Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
OK, Mr. Raekwon Davis at 22, I'll answer your question. Because it gives us a better chance to win.
Josh Kline primarily played left guard in college,... so, not only do the Vikings have other plans at right guard, but they also must feel good about their options at left guard as well. Promoting Samia to starter on the right side and moving Kline to the left would have made a lot of sense. At this point, it is safe to say the Vikings have a plan they like. Cleveland, Rieff, Bradberry, Samia, O'Neil could be the starting 5 as of right now, but if that was the plan, the Vikings could save more money but cutting Rieff and resigning Kline to be the left guard. My gut tells me though that the Vikings must like Udoh and he could find himself in the mix for a starting 5 spot. The question is how long will the Vikings want to keep pay Rieff big bucks?
Quote: @Carl Knowles said:
Josh Kline primarily played left guard in college,... so, not only do the Vikings have other plans at right guard, but they also must feel good about their options at left guard as well. Promoting Samia to starter on the right side and moving Kline to the left would have made a lot of sense. At this point, it is safe to say the Vikings have a plan they like. Cleveland, Rieff, Bradberry, Samia, O'Neil could be the starting 5 as of right now, but if that was the plan, the Vikings could save more money but cutting Rieff and resigning Kline to be the left guard. My gut tells me though that the Vikings must like Udoh and he could find himself in the mix for a starting 5 spot. The question is how long will the Vikings want to keep pay Rieff big bucks?
Reiff is definitely on the bubble, but the Vikings would be wise to first see what they have Cleveland, Udoh, Collins at LG, and Rashod Hill. There's just too many question marks to release him now. It's not out of the question that Cleveland just isn't ready. I'm confident he was a good pick and has a bright future, but many rookie tackles, even 1st rounders, take a year. Andre Dillard didn't start a game.
There's a chance that Reiff is the best LT option we have. He might also be the best LG option we have.
Quote: @MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
OK, Mr. Raekwon Davis at 22, I'll answer your question. Because it gives us a better chance to win.
The Vikings are not going to be able to stop teams with the current set of corners. Last year, Griffen played 848 snaps and Odenigbo played 368. I hope Odenigbo can do better while playing several hundred more snaps but that remains to be seen.
I think Cleveland can do a good enough job.
I do several mocks every offseason and I mix them up a lot. Sometimes I take different players just to see. You can grab anyone you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.
I hope I'm wrong, but every time I hear from a big mouth OL, I harken back to Alex Boone...
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
OK, Mr. Raekwon Davis at 22, I'll answer your question. Because it gives us a better chance to win.
The Vikings are not going to be able to stop teams with the current set of corners. Last year, Griffen played 848 snaps and Odenigbo played 368. I hope Odenigbo can do better while playing several hundred more snaps but that remains to be seen.
I think Cleveland can do a good enough job.
I do several mocks every offseason and I mix them up a lot. Sometimes I take different players just to see. You can grab anyone you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.
Remember when BRob replaced Ray Edwards? Lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. Then when Hunter replaced BRob, lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. I'm not going too far out on a limb by saying, I think Odenigbo will be able to handle increased snaps.
Quote: @"BarrNone55" said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
OK, Mr. Raekwon Davis at 22, I'll answer your question. Because it gives us a better chance to win.
The Vikings are not going to be able to stop teams with the current set of corners. Last year, Griffen played 848 snaps and Odenigbo played 368. I hope Odenigbo can do better while playing several hundred more snaps but that remains to be seen.
I think Cleveland can do a good enough job.
I do several mocks every offseason and I mix them up a lot. Sometimes I take different players just to see. You can grab anyone you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.
Remember when BRob replaced Ray Edwards? Lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. Then when Hunter replaced BRob, lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. I'm not going too far out on a limb by saying, I think Odenigbo will be able to handle increased snaps.
Odenigbo might.
For the record, BRob played 838 snaps in 2016 & 532 snaps in 2017.
Hunter played 600 snaps in 2016 & 772 snaps in 2017.
There are no snap counts before 2012 so hard to say how much BRob played before taking over in 2011 but he was better than Odenigbo. IMO.
I hope Odenigbo does better but much of the positivity for next season is based on hoping several younger players perform well.
Quote: @MarkSP18 said:
@"BarrNone55" said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ MaroonBells said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
OK, Mr. Raekwon Davis at 22, I'll answer your question. Because it gives us a better chance to win.
The Vikings are not going to be able to stop teams with the current set of corners. Last year, Griffen played 848 snaps and Odenigbo played 368. I hope Odenigbo can do better while playing several hundred more snaps but that remains to be seen.
I think Cleveland can do a good enough job.
I do several mocks every offseason and I mix them up a lot. Sometimes I take different players just to see. You can grab anyone you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.
Remember when BRob replaced Ray Edwards? Lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. Then when Hunter replaced BRob, lots of folks said the same thing about increased snaps. I'm not going too far out on a limb by saying, I think Odenigbo will be able to handle increased snaps.
Odenigbo might.
For the record, BRob played 838 snaps in 2016 & 532 snaps in 2017.
Hunter played 600 snaps in 2016 & 772 snaps in 2017.
There are no snap counts before 2012 so hard to say how much BRob played before taking over in 2011 but he was better than Odenigbo. IMO.
I hope Odenigbo does better but much of the positivity for next season is based on hoping several younger players perform well.
I agree that a lot is based on these young players coming in and filling holes on the roster right away. With that said I dont know of another coaching staff in the league that I would trust more in getting these young players coached up to play those meaningful snaps quickly then Zimmer/Kubiak. The Vikings have a really solid veteran staff of well respected coaches and I think they will be up to the task.
S'more Samia...
I lot of people last year wondered--if he was so good--why didn't he replace Elflein at left guard?
I was listening to a scout the other day talking about how stupid it was NFL teams were considering moving Isaiah Wilson to left tackle. He said Wilson played on the right his entire life--college, high school, Pop Warner. If a guy is used to moving around you can move him around. But you don't move a guy like that.
I tend to think Samia is a right-side-only guy and that's why he didn't replaced Elf. Right side is all he played at OU. Started at RT his freshman year, then moved inside to RG and stayed there for 3 years. So if Kline were the one struggling we probably would've seen Samia last year. Moving him to the left may not have been an option.
https://twitter.com/BrandonThornNFL/stat...48453?s=20
Quote: @JimmyinSD said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
@ medaille said:
@ MarkSP18 said:
The Vikings need to cut or trade Reiff. The Chargers could be a team interested as all the have is Sam Tevi and Trey Pipkins opposite Byran Bulaga.
The Vikings need to save Reiff's cap space to use in better places. After the sign the rookies they will have about 8.75 mil in cap space.
Add in the 8.8 mil for getting rid of Reiff and they now are at about 17.5 mil in cap space.
What can they do with that? Carry it over to 2021 or use it to extend Cook two years.
I would essentially make the next 3 years be for 24 mil with incentives based on snaps played and awards.
They could wait on Cook too.
Next year, O'Neill should be extended with a 5 year 75 mil deal (or thereabouts).
They could give him a 15 mil roster bonus (which is all the cap space carried over) and a 5 mil signing bonus.
His salary for 2021 of $1,080,095 would stay the same.
His salaries from 2022 thru 2025 would be 11, 14, 15, & 15 mil.
His cap hits would be 17.4 in 2021, 12, 15, 16, & 16 mil.
The cap savings from getting rid of an average at his very best Reiff is important.
Ezra Cleveland needs to start from day one. If he struggles they can use Hill and Udoh.
I think next year is a rebuild of sorts and I do not think the inexperienced corners, interior OL, and defensive ends will prove good enough to truly contend for the title.
Keeping Reiff at his current salary is just dumb.
If they do keep him, how many will be saying he needs to go next year or will there still be reasons offered why the Vikings should absorb his 13 mil cap hit next year?
Makes too much sense to move on and go with the YOUTS.
I disagree with this a lot. Getting rid of Reiff is throwing in the towel on 2020. Going into 2020 with 3 question marks on the OLine would be nuts.
You really believe they have a chance next year? There will be at least 2 question marks on the line according to you. The corners will be very raw.
I would not bet any money on the Vikings even making the playoffs.
Keeping Reiff and not allowing Cleveland to get the experience he needs is a waste of time and 11 mil in cap space.
Let me ask you this. Are you a proponent of allowing Reiff to stick around in 2021 too?
If not, then why wait one season to cut him?
If this year was a throw away they needed to part ways with cousins then too. Reiff is the 2nd best OL we have currently and his contract isnt out of line for his performance, it's insane to get rid of him until you have at least seen if Cleveland can play at this level.
Either go all in on a rebuild or dont do it, half assing shit leads to years and years of mediocrity.
It's never going to be a "total throwaway" year unless they reset GM and HC. I understand your stance and kind of agree, but I think the Vikings are operating under 3 principles:
1. Spielman's job is dependent on proving his choice of Cousins was correct (can win or contend for SB).
2. There are serious doubts the 2020 season will be played.3. The team has decided to cut salary costs (especially for 2020, given #2).
Put another way, I think they are, as you put it, half-assing their rebuild/retool, but think they can sneak it into a season that will be shortened or canceled.
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