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Minnesota Vikings
What would the trade value be for Kirk Cousins and Dalvin Cook? I'd be finding out. Keeping this team together will be impossible given the cap crunch and, furthermore, it would be misguided. This front office needs to embrace creative ideas and be open to remaking the roster now, because a year from now it will only be much worse.
Worse? He's probably right.
Vikes have some decisions and moves they have to make.
Quote: @jargomcfargo said:
@ pumpf said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
If LaConfora is on acid, I must be having a flashback, because I agree with his basic idea, just not the way he would go about it.
I believe the Vikings should draft their QB of the future now. I'm not talking about hoping some QB slides down the draft board to 25. They should spend the draft capital to move up and get the QB they think will be the best NFL pro available. They would need to make the trades necessary to get the additional draft capital to move up. That probably wouldn't be Cook or Cousins, but could be. Fiscally they are stuck with Cousins. But a year of mentoring the new QB would be ideal.
If they choose to move up to get Herbert, they may not need to trade anyone, but he isn't going to slide to 25.
I'm not in favor of taking a QB in later rounds and hoping he will develop into a diamond in the rough. It occasionally happens but is rare, and usually a poor decision.
That's what I hope for. What will likely happen is extending Kirk and trying to patch holes with leftover inexpensive free agents and draft picks. I hope it works, but I feel like it will be more of the same. A team that is above average but not a true contender. Hope I'm wrong.
Cousins has improved each year he has been with the Vikings. If he improved again (better stats... winning more games that "he's" not supposed to win), then what? Release him? He's not very far away from being a "franchise" QB (if he's not already). And we're supposed to roll alot of dice (it's not like we have a top-5 pick) to try and find the next Mahomes or L. Jackson? The only way that the risk would be worth it... is if we knew- for sure- that the QB we get WILL be the next Mahomes. And there's no way to know that... which is why I wouldn't bet the farm on landing one.
That is entirely possible. I hope you are right. If Cousins wins you pay the big bucks to extend him. Make him earn it.
But that's not how it will go. They will extend him now and at the end of the season you will be looking to draft the future if things don't work out. After all, Cousins wasn't an unknown and they rolled the dice on him.
It's too bad he needs a great O-line to win it all. If he was as good as Keenum was on off script plays, the Vikings would be very hard to beat. If Keenum had the arm and accuracy Cousins has, he would still be here. He sure was Houdini several times.
I just want a championship and I don't see it happening by following the same coarse. Time will tell.
But if Case could win without having the necessary pieces around him (by going "off script"), why hasn't he been successful anywhere else (before or after MN)? I think that you're right- that, if Cousins had more elusiveness to him, we would be better off. But being elusive, by itself, doesn't win games (or put up points). And it's in (some of) those "other" things that Cousins surpasses Keenum. Yeah, it would be nice if we could have the best characteristics of each player (without their weaknesses); but that's not reality. Case was elusive; but, for most of his career, he has not been considered a good QB. Cousins is a good QB... but he's not elusive (and, perhaps, lacks pocket-awareness). Which of their skill-sets is more likely to lead to long-term success? My vote would be for Cousins, since he has been "good" (although not "great") at multiple places (despite various negative circumstances), rather than Case, who has been good- for one year in MN- but, otherwise, has had an average (to below average) career.
Again: if we could know that a player like Mahomes would fall into our laps, I'd dump Cousins in a heart-beat (assuming the coaching staff wouldn't screw him up in some way). But since that is mostly unlikely to happen, Cousins gives us the best chance to win (imo).
Quote: @FSUVike said:
You can't force it. Herbert and Love are miles from a sure thing. Herbert missed open guys and takes the easy option so frequently he makes Cousins look like a gunslinger. You can't teach aggressiveness, and Justin doesn't have it. Love has talent but major consistency issues. I'd take him before Herbert because of the higher ceiling. But only if he falls into the late teens.
A lot of you just can't seem to accept the FACT that Rick & Mike went All In on Cousins. There is no Plan B. Frankly, if Kirk isn't the solution the last guys I want picking his successor are those two.
The team will either play great next year and extend everyone, or they won't and it's time for Regime Change. Do you really want a new GM and HC to inherit someone they have zero invested in ala Rosen in Arizona or Haskins in Washington? The answer is No.
Conceptually I agree with this...
That said, there is a lot of local smoke about an extension for KC prior to 3/18... I honestly dont see the Wilf's taking the stance of waiting for 2021 and keeping RS/MZ/KC all kinda hanging out there.
Next 2 weeks are going to be incredibly interesting - most in years.
NFL free agency kicks off March 18, but you have to wonder why we aren’t hearing anything about the future of Vikings quarterback Kirk Cousins even though we are now more than a month past the Super Bowl.
Cousins has a year left on his deal, but there is no question that the club has to be considering all options when it comes to their signal caller.
This might seem crazy, but would the Vikings drop Cousins when his contract expires and go with former Vikings quarterback Teddy Bridgewater from New Orleans, who would have a much smaller price tag?
With the news that Drew Brees is going to return to the Saints, the fact is that Bridgewater, who is an unrestricted free agent, could be available.
Still the stats seem to indicate that there’s no way the Vikings will let Cousins go, even after his gigantic three-year, $84 million deal is up.
In the two seasons that Cousins has been in Minnesota, he ranks sixth in the NFL in passer rating at 103.0 — trailing only Brees, Patrick Mahomes, Russell Wilson, Ryan Tannehill and Lamar Jackson.
His completion percentage of 69.71 is second in the league over the past two seasons behind only Brees.
And his 56 touchdown passes trail only Mahomes, Wilson, Matt Ryan and Brees.
The fact is that Cousins has earned the contract the Vikings gave him.
But can they afford to pay him that kind of money going forward?
Looking to the 2021 season, as their salary cap currently stands, the Vikings have no way to afford Cousins if he’s going to earn $31 million like he will this season.
Vikings' 2020 salary cap table
They already owe $161 million to just 31 players, and they need to fill out a 53 man roster.
If they were to pay Cousins $31 million in 2021, their salary cap would be at $192 million with 21 players left to sign
http://www.startribune.com/can-the-vikin...568507602/
Quote: @pumpf said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
@ pumpf said:
@ jargomcfargo said:
If LaConfora is on acid, I must be having a flashback, because I agree with his basic idea, just not the way he would go about it.
I believe the Vikings should draft their QB of the future now. I'm not talking about hoping some QB slides down the draft board to 25. They should spend the draft capital to move up and get the QB they think will be the best NFL pro available. They would need to make the trades necessary to get the additional draft capital to move up. That probably wouldn't be Cook or Cousins, but could be. Fiscally they are stuck with Cousins. But a year of mentoring the new QB would be ideal.
If they choose to move up to get Herbert, they may not need to trade anyone, but he isn't going to slide to 25.
I'm not in favor of taking a QB in later rounds and hoping he will develop into a diamond in the rough. It occasionally happens but is rare, and usually a poor decision.
That's what I hope for. What will likely happen is extending Kirk and trying to patch holes with leftover inexpensive free agents and draft picks. I hope it works, but I feel like it will be more of the same. A team that is above average but not a true contender. Hope I'm wrong.
Cousins has improved each year he has been with the Vikings. If he improved again (better stats... winning more games that "he's" not supposed to win), then what? Release him? He's not very far away from being a "franchise" QB (if he's not already). And we're supposed to roll alot of dice (it's not like we have a top-5 pick) to try and find the next Mahomes or L. Jackson? The only way that the risk would be worth it... is if we knew- for sure- that the QB we get WILL be the next Mahomes. And there's no way to know that... which is why I wouldn't bet the farm on landing one.
That is entirely possible. I hope you are right. If Cousins wins you pay the big bucks to extend him. Make him earn it.
But that's not how it will go. They will extend him now and at the end of the season you will be looking to draft the future if things don't work out. After all, Cousins wasn't an unknown and they rolled the dice on him.
It's too bad he needs a great O-line to win it all. If he was as good as Keenum was on off script plays, the Vikings would be very hard to beat. If Keenum had the arm and accuracy Cousins has, he would still be here. He sure was Houdini several times.
I just want a championship and I don't see it happening by following the same coarse. Time will tell.
But if Case could win without having the necessary pieces around him (by going "off script"), why hasn't he been successful anywhere else (before or after MN)? I think that you're right- that, if Cousins had more elusiveness to him, we would be better off. But being elusive, by itself, doesn't win games (or put up points). And it's in (some of) those "other" things that Cousins surpasses Keenum. Yeah, it would be nice if we could have the best characteristics of each player (without their weaknesses); but that's not reality. Case was elusive; but, for most of his career, he has not been considered a good QB. Cousins is a good QB... but he's not elusive (and, perhaps, lacks pocket-awareness). Which of their skill-sets is more likely to lead to long-term success? My vote would be for Cousins, since he has been "good" (although not "great") at multiple places (despite various negative circumstances), rather than Case, who has been good- for one year in MN- but, otherwise, has had an average (to below average) career.
Again: if we could know that a player like Mahomes would fall into our laps, I'd dump Cousins in a heart-beat (assuming the coaching staff wouldn't screw him up in some way). But since that is mostly unlikely to happen, Cousins gives us the best chance to win (imo).
throw money into the equation though... if you can get Case performance and have the coin left over to create a much much better OL, that will improve not only Case, but also the running game. If Capn Kirk thinks he needs 33 or more AVG going forward that will hurt the team around him and consequently lower his effectiveness as well. IMO the only way I would continue on with Kirk is if he realizes that his success is a lot about a supporting cast and he shouldnt be paid like he can carry an offense, and if he wants to have success he needs to do more than buy isotoner gloves for his linemen... he needs to leave a little cheddar in the kitty for them as well.
Quote: @purplefaithful said:
@ FSUVike said:
You can't force it. Herbert and Love are miles from a sure thing. Herbert missed open guys and takes the easy option so frequently he makes Cousins look like a gunslinger. You can't teach aggressiveness, and Justin doesn't have it. Love has talent but major consistency issues. I'd take him before Herbert because of the higher ceiling. But only if he falls into the late teens.
A lot of you just can't seem to accept the FACT that Rick & Mike went All In on Cousins. There is no Plan B. Frankly, if Kirk isn't the solution the last guys I want picking his successor are those two.
The team will either play great next year and extend everyone, or they won't and it's time for Regime Change. Do you really want a new GM and HC to inherit someone they have zero invested in ala Rosen in Arizona or Haskins in Washington? The answer is No.
Conceptually I agree with this...
That said, there is a lot of local smoke about an extension for KC prior to 3/18... I honestly dont see the Wilf's taking the stance of waiting for 2021 and keeping RS/MZ/KC all kinda hanging out there.
Next 2 weeks are going to be incredibly interesting - most in years.
FSU is completely right about this - Spielman took numerous swings at finding a winning QB and failed, and convincing the Wilfs that he knew Cousins would finally be "the one" most likely included a clause to the effect of, "He better be, or you're gone". So why would Spielman pick a "QB of the future"? If the team needs that new QB (because Cousins didn't win next year), he's helping the next GM, and using a draft pick that could potentially improve Cousins' performance in 2020.
Purplefaithful, maybe the Vikings are suggesting an extension for Cousins, but it could be in the nature of the team saying, "Hey Kirk, we could turn your remaining 1 year of $31M guaranteed into something over two years, lower your cap hit in 2020 and spread money out a bit..." Even if the Wilfs think 2020 might be the end of this regime they could want to keep Cousins in 2021 as a "bridge" for a rookie.
But does Cousins want that? He bet on himself by playing on a one-year franchise deal twice. And if he has any inkling that Spielman and Zimmer could be gone next year, why would he want to extend himself into a franchise's rebuild period?
Quote: @FSUVike said:
You can't force it. Herbert and Love are miles from a sure thing. Herbert missed open guys and takes the easy option so frequently he makes Cousins look like a gunslinger. You can't teach aggressiveness, and Justin doesn't have it. Love has talent but major consistency issues. I'd take him before Herbert because of the higher ceiling. But only if he falls into the late teens.
A lot of you just can't seem to accept the FACT that Rick & Mike went All In on Cousins. There is no Plan B. Frankly, if Kirk isn't the solution the last guys I want picking his successor are those two.
The team will either play great next year and extend everyone, or they won't and it's time for Regime Change. Do you really want a new GM and HC to inherit someone they have zero invested in ala Rosen in Arizona or Haskins in Washington? The answer is No.
I'm not a draftnik and almost never say anything about it but the people I do listen to are saying Herbert will be a bust. Big arm that fools people into overlooking all the red flags.
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