version we saw from 2015-2019.
Ideally, Kirk has good numbers (like 2019 when he had like 26 TDs and 6 INTs) and we win a bunch of games because we're running the ball good with Dalvin and playing good defense. The most successful teams under Zimmer are exactly that... QB moves the chains with smart throws, picks up chunk plays off play-action, and we lean on a strong running game and good defense to close out games.
That's our formula for success, not having Kirk throw it 550+ times a season so he can give us the "Kirk Special" of 30-ish TDs and 12-13 INTs and a 7-8 win season.
I don’t think the bar is SB or bust for Cousins, because a
SB isn’t a given even if you have a great team.
That said, I don’t think Cousins gets an extension unless
there’s a serious wow factor going on.
If every QB ranking list is putting him at #10-#15 at the end of the
year, I don’t think that’s a good sign for his future here. You need your QB to tilt the field, and if
Cousins isn’t tilting the field, you need to find one who can.
Cousins isn’t going to outright suck for an entire year, as
MaroonBells tried to caricaturize, but if a better or cheaper QB would have won
an extra 2-3 games throughout the season, by making a handful of impact plays
or by being consistently a little bit better or by inspiring his teammates to
play a little harder, that’s a massive difference.
Quote: @Wetlander said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ Wetlander said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ StickyBun said:
@ medaille said:
@ StickyBun said:
I have this weird feeling about Mond. There's something about him when I watch his videos. He's got the temperament for the position. He's completely composed under pressure. I know he can be inaccurate and there's other things to work on, but I don't know....there's something.
I like Mond too. I hope Cousins and the Vikes have a great year, but if we have to move on, I think Mond has a lot of the intangibles you'd want and could be an under the radar guy that has success.
Ideally, I'd like to see Cousins for two more years (unless he wins a Super Bowl) and then if that doesn't happen, its Mond.
You can't put that burden on Cousins. Winning is a team thing. It's about talent (check), being healthy (?) and getting lucky (?). If Cousins puts up MVP numbers the next two years and the Vikings don't win a championship due to poor game planning, key injuries, or just the purple curse we all know too well, there will be plenty of folks calling for Mond. But I'm still going to lobby for an extension for Cousins.
But you know how this goes: the QB always gets more blame then he should. And he won't win games like the modern NFL QB does, so the fans are already skeptical. I could see the Vikings drafting a QB again in this next Draft. Why not? Let the best QB succeed.
Depends on what we get from Cousins. If @ Wetlander is right and he sucks, then that QB will be the 1st rounder. In fact, at that point, I'd give up everything to move up for whatever QB we like. As much as I like Mond and thought he was the best among the tier 2 QBs, it would be a pretty big surprise if he ended up becoming a long-term starter in this league.
I don't think Cousins sucks, I just think he has more bad games than the upper tier QBs which can be the difference between making the playoffs and sitting at home in January.
I don't care where his year end stats put him in the QB rankings... he was brought in to put this team (and the roster we had coming off an NFCCG) over the top. Three years later, we have one playoff appearance (and a very satisfying playoff victory over the Saints) to show for it. Looks an awful lot like his time in Washington (lots of stats but light on wins).
If the Vikings don't make the playoffs this year, I don't think we'll see another extension for Cousins.
For me it still depends on how it all happens. I would agree with you if you could point to Cousins as a part of the reason we didn't make the playoffs. And if we don't, chances are we can find something to blame on the QB.
But there's also the chance the Cousins puts up ridiculous numbers, wins several games for us, wins MVP and we miss the playoffs due to injuries or something.
Just not a fan of declaring a "if/then" scenario before we know the context.
You are doing the same thing saying IF Cousins puts up ridiculous numbers, then we should extend him regardless of what happens. The problem with this thinking is Cousins isn't Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, or Russell Wilson. If we make him the focal point of our offense, it probably means a) we are losing or trailing more games than not b) we aren't giving Dalvin the ball enough and/or c) our defense is playing like 2020 instead of the top tier version we saw from 2015-2019.
Ideally, Kirk has good numbers (like 2019 when he had like 26 TDs and 6 INTs) and we win a bunch of games because we're running the ball good with Dalvin and playing good defense. The most successful teams under Zimmer are exactly that... QB moves the chains with smart throws, picks up chunk plays off play-action, and we lean on a strong running game and good defense to close out games.
That's our formula for success, not having Kirk throw it 550+ times a season so he can give us the "Kirk Special" of 30-ish TDs and 12-13 INTs and a 7-8 win season.
Again, for me it's not as much about the numbers as it is about his performance. They don't always match. For example, he could put up 40 TDs and 5 INTs, but if those 5 INTs come at crucial points in the game, then that's a different story. Likewise, if those 5 INTs are inconsequential (hail marys, tipped balls, etc) and the bulk of the TDs are game winners, that's another story still. Same numbers, different story, which would (and should) result in a different decision come contract time.
I just think it's wise, prudent actually, to see what he does before making a blanket statement about his extension pivoting on a team outcome.
Also think we'll see a much more dynamic offense this year, much like the Seahawks (a run-first team) did with Wilson last year. Interesting thing is that for weeks, Wilson was considered an MVP frontrunner. If you look at his numbers (in his "new" offense), they were nearly identical to Cousins', who was still playing in the Vikings run-heavy offense (yes, padded due in large part to our terrible defense). But with a better defense will the Vikings still unleash Cousins? If so, what will Cousins unleashed look like? I'm anxious to find out.
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